DERRY/LONDONDERRY
Surely Derry isn't the only airport from which RYR operate that doesn't have a long enough runway for their larger fleet. Can we expect others to lose some services too?
Maybe Aer Arann will be tempted by a Derry to Luton if/when RYR stop coming up with excuses and move to BFS.
Maybe Aer Arann will be tempted by a Derry to Luton if/when RYR stop coming up with excuses and move to BFS.
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RYR stop coming up with excuses and move to BFS.
That is surely a very remote possibility.The thrust of RYR moving to BFS would surely be that they would wish to operate BFS-STN and that would be in direct competition with EZY. This may be the sticking point for TBI.
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I don't think there is any chance that easyJet will do LDY while they have operate from BFS.
To go back to the Ryanair issue again, this is not particular to LDY, they have also requested runway extensions at other airports on their network. It is a slightly unusual case, since in the past airlines would decide on the most suitable aircraft and powerplant combination (in terms of max thrust etc) to operate the airfields that they operate to or plan to operate to. In Ryanair's case, I understand, they have gone for the low thrust version of the CFM56 for the 737-800 (to save on operating costs), and are looking to the airport owners to extend their runways to allow the aircraft to operate.
Another example of Ryanair turning the previous way of doing things (or in MO'L's terms "bolloxology") of airlines on their head!!
To go back to the Ryanair issue again, this is not particular to LDY, they have also requested runway extensions at other airports on their network. It is a slightly unusual case, since in the past airlines would decide on the most suitable aircraft and powerplant combination (in terms of max thrust etc) to operate the airfields that they operate to or plan to operate to. In Ryanair's case, I understand, they have gone for the low thrust version of the CFM56 for the 737-800 (to save on operating costs), and are looking to the airport owners to extend their runways to allow the aircraft to operate.
Another example of Ryanair turning the previous way of doing things (or in MO'L's terms "bolloxology") of airlines on their head!!
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If Ryanair are demanding runway extensions to accomodate 737 - 800s, is there any reason why MOL cannot dip into his considerable reserves and make a contribution however small towards the expenditure required for such extensions.
Perhaps Ryanair are reluctant to commit themselves long term to any airport as they really don't know how any route will perform in the future. The situation at LDY is difficult one. Imagine the scenario where the runway extension is completed and then twelve months down the line MOL sees a more lucrative route and pulls the plug on them. A lot of very unhappy taxpayers to say the least!
Perhaps Ryanair are reluctant to commit themselves long term to any airport as they really don't know how any route will perform in the future. The situation at LDY is difficult one. Imagine the scenario where the runway extension is completed and then twelve months down the line MOL sees a more lucrative route and pulls the plug on them. A lot of very unhappy taxpayers to say the least!
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There is no reason why he couldn't dip into his reserves, but it's highly unlikely he will when he feels he doesn't have to and he hasn't had to elsewhere. MO'L's mantra is "if someone else can pay why should I".
I am sure that Derry City Council and the UK and Irish governments are concerned that Ryanair could still decide to pull the plug even if they invest in the airport, however, they will be looking at any additional services or third party aircraft maintenance work which may become possible through extending the runway. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
I am sure that Derry City Council and the UK and Irish governments are concerned that Ryanair could still decide to pull the plug even if they invest in the airport, however, they will be looking at any additional services or third party aircraft maintenance work which may become possible through extending the runway. It will be interesting to see how this plays out.
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Allmcc wrote
I cannot believe this ......I AGREE ENTIRELY with you ....off to increase my dosage .....
Imagine the scenario where the runway extension is completed and then twelve months down the line MOL sees a more lucrative route and pulls the plug on them
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Why is MOL complaining he hasn't got any 732/3's left to STN-LDY, all he has to do is put a 738 in DUB and exchange for a 732 to go to STN?? there you have it, a 732 doing STN-LDY.
mmeteesside
MME Movements
PS: If Teesside is one of FR's best performing routes (like MOL always says) then why have they waited this long to put a 738 on it???
mmeteesside
MME Movements
PS: If Teesside is one of FR's best performing routes (like MOL always says) then why have they waited this long to put a 738 on it???
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It seems strange to me for an airline to buy a fleet of aircraft that can’t operate from all of their existing airports. Even stranger that the airline expects the airports to pay for the airlines cock up
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But when new shiny planes are ordered, it puts confidence into the shareholders !! Time will tell, but I suspect, as mentioned before, some routes will close as a result of NOT having the right size aircraft. But MOL being MOL will blame something else for HIS mistake.
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LTNman
In fairness, LDY DO want to extend the runway. Thus it's not completely outrageous for FR to plan to use 738s there.
Having a runway that could accommodate a wider variety of aircraft could help them attract competitors to MOL perhaps. It's just that the locals are revolting (last time I was in Derry they were chucking rocks at the peelers) and thus planning is delayed.
Same way airlines are buying A380s but know some judge could block an airport rebuild to accommodate them on environmental grounds - it would still probably cost more to wait and see!
Finally, I'm sure 732s are a bit more of a racket on the ears than the 738s, so maybe they should put up with the extension
In fairness, LDY DO want to extend the runway. Thus it's not completely outrageous for FR to plan to use 738s there.
