How many Pilots have left/Leaving Emirates
Join Date: Dec 2002
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Hmmm....
It seems Tom and Smoothie need to wait six years down the road and see that they have taken a 6.5% pay cut in that time....
Or be on long term sick mandated by a Dr ...and seek permission to go to their home country to be with loved ones ....only to be denied ..
Or have their body decide that it's sick leading up to leave and realise that its punitive as against any other time of the year...
Or have tea & biccies after an unstable approach having gone into discretion only to realise that the 6o minute prior push back start of duty was actually when the skipper was doing the walk around ...
Or have a change in their staff travel Bennies to,the worse ...whereby your ALT does not cover the original city that you joined from because it's not on the EK network...
Or sit and listen to the in flight podcast where the 'The main man from Ek says "every flight ops crew to a man or woman is only delighted to be here'
Or watch our CC crawl into HQ sick and distraught when they should be in bed ..in order not to be disciplined...
Or have a manager at the slightest whim decide you need a CDT test ...
Or sit and wait patiently with a perfect record for eight years on the 330 then 380 for your command as the guy moves into a villa next to you who is 32 and never flown outside an LCC in the EU..and he strolls out to his car everyday with his "Golden 4 bars""
Or watch that same guys 1 & 2 year old screaming kids settle into their bizzo seats on their 1st annual ALT as you and your loyal gang jump into ten abreast for the 15 hr slog to the connection that used to be paid for that no longer is...
Or be under the constant week in week out receiving end of emails who's delivery is the polar opposite of what you will need in soft skills to pass the your upgrade interview .
Or go to a wash up as a four year FO and ask about DEC plans only to be told ..."not going to happen " ..then comes home, turn on his iPad amd sees the ad!
Or....oh never mind...
see you kiddies in Rock Bottom ... " dude She's hot ...EK is awesome!"
; >
f.
It seems Tom and Smoothie need to wait six years down the road and see that they have taken a 6.5% pay cut in that time....
Or be on long term sick mandated by a Dr ...and seek permission to go to their home country to be with loved ones ....only to be denied ..
Or have their body decide that it's sick leading up to leave and realise that its punitive as against any other time of the year...
Or have tea & biccies after an unstable approach having gone into discretion only to realise that the 6o minute prior push back start of duty was actually when the skipper was doing the walk around ...
Or have a change in their staff travel Bennies to,the worse ...whereby your ALT does not cover the original city that you joined from because it's not on the EK network...
Or sit and listen to the in flight podcast where the 'The main man from Ek says "every flight ops crew to a man or woman is only delighted to be here'
Or watch our CC crawl into HQ sick and distraught when they should be in bed ..in order not to be disciplined...
Or have a manager at the slightest whim decide you need a CDT test ...
Or sit and wait patiently with a perfect record for eight years on the 330 then 380 for your command as the guy moves into a villa next to you who is 32 and never flown outside an LCC in the EU..and he strolls out to his car everyday with his "Golden 4 bars""
Or watch that same guys 1 & 2 year old screaming kids settle into their bizzo seats on their 1st annual ALT as you and your loyal gang jump into ten abreast for the 15 hr slog to the connection that used to be paid for that no longer is...
Or be under the constant week in week out receiving end of emails who's delivery is the polar opposite of what you will need in soft skills to pass the your upgrade interview .
Or go to a wash up as a four year FO and ask about DEC plans only to be told ..."not going to happen " ..then comes home, turn on his iPad amd sees the ad!
Or....oh never mind...
see you kiddies in Rock Bottom ... " dude She's hot ...EK is awesome!"
; >
f.
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Excellent post flillion,
Smoothie and tom are either from ryanair or a similar airline.
Technicaljy they are ok but they only know procedures at best.
I recently flew with an ex Ryan air Cpt who joined in EK in right seat.
He complained about how a former colleague at ryanair was able to join as a DEC where as he a 9 year veteran at ryanair and a Ryanair TRI was not given the same advantage despite having joined one month earlier.
I finally had to take him aside and tell to put a sock in it.
We have some real idiots flying for us.
The seniority list needs to be respected, you get a number and you wait your turn.
Smoothie and tom are either from ryanair or a similar airline.
Technicaljy they are ok but they only know procedures at best.
I recently flew with an ex Ryan air Cpt who joined in EK in right seat.
He complained about how a former colleague at ryanair was able to join as a DEC where as he a 9 year veteran at ryanair and a Ryanair TRI was not given the same advantage despite having joined one month earlier.
I finally had to take him aside and tell to put a sock in it.
We have some real idiots flying for us.
The seniority list needs to be respected, you get a number and you wait your turn.
Join Date: May 2011
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Let me have my head bitten off.
I totally sympathise with the overall situation at Emirates, I can't understand why anybody would choose to go there with the current scheduling and overtime regime.
On the other hand I totally disagree with the whinging F/O's over direct entry command. Firstly in my opinion you should not leave your own home country to become expat in the first place without a command because it is your comrades who speak the same accent of the same country and who have been to the same schools as you who should be making you a Captain because they know you best. If they will not make you a Captain then nobody else should.
