43 Air School (threads merged)
Originally Posted by Woof etc
I reccommend Partial Differential Equations 101 as a starter. 
I recall a PDEs terminology "the Complete Primitive" - well I have long forgotten what this means but nowadays find it a handy term of abuse. Who says these courses have no practical application??
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Here's my take on it. I've been to varsity and done the whole ATP thing.My view is that the Comm exams as well as the ATP exams itself alone are not equivalent to a degree. But the Com LICENSE as a whole IS equivalent to a 3 year degree and an ATP license can compare to an honours. Certainly if you consider the amount of time that universities are closed, removing those holidays, one could fit a 3 year degree in 2 - roughly the time to do a Com License and an Instructor Rating.
As for the 43 thing well anyone who tells you that training at 43 improves your job chances is trying to fool themselves and you. Companies want experience and hours. In the end it's the person, not the place that gets you the job. As to were you should go, well I would recommend Progress, Fedair, APTRAC, as well as some of the schools in Johannesburg. 43 has unfortunately become a bit of a sausage factory. Also in my view if you need someone else to keep you disciplined enough to complete your flying training then perhaps you shouldn't be flying in the 1st place.
Don't get me wrong 43 do get results but they can in no way compare to the likes of Adelaide Avaiation College, Oxford, Delta Connection, etc. My suggestion is you actually come down here and visit the schools you think have potential, don't just visit the website or rely on word of mouth. Just my opinion.
As for the 43 thing well anyone who tells you that training at 43 improves your job chances is trying to fool themselves and you. Companies want experience and hours. In the end it's the person, not the place that gets you the job. As to were you should go, well I would recommend Progress, Fedair, APTRAC, as well as some of the schools in Johannesburg. 43 has unfortunately become a bit of a sausage factory. Also in my view if you need someone else to keep you disciplined enough to complete your flying training then perhaps you shouldn't be flying in the 1st place.
Don't get me wrong 43 do get results but they can in no way compare to the likes of Adelaide Avaiation College, Oxford, Delta Connection, etc. My suggestion is you actually come down here and visit the schools you think have potential, don't just visit the website or rely on word of mouth. Just my opinion.
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Originally Posted by DawnTreader
43 Airschool 'encourages' you to.
(That was on-topic
)
(That was on-topic
)
couldnt agree more. 43 is over-rated and over-priced, unless you have a bottemless pit of cash you can get the same training elsewhere. I do not think that a 43 qualification gives you an additional advantage in the job market these days 
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Originally Posted by kobus
You're right!
Have been hearing some horror stories about airline cadets getting preferential treatment over paying customers.
Airline training contracts tend to give flying schools some kind of arrogance. I'm sure no one would want to deal with that.
Have been hearing some horror stories about airline cadets getting preferential treatment over paying customers.
Airline training contracts tend to give flying schools some kind of arrogance. I'm sure no one would want to deal with that.
) accommodation block, an SAA rep visits regularly to check up and listen to complaints, priority when getting transport into town etc.. Also other privileges such as being allowed to organise the sports day. BUT There wasn't much noticeable favouritism when it came to flying slots.Don't forget SAA PAYS MORE - and students have to pay it back.
Originally Posted by kobus
93 000 euros just doesnt' fall out of the sky! If you are spending that amount of money then how about Oxford Aviation training (http://www.oxfordaviation.net/ ) or Adelaide AC?
Oxford doesn't guarantee a job either, despite all the blurb on their website. Much of your outlay would be accomodation in Oxford.
Originally Posted by kobus
Don't believe anyone telling you that you will have a better chance of finding a job if you do your training at 43 than at any other flying school. It's plain 
Originally Posted by kobus
My advice : If it's possible, go and visit the other schools mentioned above, some of them are also great. Some use Cessna 172 aircraft, the most popular single in the world, and the preferred training and rental choice of most pilots. Just because one doesn't train at 43 does not mean that they will be trailing behind their 43 counterparts. It's hours that counts whether/not you land a job.
Originally Posted by kobus
I suggest you try Air Mauritius' cadet training. Even though they train at 43 (:yuk), at least you are not paying for it!
Good luck hunting.
Good luck hunting.
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I think someone has got the wrong end of the stick here. 
Cityjet through the Irish Aviation Authority has approved 43 for a JAA course for their cadets at a price of 93 000 euros. This is for essentially what is a frozen ATPL without type rating. 
43 is expensive but not that expensive. This course is only available to irish nationals and ofcourse those with the dosh. 
