SAA Flight Attendants rip the ring out at IAD
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Having spoken to cabin crew, it would seem there is huge moral issues at SAA.
It would seem that the company have shorted the sign on time in IAD. Thus are able to save a day's Meal Allowance and now can give the cabin crew 1 less day off on return. Needless to say the loss of $97 went down a real treat. I have heard the crew were ready to riot BEFORE they even left ORTIA.
Again, 2nd hand story. I take NO responsibility for the accuracy.
It would seem that the company have shorted the sign on time in IAD. Thus are able to save a day's Meal Allowance and now can give the cabin crew 1 less day off on return. Needless to say the loss of $97 went down a real treat. I have heard the crew were ready to riot BEFORE they even left ORTIA.
Again, 2nd hand story. I take NO responsibility for the accuracy.
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Having spoken to cabin crew, it would seem there is huge moral issues at SAA.
One of the prime reasons why the company is in the position its in because is the rank and file believe they are entitled to a job and that entitlement does not go with an honest days work. The blame must certainly be shared by line management who have run parts of the company with the ability of a six year old. The staff have just had it too easy, now the whip starts to get cracked and there is near mutiny- though times.
This week the first group of managers are being told they either have a job or they have to reapply- its quite incredible what kind of effect this is having on those people who always viewed themselves as untouchable and let their staff run riot- mainly because they were always out on golf days or on some or other jolly.
The facts are SAA staff are in most cases paid twice what their peers in other airlines are paid yet their output is not comparable. The time has come for the organisation to get value for money- that’s why there have been over 400 resignations this year…..the gravy trainers are running scared and its good to see!
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in most cases paid twice what their peers in other airlines are paid yet their output is not comparable. The time has come for the organisation to get value for money- ..........gravy trainers are running scared and its good to see!
And i thought it was only me that thought SAA was over paid and under worked. Glad it wasn't me that said it this time. Wonder if pilots are included in that lot?
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Why am I not surprised its you making a comment like that. 
I really don’t care what the pilots earn, as far as Im concerned they do their job according to their conditions of employment which is a lot more than can be said for a great number of our other staff. I have no issue with paying a person well – provided they produce the goods in return.
I really don’t care what the pilots earn, as far as Im concerned they do their job according to their conditions of employment which is a lot more than can be said for a great number of our other staff. I have no issue with paying a person well – provided they produce the goods in return.
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Sorry, but you left yourself open for that one.
But I think it demonstrates the point. I am sure ALL staff at SAA think that its EVERYBODY else thats underworked and over paid.
But I think it demonstrates the point. I am sure ALL staff at SAA think that its EVERYBODY else thats underworked and over paid.
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oh yes. It's not rocket science.
Read all my other comments. Get the governement out of the airlines. This restructuring will be as bigger dog show as the rest.
Go have a look at a brief history on 'the world's favorite airline'.
Read all my other comments. Get the governement out of the airlines. This restructuring will be as bigger dog show as the rest.
Go have a look at a brief history on 'the world's favorite airline'.
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As I said before, you know it all wiseass, I just wonder why the hell you’re not running an airline with all this obvious expertise you have.
Ah yes… “the world’s favourite airline” aren’t those the guys who just had to cough up GBP 300 million for anti competitive behaviour? An example indeed, stick to your day job chap
Ah yes… “the world’s favourite airline” aren’t those the guys who just had to cough up GBP 300 million for anti competitive behaviour? An example indeed, stick to your day job chap
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Lol. At least they make a profit.
I find it hugely amusing that some of you SAA types go on the personal attack as soon as you run out of ideas.
Grow up friend. If you cant take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.
This is not in anyway personal. This is about the health of the country's airline industry and economy as a whole. The money that the tax payer wastes on the SAA dogshow could be put to much better use.
We both know the demand is there. History shows that the state in NOT the entity to run an airline. If the staff at SAA, have to face some harsh reality in the process, so be it. Welcome to the real world.
If you think the company that you work for, cant make it without state money, maybe its time to face facts.
P.S. Oh yeah, dont i remember reading something about SAA and the compertitions board recently? People in glass house.....LOL
I find it hugely amusing that some of you SAA types go on the personal attack as soon as you run out of ideas.
Grow up friend. If you cant take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.
This is not in anyway personal. This is about the health of the country's airline industry and economy as a whole. The money that the tax payer wastes on the SAA dogshow could be put to much better use.
We both know the demand is there. History shows that the state in NOT the entity to run an airline. If the staff at SAA, have to face some harsh reality in the process, so be it. Welcome to the real world.
