Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Military Aviation
Reload this Page >

CHF - Merlin Mk 4

Military Aviation A forum for the professionals who fly military hardware. Also for the backroom boys and girls who support the flying and maintain the equipment, and without whom nothing would ever leave the ground. All armies, navies and air forces of the world equally welcome here.

CHF - Merlin Mk 4

Old 6th Oct 2011, 19:00
  #261 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 192
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Achimedes,

Trenchard Lecture
Pheasant is offline  
Old 6th Oct 2011, 19:16
  #262 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Swindonshire
Posts: 2,006
Received 16 Likes on 8 Posts
Thanks, Pheasant. Since I was sitting on the stage approximately 7 feet to Eric's left during that lecture, I can tell you categorically that he wasn't 'almost booed'.

Eric put in a bravura performance (no surprise) which in fact went down extremely well with the audience - which is one of the reasons the Cranwell branch of the RAES had him back earlier this week to talk about the RNAS - not least because he was entertainingly controversial. The only people who'd have had reason to boo him would've been (a) government ministers [none present] (b) Army officers [some present, no booing]

The only element of disagreement which occurred was during the interval when Eric and the Cranwell staish disagreed, firmly, but good-naturedly over a cup of tea and some biscuits, about the efficacy of the Tornado. I have to say that I sided with the Staish on that one, since Eric rather under-estimated what the GR4 can do.

But the fact remains that the RAES members (and IOT cadets, who wouldn't have dared boo) collectively thought that he was excellent. Granted, there may have been a few people dotted about the audience who might've disagreed with what he said on certain occasions, but since his loudest messages were (a) the UK needs a capable, independent air force and (b) that our political lords and masters had overseen a stupid defence review, from where I was sitting, I have to say that he had the audience eating out of his hand.
Archimedes is offline  
Old 6th Oct 2011, 20:02
  #263 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 192
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Thanks Archimedes. As I said....it was reportage.
Pheasant is offline  
Old 6th Oct 2011, 20:21
  #264 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Swindonshire
Posts: 2,006
Received 16 Likes on 8 Posts
Oh, don't get me wrong, not having a go - just wondered if it was the Trenchard, so I could offer the view of one who was there (in fact, the nearest anyone came to being booed was when the discussion moved on to procurement and following a comment from Prof G about the move to Abbeywood, etc, I said something along the lines of 'I agree with Eric that it raises the question of whether Abbeywood's fit for purpose?'

Sadly, a member of the audience who'd been involved in designing the building thought that I was talking about the architecture there and rather sternly rebuked me for my contention that it was jerry-built when it was in fact constructed to the highest standards in the construction industy. I believe the transcript shows that my response to him began 'Errrr......')
Archimedes is offline  
Old 8th Oct 2011, 00:17
  #265 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: in the deep blue sea
Age: 36
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Also glad to see today that TJB has made 3*
Well I hadn't heard that - is he posted elsewhere, I thought Head of British Defence Staff in DC was a 2* job?
_WAFU_ is offline  
Old 8th Oct 2011, 06:30
  #266 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 192
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Appointment changed he's relieving Adm Cooling at HQ SACT next month.
Pheasant is offline  
Old 13th Oct 2011, 08:41
  #267 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: The sunny South
Posts: 819
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Commando Sea Kings return from Helmand after four years

Originally Posted by RN website 12 Oct 2011

It is mission accomplished for veteran Naval helicopters over Afghanistan after a gruelling four-year mission. The dark green Sea Kings of the Commando Helicopter Force are returning to Somerset after more than 12,500 hours in the skies of Helmand supporting the international mission on the ground...

The Junglies flew their final sortie in support of Joint Helicopter Force (Afghanistan) on September 30, the last of more than 3,800 individual missions since arriving in theatre back in 2007. Since then they have safely transported more than 80,000 troops from numerous nations around the country and delivered more than 700 tonnes of ammunition, water and supplies to various outlying bases...