Im also of the school of thought that 43 is a waste of money so Im not going to go into that again. Greg, the fact that you speak french and if you work on your english, you will have a huge advantage when you finally come into the job market
Whatever you decide goodluck
Cityjet through the Irish Aviation Authority has approved 43 for a JAA course for their cadets at a price of 93 000 euros. This is for essentially what is a frozen ATPL without type rating. 43 is expensive but not that expensive. This course is only available to irish nationals and ofcourse those with the dosh. Im also of the school of thought that 43 is a waste of money so Im not going to go into that again. Greg, the fact that you speak french and if you work on your english, you will have a huge advantage when you finally come into the job market
Whatever you decide goodluck
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Dawn Treader wise up. I think what Kobus meant was that it's the hours you get once you have finished your comm that count toward eventual jobs!!!
I did Comm at 43, and while doing "the long walk" at Lansaria nobody seemed to care what airschool i did my liscence at, just how many hors i had, and on what aircraft.
I mean seriously XYZ flight school may have an instructor who's been doing the job for 20 years, and can teach you a lot more, i'm sure, than the 21 year old instructor, who's biggest problem is squeezing his zits, that 43 may give you.
I also have a lot of friends who did their training at smaller less known schools who are very proffesional pilots flying some well respected companies.
The point is that an airschool is an airschool. The biggest differance is the price!!
I did Comm at 43, and while doing "the long walk" at Lansaria nobody seemed to care what airschool i did my liscence at, just how many hors i had, and on what aircraft.
I mean seriously XYZ flight school may have an instructor who's been doing the job for 20 years, and can teach you a lot more, i'm sure, than the 21 year old instructor, who's biggest problem is squeezing his zits, that 43 may give you.
I also have a lot of friends who did their training at smaller less known schools who are very proffesional pilots flying some well respected companies.
The point is that an airschool is an airschool. The biggest differance is the price!!
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Tend to agree. Once you have got more than a couple of hundred hours no-one cares what school you went to. Then again, I think from a personal point of view it certainly makes your own life easeir to have a well structured training programme. But you don't have to pay a gazillion bucks for this.
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Yeah ! join the AirForce instead 
Get to fly cool airplanes , Discipline fairer than 43 school probably & the State pays for it.
I can't agree more, if you're paying for it you should enjoy it
no school is a guarantee to a job THERE ARE NO HARVARDS ,STELLENBOSCH OR CAMBRIDGE IN AVIATION. Trust us, we know...
Get to fly cool airplanes , Discipline fairer than 43 school probably & the State pays for it.
I can't agree more, if you're paying for it you should enjoy it
no school is a guarantee to a job THERE ARE NO HARVARDS ,STELLENBOSCH OR CAMBRIDGE IN AVIATION. Trust us, we know...
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Originally Posted by fluffyfan
I have heard this a few times, guys comparing Comm to University, having done both I can assure you a Comm is no where near university level (Engineering or any Maths related field)..........all you need to get a Comm is basic maths and lots of learning....thats it, no magic talent needed.
Why not try Progress flight Academy, Airline Pilots Training Academy (APTRAC)......both in Port Elizabeth, they are both full time live in training institutions and in my opinion will give you what you need at half the price, in fact, I think 43 is overated and overpriced..........shop around, there are also schools in Johannesburg and Cape Town which may interest you, 43 relies on there name alot but unless you are rolling in cash I would not bother with 43. For your information APTRAC is run by a SAA training captain with very nice equipment and standards, if you are interested in an Airline career I would go there.
Why not try Progress flight Academy, Airline Pilots Training Academy (APTRAC)......both in Port Elizabeth, they are both full time live in training institutions and in my opinion will give you what you need at half the price, in fact, I think 43 is overated and overpriced..........shop around, there are also schools in Johannesburg and Cape Town which may interest you, 43 relies on there name alot but unless you are rolling in cash I would not bother with 43. For your information APTRAC is run by a SAA training captain with very nice equipment and standards, if you are interested in an Airline career I would go there.
Just so you know
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Originally Posted by LinkLowy
The only problem with this "captain" is that he won't hesitate to have you put in jail if you piss him off, effectively ending your career in SA before you even started it.
Just so you know
Just so you know
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hey pineteam
im actually also from mauritius and studied at 43 air school.... dont like chatting on the forums it causes too much "tension" sometimes so contact me at [email protected] if u want more details.... je parle le francais aussi si tu prefere....
dalsurfer
im actually also from mauritius and studied at 43 air school.... dont like chatting on the forums it causes too much "tension" sometimes so contact me at [email protected] if u want more details.... je parle le francais aussi si tu prefere....
dalsurfer
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A friend sent me this from a current KQ internal newsletter :
"Kenya Airways has been training their cadet pilots at 43rd Air School for a number of years. It was clear from the outset that the Kenyan cadets were prepared to work very hard at achieving their goals and it therefore came as no surprise when they obtained very good academic results. This has, without exception, been the case with all the Kenya Airways cadets thus far at the school.
When 17 Kenyan cadets recently wrote their Commercial Pilot Licence (CPL) exams at the CAA Headquarters in Midrand, Johannesburg, they managed to pass 134 of the 136 papers written, at first attempt.