Having a runway that could accommodate a wider variety of aircraft could help them attract competitors to MOL perhaps. It's just that the locals are revolting (last time I was in Derry they were chucking rocks at the peelers) and thus planning is delayed.
Same way airlines are buying A380s but know some judge could block an airport rebuild to accommodate them on environmental grounds - it would still probably cost more to wait and see!
Finally, I'm sure 732s are a bit more of a racket on the ears than the 738s, so maybe they should put up with the extension
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if Ryanair were to pull out completely, what do you think would happen at LDY? Do you think other operators could be enticed from London? easy from LTN/STN or LGW? bmibaby out of LGW? or what about even bmi or Aer Lingus from Heathrow? - surely the region around LDY (don't know too much about it myself so just assuming) has a decent enough size catchment - and we all knwo how the US and Ireland links are good - maybe this could be an opportunity for a flight in to a hub rather than just lo-co????
LBA faces a similar situation when the -200s are retired. I understand RYR are reticent about using the -800 considering the limited TORA/TODA on RW32/14. Maybe they'll just have to sell around 80% of the seats in order to operate out of LBA. If they can still make money this way then fair enough. Serves 'em right for buying the economy version though 
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no, no, no - no, no, no. I don't know why you think anyone would operate from LDY - LHR, when BA don't operate to Northern Ireland from LHR and bmi go to BHD. Why would Aer Lingus operate?
There is a PSO (Public Service Obligation) service to Dublin which is operated by Aer Arann and which provides point-point travellers and those wishing to connect to long-haul.
As I said earlier I don't see easyJet operating as they go to Belfast and the airports are not too far apart.
In terms of catchment areas, the DfT in their Northern Ireland consultation document estimated within 2 hours of LDY there are 400,000 people, compared to around 1.3 million around BFS or BHD.
Perhaps Aer Arann may step in with a LTN service if FR pull out altogether, since they have links with both LTN and LDY.
LTNman
It may seem odd to buy an aircraft with a derated engine which can't operate at all your existing airfields, but if buying this version means that it costs you less in maintenance and other costs and the aircraft can still carry full loads from most of your airfields (including your main bases and key destinations), but can't from some of your other airfields then why not? Particularly if some of those smaller airfields have runway extensions built which allow full loads, and those that don't - well you just pull out and go somewhere else. As I said, MO'L's not slow in spotting an opportunity to save money and not spend money when someone else will instead!
There is a PSO (Public Service Obligation) service to Dublin which is operated by Aer Arann and which provides point-point travellers and those wishing to connect to long-haul.
As I said earlier I don't see easyJet operating as they go to Belfast and the airports are not too far apart.
In terms of catchment areas, the DfT in their Northern Ireland consultation document estimated within 2 hours of LDY there are 400,000 people, compared to around 1.3 million around BFS or BHD.
Perhaps Aer Arann may step in with a LTN service if FR pull out altogether, since they have links with both LTN and LDY.
LTNman
It may seem odd to buy an aircraft with a derated engine which can't operate at all your existing airfields, but if buying this version means that it costs you less in maintenance and other costs and the aircraft can still carry full loads from most of your airfields (including your main bases and key destinations), but can't from some of your other airfields then why not? Particularly if some of those smaller airfields have runway extensions built which allow full loads, and those that don't - well you just pull out and go somewhere else. As I said, MO'L's not slow in spotting an opportunity to save money and not spend money when someone else will instead!
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brabazon - I don't think anyone would operate LHR-LDY - I was purely asking others opinions.
As I said I don't know enough about the area to answer it myself, but why couldn't an airline operate to Belfast AND Derry? That would make any airline the strongest presence across the whole of NI? And the amount of pax that FR carry (although most are price driven, granted) can't just go on to Belfast flights when they are full as they are.
Yes - they are close, but then again aren't EDI & GLA? LBA & MAN? they seem to operate with the same routings and don't suffer!!!!
There is no reason why Aer Lingus couldn't operate - they are allowed to fly it - after all aren't FR an Irish carrier???
EI have a few LHR slots and they may decide that they want to remove some DUB ones? There was some rumours going on a while back that they were looking at BFS-LHR.... again, they may not, but isn't one aspect of this forum to at least open subjects for discussion???
As I said I don't know enough about the area to answer it myself, but why couldn't an airline operate to Belfast AND Derry? That would make any airline the strongest presence across the whole of NI? And the amount of pax that FR carry (although most are price driven, granted) can't just go on to Belfast flights when they are full as they are.
Yes - they are close, but then again aren't EDI & GLA? LBA & MAN? they seem to operate with the same routings and don't suffer!!!!
There is no reason why Aer Lingus couldn't operate - they are allowed to fly it - after all aren't FR an Irish carrier???
EI have a few LHR slots and they may decide that they want to remove some DUB ones? There was some rumours going on a while back that they were looking at BFS-LHR.... again, they may not, but isn't one aspect of this forum to at least open subjects for discussion???
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DUB based aircraft probably doing the flight. DUB-STN-LDY-STN-DUB. DUB schedules for winter fit in LDY's with 25min turnround at STN. No doubt the release of the STN-LDY peak morning slot will be used for an existing destination or new route out of STN.
