HEATHROW
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I would love to be on a 09L departure, in 22 years flying from LHR, I have never been on one. I did see three heavies depart off 09L last year during snow days when the Southern runway was closed. Just ignore Cassandra and those who specialise in 100% negative one liners, they don't have anything worth contributing beyond a glass half empty view. (and smashed on the floor and bombed by a drone before being ground to dust and scattered to the four winds. Bit negative, wonder how some people face getting out of bed?)
Join Date: Oct 2000
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Well, I've cleared a fair number for take-off from 09L (and 10L before that) but they weren't too frequent.. One reason for not using 09L for take off, way back long ago, was the presence of a Marconi S264 radar antenna close to the holding point.
The old route from the A and B cul-de-sacs to 09R was via the inner, west about. If there was a gap in the landers we'd sneak the odd BAC-111 away from Block 11 (God only knows what that is called now).
The old route from the A and B cul-de-sacs to 09R was via the inner, west about. If there was a gap in the landers we'd sneak the odd BAC-111 away from Block 11 (God only knows what that is called now).
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Good old Skippy. negative patronising comments are normally your domain. And by the volume of text, some have more time on their hands than others. You stick to spotting, there is a forum somewhere for you.
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Well 'CabinCrewe' you're not exactly redeeming yourself by your attitude either are you?
I've been flying out of Heathrow for over 30 years and I've never seen an 10L/09L take-off, so it's relative rarity does make it interesting to some PPRuNe lurkers.
I've been flying out of Heathrow for over 30 years and I've never seen an 10L/09L take-off, so it's relative rarity does make it interesting to some PPRuNe lurkers.
Last edited by airsmiles; 10th Mar 2013 at 06:47.
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Well with the southern runway resurfacing this year, anyone desperate to see a 09L departure will have their chance. The plan, as I understand it, is to go SRO from 2230 each night, and if the airport is operating on easterlies, that only leaves one option.
Well with the southern runway resurfacing this year, anyone desperate to see a 09L departure will have their chance. The plan, as I understand it, is to go SRO from 2230 each night, and if the airport is operating on easterlies, that only leaves one option.
The confusion isn't helped by the rather strange statement that "from Friday evening to Sunday morning runway alternation will operate as normal: southern runway one week, northern the next week" - that's not how normal night-time alternation actually works at Heathrow.
Heathrow Noise: Runway resurfacing 2013-2014
Last edited by DaveReidUK; 11th Mar 2013 at 22:50.
Proposal for 7,500m runway at Heathrow
You may have seen the Jock Lowe's proposal to extend the two LHR runways to 7,500m which I suppose would be instead of idea for close parallels. I'm not a pilot myself but I would have thought that exercising a go around whilst another aircraft was taking off further down the runway could be interesting, to say the least. I'm not sure how it compares with 'Land & hold short' practised at airports such as O'Hare. What do others think and does it make any sense at all?
What do others think and does it make any sense at all?
So, allowing for RESAs, we're not just talking about diverting the M25, but also the A30, not to mention the almost complete destruction of Cranford and probably parts of Colnbrook too.
I'm not sure how it compares with 'Land & hold short' practised at airports such as O'Hare.
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LHR northern runway RETs
The plan for the approved Southern runway RETs can be found here http://w09.hillingdon.gov.uk/images/...20Taxiways.pdf
The proposals for the northern runway taxiways are due to be submitted to Hillingdon Council this month (March).
The proposals for the northern runway taxiways are due to be submitted to Hillingdon Council this month (March).
The proposals for the northern runway taxiways are due to be submitted to Hillingdon Council this month (March).
http://www.heathrowairport.com/stati...Appendix_H.pdf
Page 10.
Join Date: Aug 2012
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@ DaveReidUK
The BAA / Hillingdon approved drawing shows the final approved RETs and compensatory redundant pavement breakout areas; as such slightly different to your initial plan.
The northern runway taxiway 09L works for the implementation of the abolition of the Cranford Agreement, will have to include an environmental assessment and noise barriers to properties. I believe there are a number of councils opposed, which may result in the application going to the new Infrastructure Planning Commission.
What some of us will be looking out for, are any proposals to add 400m taxiways to the ends of 27L and 27R; when T5 was built such taxiways were added to 09L and 09R.
The BAA / Hillingdon approved drawing shows the final approved RETs and compensatory redundant pavement breakout areas; as such slightly different to your initial plan.
The northern runway taxiway 09L works for the implementation of the abolition of the Cranford Agreement, will have to include an environmental assessment and noise barriers to properties. I believe there are a number of councils opposed, which may result in the application going to the new Infrastructure Planning Commission.
What some of us will be looking out for, are any proposals to add 400m taxiways to the ends of 27L and 27R; when T5 was built such taxiways were added to 09L and 09R.
Last edited by Windsorian; 22nd Mar 2013 at 10:16. Reason: spelling correction
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What some of us will be looking out for, are any proposals to add 400m taxiways to the ends of 27L and 27R; when T5 was built such taxiways were added to 09L and 09R.
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If you go to the LHR / NATs site NATS | AIS - Home
you will see on the holding charts for 09L and 09R that at the time T5 was constructed taxiways were added to the western ends of the main runways. Officially these are not part of the main runways, which begin with the pedestrian crossing type markings immediately before the marked runway numbers.