What made this even more remarkable was the fact that their average for the 136 papers was 91.6% - a full 4% better than the previous best result for a CPL group at 43rd Air School! Twenty-two of the exam results were an amazing 100%. When the two candidates that missed one subject each re-wrote a day or two later they got 96 and 100% respectively!
A senior official at the CAA noted that the group’s results was ‘truly remarkable’ and commented that as far as could be established, this was the highest average ever to be achieved by a group of students writing their CPL exams.
Our congratulations to the Kenya Airways students on this achievement. Also to Paddy Carolan, Kiewit Maré and LT Minnaar whose thorough lectures over a number of weeks, clearly paid dividends!"
"Kenya Airways has been training their cadet pilots at 43rd Air School for a number of years. It was clear from the outset that the Kenyan cadets were prepared to work very hard at achieving their goals and it therefore came as no surprise when they obtained very good academic results. This has, without exception, been the case with all the Kenya Airways cadets thus far at the school.
When 17 Kenyan cadets recently wrote their Commercial Pilot Licence (CPL) exams at the CAA Headquarters in Midrand, Johannesburg, they managed to pass 134 of the 136 papers written, at first attempt.
What made this even more remarkable was the fact that their average for the 136 papers was 91.6% - a full 4% better than the previous best result for a CPL group at 43rd Air School! Twenty-two of the exam results were an amazing 100%. When the two candidates that missed one subject each re-wrote a day or two later they got 96 and 100% respectively!
A senior official at the CAA noted that the group’s results was ‘truly remarkable’ and commented that as far as could be established, this was the highest average ever to be achieved by a group of students writing their CPL exams.
Our congratulations to the Kenya Airways students on this achievement. Also to Paddy Carolan, Kiewit Maré and LT Minnaar whose thorough lectures over a number of weeks, clearly paid dividends!"
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but what makes me insane is when I am trying to book exams in my home country and I cant get a slot because the rest of the continent is filling the exam hall. Getting re-writes within a day or two...I have to wait a month or two. CAA needs to sort things out a little better for its own first. Maybe have a seperate exam hall for large foreign groups, cause trust me, when there is a group like this trying to write, you can just forget about being "awarded" a booking. They are not even going to use the priviliges of that licence here in SA, so CAA needs to prioritise, or at least ensure that residents of SA are afforded the same opportunities to book and re-write if necessary. I know of folks who have had subjects lapse due to this bullsh1t. 
I know of folks who have had subjects lapse due to this bullsh1t.
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Good Times.
Oh boy, alot of mixed feelings here.
I was at 43.
Was it expensive? Hell Yes.
Do SAA get preferential treatment? Maybe a bit, but not as much as is made out. (they don't get the best instructors since there aren't specialised SAAup to you who you want to instruct you.)
Do I think I got my Moneys worth? Yes I do.
Did I enjoy it? You bet.
Sure going to 43 won't guarantee you a job, but I do think it holds you in good stead with other past 43 students.
On a more personal note, the year I spent living, and studying at 43 was one of the best of my life.
I was at 43.
Was it expensive? Hell Yes.
Do SAA get preferential treatment? Maybe a bit, but not as much as is made out. (they don't get the best instructors since there aren't specialised SAAup to you who you want to instruct you.)
Do I think I got my Moneys worth? Yes I do.
Did I enjoy it? You bet.
Sure going to 43 won't guarantee you a job, but I do think it holds you in good stead with other past 43 students.
On a more personal note, the year I spent living, and studying at 43 was one of the best of my life.
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The only school in Africa, IMHO, that is worth going is Ethiopian Airlines flight school at Bole IAP in Addis Ababa. They are not a commercial operation and won't compromise their standards for money. It is a 22-month total imersion program and attrition rate is extremely high. It is taught by highly experienced pilots with thousands of hours behind them. Don't want to name nationalities but there are many from African countries who didn't make it at ETs flight school and ended up finishing up at 43rd.
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Interesting point.........At my airline your initial training (up to CPL) is definately taken into account. And yes, 43 (for that matter Progress, etc.) will most certianly give you a higher score than uncle Billy with his Cherokee on the farm.
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ETaf,
The ET training school is good no doubt about it but to say it's the best is pushing it a little too far. KQ stopped sending their abinitios to the ET school because it's fairly inefficient i.e. they train at their own pace, very expensive and most of the abinitios who came back had problems online with KQ instructors when it came to landings until it turned out that during their twin training the instructor always landed the plane for fear of letting the student damage the prized twin.
The ET training school is good no doubt about it but to say it's the best is pushing it a little too far. KQ stopped sending their abinitios to the ET school because it's fairly inefficient i.e. they train at their own pace, very expensive and most of the abinitios who came back had problems online with KQ instructors when it came to landings until it turned out that during their twin training the instructor always landed the plane for fear of letting the student damage the prized twin.