Secondly why shouldn't a 50 year old Captain who has been in the left seat for 20 years expect to be able to change company without having to start all over again.
In my view in the case of a company like Emirates there needs to be a fair balance between upgrades and DEC's unfortunately there are insufficient numbers of DEC opportunities.
Why anybody would currently go to Emirates in the first place though, I don't understand.
I totally sympathise with the overall situation at Emirates, I can't understand why anybody would choose to go there with the current scheduling and overtime regime.
On the other hand I totally disagree with the whinging F/O's over direct entry command. Firstly in my opinion you should not leave your own home country to become expat in the first place without a command because it is your comrades who speak the same accent of the same country and who have been to the same schools as you who should be making you a Captain because they know you best. If they will not make you a Captain then nobody else should.
Secondly why shouldn't a 50 year old Captain who has been in the left seat for 20 years expect to be able to change company without having to start all over again.
In my view in the case of a company like Emirates there needs to be a fair balance between upgrades and DEC's unfortunately there are insufficient numbers of DEC opportunities.
Why anybody would currently go to Emirates in the first place though, I don't understand.
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Kungfu,
On the topic of DEC and older DEC captains with relevant experience , I will agree that EK should welcome such candidates into the left seat. I believe such a number would be small but I would welcome them as our gene pool would be too shallow otherwise.
The problem at EK is that the company has recruited DECs who have had no previous wide body experience and no international time.
Many have come fro my (not) favorite airline Ryanair.
This has occurred withing the last two years.
This is shocking and it is the part I object to.
On the topic of DEC and older DEC captains with relevant experience , I will agree that EK should welcome such candidates into the left seat. I believe such a number would be small but I would welcome them as our gene pool would be too shallow otherwise.
The problem at EK is that the company has recruited DECs who have had no previous wide body experience and no international time.
Many have come fro my (not) favorite airline Ryanair.
This has occurred withing the last two years.
This is shocking and it is the part I object to.
Join Date: Nov 2003
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Hey guys, give Tom and Smoothie a break. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion. Perception is 100% reality. Yes they are probably new and are obviously happy. Good for them. Their opinions are no less valid than anyone else's here. I
I've been here 11 years and I don't hate the place. It could be a lot better for sure, but there are plenty of places around the world that are a lot worse. Don't hate on those guys if they are happy. Wish them well instead. Personally, if they're happy, then I'm happy for them. Just chill guys.
Yardman
I've been here 11 years and I don't hate the place. It could be a lot better for sure, but there are plenty of places around the world that are a lot worse. Don't hate on those guys if they are happy. Wish them well instead. Personally, if they're happy, then I'm happy for them. Just chill guys.
Yardman
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Tom, you are right to a certain extent, it is a matter of perspective and from where you have come.
However, where I do disagree with you strongly is in the simple maths of DXB and EK recent pay rounds.
Inflation is running conservatively at 15% pa we have been awarded our 3% annual increment plus 0.5%. So in effect we have had a 23.5% pay cut over the last 2 years.
Ek's package used to be one of the very best going. Not surprisingly those who flew for it were happy and engaged with the company, working hard towards the best interests and goals for both parties.
EK's package has not kept pace with either inflation or the global aviation employment market. In fact it has gone backwards, fast.
The financial problem is one issue, the others include unsustainable flying rates, insufficient rest patterns to fully recover from massive time changes on ULR flights, not honouring contracted leave entitlement. Actually the list goes on a on, but, Tom, you are right it is a different picture depending on where you came from to the Pit.
However, where I do disagree with you strongly is in the simple maths of DXB and EK recent pay rounds.
Inflation is running conservatively at 15% pa we have been awarded our 3% annual increment plus 0.5%. So in effect we have had a 23.5% pay cut over the last 2 years.
Ek's package used to be one of the very best going. Not surprisingly those who flew for it were happy and engaged with the company, working hard towards the best interests and goals for both parties.
EK's package has not kept pace with either inflation or the global aviation employment market. In fact it has gone backwards, fast.
The financial problem is one issue, the others include unsustainable flying rates, insufficient rest patterns to fully recover from massive time changes on ULR flights, not honouring contracted leave entitlement. Actually the list goes on a on, but, Tom, you are right it is a different picture depending on where you came from to the Pit.
Join Date: Nov 2011
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Hmmm....
It seems Tom and Smoothie need to wait six years down the road and see that they have taken a 6.5% pay cut in that time....
Or be on long term sick mandated by a Dr ...and seek permission to go to their home country to be with loved ones ....only to be denied ..
Or have their body decide that it's sick leading up to leave and realise that its punitive as against any other time of the year...
Or have tea & biccies after an unstable approach having gone into discretion only to realise that the 6o minute prior push back start of duty was actually when the skipper was doing the walk around ...
Or....... etc etc
It seems Tom and Smoothie need to wait six years down the road and see that they have taken a 6.5% pay cut in that time....
Or be on long term sick mandated by a Dr ...and seek permission to go to their home country to be with loved ones ....only to be denied ..