There are at present no similar taxiway extensions to 27L and 27R, though I understand Heathrow (BAA) are planning such extensions after a rearrangement of the eastern surface car parks takes place.
you will see on the holding charts for 09L and 09R that at the time T5 was constructed taxiways were added to the western ends of the main runways. Officially these are not part of the main runways, which begin with the pedestrian crossing type markings immediately before the marked runway numbers.
There are at present no similar taxiway extensions to 27L and 27R, though I understand Heathrow (BAA) are planning such extensions after a rearrangement of the eastern surface car parks takes place.
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The displaced thresholds on 09L and 09R have always been there, they were not added during the T5 construction.
There are discussions ongoing regarding the benefits and impacts of displacing the westerly thresholds.
There are discussions ongoing regarding the benefits and impacts of displacing the westerly thresholds.
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Mr Windsorian, they most certainly are part of the main runway as aircraft line up well before what are called "piano keys" rather than zebra crossings. The displacement is for landing.
What 400m taxiways? How in the name of God does a new taxiway upset the neighbours. The most noticeable property on the 09L side is Waterside, the home of BA. Anyhoo, typically British is to spend your time whining and trying to find a billion reasons NOT to do something. Still keeps those who ballses it up at school in some overpaid job I suppose.
Been travelling a lot recently, other countries tend to laugh at our navel gazing NIMBY-ism.
Incidentally, LHR has had full length parallel taxiways since Pontius was a cadet.
What 400m taxiways? How in the name of God does a new taxiway upset the neighbours. The most noticeable property on the 09L side is Waterside, the home of BA. Anyhoo, typically British is to spend your time whining and trying to find a billion reasons NOT to do something. Still keeps those who ballses it up at school in some overpaid job I suppose.
Been travelling a lot recently, other countries tend to laugh at our navel gazing NIMBY-ism.
Incidentally, LHR has had full length parallel taxiways since Pontius was a cadet.
Last edited by Skipness One Echo; 22nd Mar 2013 at 10:52.
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LHR taxiway extentions
@Gonzo
I was under the impression the western taxiway extensions for 09L & 09R were rebuilt to a higher specification during the construction of T5; I shall check the old photos.
@Skipness One Echo
I think your use of piano keys rather than zebra crossing markings is pure pretentiousness on your part; anyway all the markings are the same length!
The object of planning applications is to allow people to object; something the Nazi Party did not agree with! The recent 09R RETs application, even under permitted development rights, did not receive any objections and was approved by the LHR planning authority (Hillingdon BC).
However the Cranford abolition works, with far more planes taking off from 09L, may well impact on local residents particularly in the Longford and Cranford areas; this is the reason for the enviromental impact assessment requirement and almost certainly additional noise barriers.
My use of the words 400m eastern taxiway extensions to 27R and 27L was to remove any suggestion that Heathrow were planning extensions to the main runways. Perhaps you and Gonzo could clear up what precisely is being proposed?
I was under the impression the western taxiway extensions for 09L & 09R were rebuilt to a higher specification during the construction of T5; I shall check the old photos.
@Skipness One Echo
I think your use of piano keys rather than zebra crossing markings is pure pretentiousness on your part; anyway all the markings are the same length!
The object of planning applications is to allow people to object; something the Nazi Party did not agree with! The recent 09R RETs application, even under permitted development rights, did not receive any objections and was approved by the LHR planning authority (Hillingdon BC).
However the Cranford abolition works, with far more planes taking off from 09L, may well impact on local residents particularly in the Longford and Cranford areas; this is the reason for the enviromental impact assessment requirement and almost certainly additional noise barriers.
My use of the words 400m eastern taxiway extensions to 27R and 27L was to remove any suggestion that Heathrow were planning extensions to the main runways. Perhaps you and Gonzo could clear up what precisely is being proposed?
Last edited by Windsorian; 22nd Mar 2013 at 11:59.
Paxing All Over The World
Windsorian
I may only be PAX but have been paxing for 47 years and followed the commecial airline business for many of those. I have never heard the stripes referred to as anything other than 'the piano keys' and that includes countries outside the UK.
I think your use of piano keys rather than zebra crossing markings is pure pretentiousness on your part; anyway all the markings are the same length!
You're right (of course) PAXboy, they're commonly referred to as "Piano Keys" and have been for years.....and if the darn things do look like a zebra crossing to the prospective user then something has gone badly wrong..........
Right, back to lurking.
Right, back to lurking.
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Windsorian,
I've worked in ATC at Heathrow for nearly 15 years now and the runways have alwas been the same length, the far western ends of the two runways have been the as long as I have worked there, I promise, the displaced thresholds did not move when T5 was built.
I'm not sure what you mean regarding extending the runways, the rectangles of Tarmac have always been the same length, and there are no plans to lengthen them.
I've worked in ATC at Heathrow for nearly 15 years now and the runways have alwas been the same length, the far western ends of the two runways have been the as long as I have worked there, I promise, the displaced thresholds did not move when T5 was built.
I'm not sure what you mean regarding extending the runways, the rectangles of Tarmac have always been the same length, and there are no plans to lengthen them.