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Accident abroad? were you responsible?

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Accident abroad? were you responsible?

Old 5th Mar 2017, 20:46
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Oxford, UK
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Accident abroad? were you responsible?

And if so, what were the consequences?

In France, the legal system is quite different to the UK. A British glider was soaring under a large cu, when French parachutists dove through the cloud and hit the glider, at least one was killed. The British pilots were blamed for the fatality, and legal proceedings took place, but I don't know the rest of the story. I do know that both in the glider were very lucky to have bailed out and survived.

If you have been flying say in Eastern Europe, and there was an accident, would the visitor be blamed and prosecuted?
mary meagher is offline  
Old 6th Mar 2017, 00:26
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The law varies greatly from country to country, and you are well advised to learn local laws if you wish to travel to another country. As a general rule, the laws of European countries essentially treat manslaughter the same as a homicide with a deadly weapon, and the penalties are often more severe than in Western countries.

This is due to the fact that European law is largely based on the original Romano-Germanic civil law and often has subtle local cultural influences; whilst we in Western countries are under the Anglo-Saxon common law, which contains a number of forms of manslaughter, which are all viewed differently.

As a general rule, the more Eastern the European country, the more there is a culture of corruption and low-paid police and judicial officials; and the more there is a larger peasant population, which has an influence on local laws and penalties.
Eastern European law is also based on the "guilty until found innocent" premise, whereas Western countries laws are based on the fairer, "innocent until found guilty" premise. In the latter, you will obtain bail and freedom while your case is awaiting consideration; in the former, you will be locked up without any chance of bail until the authorities decide you are unable to be charged with any serious crime. This may take a considerable period of time as the investigation often proceeds at a leisurely pace.

European civil-law codes place a greater emphasis than do common-law systems on the dangerousness of the actor’s conduct, and the circumstances surrounding his act. Thus, bodily injury resulting in death, and death that is a result of negligence rather than recklessness, are more heavily penalised in European law than in Anglo-American systems. Whereas in England death resulting from a felony is defined as murder only in the case of a few serious crimes, such as robbery or rape, European codes often punish any killer as a murderer, as if he had employed a deadly weapon.
onetrack is offline  
Old 6th Mar 2017, 07:47
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Join Date: Dec 2014
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During WGC 2010 in Szeged, Hungary, an australian pilot came in too low and the left wing clipped the front of a truck. The glider crashed, pilot luckily escaped unharmed. However, the truck driver received very serious head injuries and lost one of his eye.
The pilot immediately left the country, before the police could have detained him.
THe police did not issue an international warrant on purpose, they considered this unnecessary for the duration of the investigation.
Three years later, in 2013, the pilot was sentenced to 8 months in "light" prison, suspended for a probation of 1 year.
I am not sure where the case is now, but this is a link that you might try to translate with Google.... IHO - Biztos út - Vitorlázógép ütközött kamionnal, ítélet
rnzoli is offline  
Old 6th Mar 2017, 21:31
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French accident

It was a bit complicated as the parachutists illegally jumped through cloud. They were both gendarmes and the one that didn't hit the glider filed a false statement to protect the pilatus pilot who had overall responsibility for the jump. The dead parachutist parents made a formal complaint which started the prosecution.
Iirc the pilots were flying a Comp out of Vinon with GAP as a turn point, they had an out of date map and alleged that the Comp director hadn't briefed the drop zone.
Jacque Noel and another two friends of mine witnessed it. The former went to Paris court for the appeal...I think the pilots were initially sentenced to two years.
It was very messy and there was certainly a lack of airmanship as at least one of the guys had flown out of Gap and knew about the drop zone.
The glider went down in a flat spin and the guys couldn't get out ...very late they tried changing the configuration...think it was airbrakes ...which changed the rotation and G loads. The second one got out and virtually landed a few seconds after and next to the glider.
One of the witnesses told me he was amazed at how good the reserve was and went out and bought one.

Wrt to France; the word of a single Gendarme is taken as evidence over any individual ....in the UK one needs two separate pieces of evidence. Having been nicked illegally twice .....it's not worth arguing.
blind pew is offline  
Old 6th Mar 2017, 21:51
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I'm in claims, and have handled some in Latin America and South Pacific. Most of the ones I can remember were not deemed criminal, and any civil settlements I(the insurance company) handled. So for instance, if our insured was responsible for a death or damage because they lost an engine and put it down on a highway, or went off the runway right into some poor bloke minding his own business, we pay the property damage, and wrongful death claim. The insured goes on their way, probably buys a new aircraft from the hull settlement.

Coming from the U.S. where filing a lawsuit is like breathing, overseas claims were simple. I hate to say it but what is paid out for a life in the 3rd world is a far cry from what is paid out in the 1st world. Now, if you don't have insurance, or your insurance doesn't apply internationally, you would be on the hook for any damages. I've never had any insureds prosecuted criminally though. It could be different in Eastern Europe.
Geosync is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2017, 08:17
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Join Date: Oct 2016
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Do doves fly in cloud? And if they did wouldn't that be "doved" out of a cloud?
noflynomore is offline  

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