The Junglies will now begin the conversion process to the newer Merlin Mk3, currently being operated by the RAF in a troop-carrying role; as a larger and more powerful helicopter, it can carry more troops and cargo – and faster too. Other duties back in the UK include returning to the more usual task of supporting the Royal Marines – CHF’s raison d’être – including training for amphibious operations, desert training overseas and cold weather/mountain training in Norway.
FODPlod is online now  
Old 13th Oct 2011, 16:32
  #268 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Borderline England
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Ah, so they're converting to the Mk3 now ? Have the Mk4 goalposts been moved ? My question being that if they have and Mk4 does not materialise, what is the point of moving to Merlin ? Surely the cheaper and better all-round option for them is the new buy Chinook. My money is on Mk3 going Junglie, Mk4 never happening and a shed load of RAF corporate knowledge lost and Junglie having a cab they can only tie-down to the O-Boat.
Unchecked is offline  
Old 13th Oct 2011, 18:51
  #269 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Home
Posts: 3,399
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
And they can just fold and stow the new chinook they should buy instead of the Merlin???
Tourist is offline  
Old 13th Oct 2011, 19:24
  #270 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Borderline England
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
No - my point is that if they don't go ahead with the Mk4 conversion, then why bother with Merlin at all ? If they're (inevitably) going to end up with a non-folding aircraft anyway, it may as well be Chinook.
Unchecked is offline  
Old 13th Oct 2011, 19:46
  #271 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 192
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Judging by the comments in the press re Westlands Yeovil, there will be a contract for the Mk4 to keep them in busineess following Wildcat and Merlin CSP.
Pheasant is offline  
Old 13th Oct 2011, 20:27
  #272 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Borderline England
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Do you have any links to these press articles ?

Any thoughts on a timescale for Mk4 to happen ?
Unchecked is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2011, 05:49
  #273 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: at home
Posts: 412
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
If the money is forthcoming, it will be another shocking example of MOD waste. It would be a better spend in the long term to just buy another type for pusser. Or has the penny finally dropped, it will make Mk3 too heavy to be of any real use.

Looking forward to hearing a gentle 'plink plink, fizz' when it goes to sea...

This is madness, and quite frankly smacks of inept and ill informed decision making.
high spirits is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2011, 13:00
  #274 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 192
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Unchecked,

I am not going to waste time trawling but it was in the FT around the time of Helitech and focussed on lack of MoD orders into the future.
Pheasant is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2011, 16:39
  #275 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Land of the Angles
Posts: 359
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Hansard 13th October 2011 should help a little

Armed Forces: Helicopters

Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence

(1) what assessment he has made of the effects of the marinisation of Merlin helicopters on RAF Benson; and if he will make a statement; [73694]

(2) what assessment his Department has made of the implications of marinisation of Merlin helicopters for their capacity to fly hot and high; and if he will make a statement; [73695]

(3) what assessment his Department has made of the implications of marinisation for the weight of Merlin helicopters; and if he will make a statement; [73696]

(4) how many Merlin helicopters have been selected for marinisation; and if he will make a statement; [73697]

(5) what estimate he has made of the cost to the public purse of the marinisation of the Merlin helicopter; and if he will make a statement. [73698]

13 Oct 2011 : Column 495W

Peter Luff: The Ministry of Defence is currently exploring options as part of the concept phase for the Merlin Life sustainment programme. It is therefore too early in the programme to be able to confirm details regarding cost, scope and aircraft weight and performance.

The implications of future helicopter plans for RAF Benson will be better understood upon conclusion of the Defence rotary wing capability study, which is expected towards the end of this year.
Hilife is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2011, 19:08
  #276 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: at home
Posts: 412
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The weight and performance figures are available, at least those without marinisation. Just ask the question of Benson. The thing that sticks out for me are the unanswered questions.

Surely they know the cost!!! That has to inform the strategy of whether it is a suitable asset that provides the capability that CHF need. Please don't tell me that they have not done a proper cost versus capability study.

Really? McFly?
high spirits is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2011, 20:00
  #277 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Oxon
Age: 66
Posts: 1,942
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Sounds like its not the done deal one or two think it is.
Seldomfitforpurpose is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2011, 20:39
  #278 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Borderline England
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I'm sure it's a done deal - i mean, it is a ridiculous idea, so the MoD in their infinite wisdom are bound to make it happen.

It is encouraging that these questions are being asked, even if the (ex) SoS has other things to worry about at the moment. Who is this Mrs Moon, anyway ?
Unchecked is offline  
Old 14th Oct 2011, 20:46
  #279 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Oxon
Age: 66
Posts: 1,942
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
You are surely not suggesting the Navy will simply take the Merlin and **** it
Seldomfitforpurpose is offline  
Old 15th Oct 2011, 14:14
  #280 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Borderline England
Posts: 211
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Not at all - they will do the best they can but i'm dubious that they will see a Merlin Mk4. I just can't see where the money is coming from.
Unchecked is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.