If you think the company that you work for, cant make it without state money, maybe its time to face facts.
P.S. Oh yeah, dont i remember reading something about SAA and the compertitions board recently? People in glass house.....LOL
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FDP Extension
Many moons ago I was on board when a certain SAA captain used captain's discretion to extend the FDP to get the job done.
1 Leg. NY to JNB. Started with a technical, then snow....... After the second de-ice, we were number 64 in line. The 3 hours had been and gone longgggg. Now he invoked "emergency limits". We're still on the ground #64. We did the full service, everything! But, that don't make it right! Needless to say, CRM was a subject he lectured, that way he was excused from practicing it. His F/O's were frantically on the mic. to JNB to get a directive to change course for SAL. Nooooo chance at that time of night. DCA inspector on board, mmmmm "Leave me out of this, it's entirely the commanders decision." His exact words.
This is a lot of speculation and of course it's a rumour network. But I often wander about CRM. It's my pet love, but I still see so many people who believe it's for someone else.
One wanders what the Maestro, late D.Hack.... would have done? He knew about CRM.
Like the 800 that went down in West Africa, NOBODY knows what happened till the investigation is complete. Do we have all the facts here???
I still believe a combined effort, with PROPER consultation does get the job done, even in pressing times. But contempt gets fewer positive results.
By the way, the FDP (not dp) was 24hrs 25 minutes......... 1 leg.
1 Leg. NY to JNB. Started with a technical, then snow....... After the second de-ice, we were number 64 in line. The 3 hours had been and gone longgggg. Now he invoked "emergency limits". We're still on the ground #64. We did the full service, everything! But, that don't make it right! Needless to say, CRM was a subject he lectured, that way he was excused from practicing it. His F/O's were frantically on the mic. to JNB to get a directive to change course for SAL. Nooooo chance at that time of night. DCA inspector on board, mmmmm "Leave me out of this, it's entirely the commanders decision." His exact words.
This is a lot of speculation and of course it's a rumour network. But I often wander about CRM. It's my pet love, but I still see so many people who believe it's for someone else.
One wanders what the Maestro, late D.Hack.... would have done? He knew about CRM.
Like the 800 that went down in West Africa, NOBODY knows what happened till the investigation is complete. Do we have all the facts here???
I still believe a combined effort, with PROPER consultation does get the job done, even in pressing times. But contempt gets fewer positive results.
By the way, the FDP (not dp) was 24hrs 25 minutes......... 1 leg.
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I think we should wait and know more before jumping to conclusions. There is so little info to go by in making assumptions. Hopefully, the Captain had treated the cabin crew with respect during the trip and there were no underlying issues.
Fly safe and relax.
Fly safe and relax.
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CRM. Put the captain back in the left seat I say!!! - NOTI have a feeling the flight didn't start well. Know it was a prob about the loss of meal allowance.
But dont get me wrong, they should be fired....but hate it to happen to me. Can u imagine sitting on the flight deck and the crew have walked off?
Last edited by Avi8tor; 17th Jun 2007 at 05:29.
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Think this was an industrial issue that worked its way onto the flight. So pretty unprofessional on the part of the cabin crew, if you ask me. They have a union, they should use it.
The CRM part is how the flight deck /cabin crew channelled that frustration on the flight. I think you would have to hear both sides and see how it played out.
The CRM part is how the flight deck /cabin crew channelled that frustration on the flight. I think you would have to hear both sides and see how it played out.
Está servira para distraerle.
Finally dug out a copy of CAA CAP 371. 1990.
This is old and possibly does not apply to ZA , but, with regard to discretion in the UK, and at that time, it states that,
An aircraft commander may, at his discretion, and after taking note of the circumstances of other members of the crew, if carried, extend an FDP beyond that permitted in paragraph 13, provided he is satisfied that the flight can be made safely.
Paragraph 13, in this case, is the sectors/time of report/duty time schedule.
So from this, the interpretation seems quite clear. It is not a question of what the cabin crew might want to happen but what did happen. It lies then upon the commander's shoulders to determine what is going to happen.
Interestingly enough, the section and its notes actually can be interpreted to give the commander unlimited discretion in the event of an emergency which is defined as a situation where there is a serious risk to the health or safety of crew or passengers, or endangers the lives of others.
No doubt certain medical emergencies affecting one or more passengers would fall within this definition?
Hey Ho!
Está servira para distraerle.
Well, therein may lie the rub perhaps. If the South African Airways discretion business is a union affair with no clearly interpretable CAA legal teeth to it, a suitable SNAFU could reasonably be predicted.