Or have their body decide that it's sick leading up to leave and realise that its punitive as against any other time of the year...
Or have tea & biccies after an unstable approach having gone into discretion only to realise that the 6o minute prior push back start of duty was actually when the skipper was doing the walk around ...
Or....... etc etc
Join Date: Jun 2008
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And now back to original thread topic...
FACT: In the last month 11 pilots have left. 3 of those would fit in the "above 50" category. What strikes me is that 5 guys were less than 4 years in the company and should come up to upgrade, but chose to leave, also forfitting the provident money that would only pay out (at 75%) after 5 years.
Seniority list grew by only 4 pilots in the same period. Hardly enough to allow for any expansion, is it...
I have 2 years to go until 5 and then Iīm bailing, unless there is substantial improvement to rostering and vacation policies, thatīs my main beef.
I would definitely consider going back to my little liked Europan LCC as FO for quick upgrade. A stable 5/4 roster is worth quite a lot actually... Getting your roster 7 days in advance is totally unacceptable if you have a family.
FACT: In the last month 11 pilots have left. 3 of those would fit in the "above 50" category. What strikes me is that 5 guys were less than 4 years in the company and should come up to upgrade, but chose to leave, also forfitting the provident money that would only pay out (at 75%) after 5 years.
Seniority list grew by only 4 pilots in the same period. Hardly enough to allow for any expansion, is it...
I have 2 years to go until 5 and then Iīm bailing, unless there is substantial improvement to rostering and vacation policies, thatīs my main beef.
I would definitely consider going back to my little liked Europan LCC as FO for quick upgrade. A stable 5/4 roster is worth quite a lot actually... Getting your roster 7 days in advance is totally unacceptable if you have a family.
+1
Join Date: Jun 2005
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40 new joiners the first three month....... that means if it keeps like that will be around 160 in one year........ and how many they need??? around 500???
Interesting.......
Interesting.......
Join Date: Oct 2005
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The worst enemy of a pilot is another so 'called' pilot , when personal interests come into effect these pilots will use the elbows. That's what you have got to watch out for, their handicap will be compensated for by their elbows. As for the ME companies they will "own" you, some straight of the bat while others will allow the new "maid" to get used to the lifestyle , but they will ALL pretend they OWN you after the break in period. This is what is being felt and referred to with disgust. The two buckets with either sh@t/money and whichever first. So if you are bitching and moaning, the money bucket is insufficiently covered for, while the Bull is reaching tsunami levels and you have no exit plan/opportunity. I truly feel sorry for you , because now you are a property/asset. Unionizing is or will probably be dealt with very harshly from the governmental side so I recommend to be very quite and work on the problem, coz no one here will be able to help you. And I really would like to help like any other person would like to help.
Telling the truth is neither easy nor appreciated....
Telling the truth is neither easy nor appreciated....
Join Date: Dec 2002
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Actually JAA - you took the bit.
My and those of others posts have alterior motives - and it's working.
Cue title.
I'd like to know where his appetizer and main course are - judging by Toms current location.
f.
My and those of others posts have alterior motives - and it's working.
Cue title.
I'd like to know where his appetizer and main course are - judging by Toms current location.
f.
Last edited by fliion; 22nd Mar 2015 at 12:07.
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Boeingrestricted
There is no sense of EK owning us and I don't feel for one minute that EK own me in any way. We don't complain because we feel trapped here but for the very reason that we share frustration at seeing what was once a great company being greatly eroded to a shadow of its former self.
Take note that 40% of those that I have flown with in 2015 so far have expressed a desire to leave and have planned exit strategies in place.
There is very much life after EK and it is a life with a strong pulse in the present climate. A lot more will leave and this is the calm before the storm.
There is no sense of EK owning us and I don't feel for one minute that EK own me in any way. We don't complain because we feel trapped here but for the very reason that we share frustration at seeing what was once a great company being greatly eroded to a shadow of its former self.
Take note that 40% of those that I have flown with in 2015 so far have expressed a desire to leave and have planned exit strategies in place.
There is very much life after EK and it is a life with a strong pulse in the present climate. A lot more will leave and this is the calm before the storm.
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Always- what do you mean with financial issues!? If we exchange the salary from Dirhams on the EK career site, this is at the moment 7500 tsd euros.. With no expenses!? If my wife and kid would spent 50 euros a day. This will leave me still a large amount per month to save etc!? Can you collaborate what I am not seeing with facts expenses in DXB?
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Tom watched this...
https://youtu.be/A53VRz_KhnY
Your experience may differ.
Present results may not indicate future performance.
Caveat Emptor.
The film is...well...interesting. Considering RH was escorted out of the building, Meydan was just around the corner, leave was being granted and rosters were well below 90 hours.
Some of this video is actual truth. Its up to the viewer to figure out how much.
Your experience may differ.
Present results may not indicate future performance.
Caveat Emptor.
The film is...well...interesting. Considering RH was escorted out of the building, Meydan was just around the corner, leave was being granted and rosters were well below 90 hours.
Some of this video is actual truth. Its up to the viewer to figure out how much.