Eagle Jet A320 300 hour LT 79,000€
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€79,000
If you got hired afterwards on A320 average salary is approx €8,000 PCM
If you wanted to pay the LT off over a period of say 3 years
Then 79,000 \ 36 = 2194 - from original 8,000 & your left with around 5806 PCM
I could live off this easily, my
Problem is raising the capital in the first place.
Also there is no guarantee you may get hired afterwards. But I think you would be more likley to get hired than to not get hired with time on type.
Also have you noticed how the cost of LT has gone up over the years
2011 - $29,000 for 500 hrs
2012 - $40,000 for 500 hrs
2013 - €60,000 for 500 hrs (notice how everyone changed to euro around this point)
2014 - €79,000 for 300 hrs!
The T&C for LT are getting worse every year the golden age of paying 30k with job contract at the end are over, now even less hours for more money & no job contracts after to build more time
If you got hired afterwards on A320 average salary is approx €8,000 PCM
If you wanted to pay the LT off over a period of say 3 years
Then 79,000 \ 36 = 2194 - from original 8,000 & your left with around 5806 PCM
I could live off this easily, my
Problem is raising the capital in the first place.
Also there is no guarantee you may get hired afterwards. But I think you would be more likley to get hired than to not get hired with time on type.
Also have you noticed how the cost of LT has gone up over the years
2011 - $29,000 for 500 hrs
2012 - $40,000 for 500 hrs
2013 - €60,000 for 500 hrs (notice how everyone changed to euro around this point)
2014 - €79,000 for 300 hrs!
The T&C for LT are getting worse every year the golden age of paying 30k with job contract at the end are over, now even less hours for more money & no job contracts after to build more time
Last edited by Alive; 25th Apr 2014 at 06:17. Reason: Add info
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In Turkey, there is an offer on A320 for 49.500€ for the LT (500hrs)
But you need to do the TR and the BT with them which is 21.000€.
So total cost is around 70.000€
Still need a place to live and some food to eat...
The chance to get assessments seems quite high and the chance to get a job are quite interesting as well! Hard to say... It is a BIG choice but if you think that it would put you on the RHS you have to try!
Good luck!
But you need to do the TR and the BT with them which is 21.000€.
So total cost is around 70.000€
Still need a place to live and some food to eat...
The chance to get assessments seems quite high and the chance to get a job are quite interesting as well! Hard to say... It is a BIG choice but if you think that it would put you on the RHS you have to try!
Good luck!
Last edited by Jean-Francois; 25th Apr 2014 at 06:22. Reason: Add info
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In the night Garden - the 79k is not salary! That is a lump sum you the pilot pays to eaglejet for the LT! There are no salaries or benefits when in LT
The cost is so high for the following reasons
1.) there is not only a surplus of newly qualified pilots, but now there us a surplus of pilots with the funds to pay the 80+K LT fees (supply & demand)
2.) there are only a few airlines that do LT and slots are limited
In terms of real money spent to allow you to do LT the only cost the airline incurs is the cost of a safety pilot, in most cases safety pilots receive a fixed fee for being safety pilot normally around say between 40 - 60 USD per flight
40 x 300 = 9000 USD
Original investment 79,000 EUR
You do the math, these schemes are almost 100% margin for profit
The cost is so high for the following reasons
1.) there is not only a surplus of newly qualified pilots, but now there us a surplus of pilots with the funds to pay the 80+K LT fees (supply & demand)
2.) there are only a few airlines that do LT and slots are limited
In terms of real money spent to allow you to do LT the only cost the airline incurs is the cost of a safety pilot, in most cases safety pilots receive a fixed fee for being safety pilot normally around say between 40 - 60 USD per flight
40 x 300 = 9000 USD
Original investment 79,000 EUR
You do the math, these schemes are almost 100% margin for profit
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I see the future of LT extending to pilots with time on type
We will very soon have a surplus of pilots which fall in to the 300-500 hours in type category.
I see eagle jet introducing a new pay to fly for this market, a LT scheme for the 300-500 hour on type pilots
But you can only apply with time on type, Lion are would be a perfect airline dor this as they require 250 on type to join now.
Paying for command with 3000 TT is already available
In next 10 years I reckon the newly qualified pilot would need to go through initial LT the hours on type LT the pay to command until a well paid job would be within reach, sad but a bit if truth in there
We will very soon have a surplus of pilots which fall in to the 300-500 hours in type category.
I see eagle jet introducing a new pay to fly for this market, a LT scheme for the 300-500 hour on type pilots
But you can only apply with time on type, Lion are would be a perfect airline dor this as they require 250 on type to join now.
Paying for command with 3000 TT is already available
In next 10 years I reckon the newly qualified pilot would need to go through initial LT the hours on type LT the pay to command until a well paid job would be within reach, sad but a bit if truth in there
Where do people get the money for this??
I sweated blood to pay for my modular training but did it all on a hand to mouth basis. I couldn't even save a lump sum half as big as LT when employed to put down as a deposit on my flat!
I sweated blood to pay for my modular training but did it all on a hand to mouth basis. I couldn't even save a lump sum half as big as LT when employed to put down as a deposit on my flat!
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Alive - Im sorry but what 320 jobs do you know that pay EUR8k pm starting? Plus you haven't taken into account tax or interest in any of your calculations.
Be realistic with the figures and just to add i'd stay well away from paying for all this without a job!
Be realistic with the figures and just to add i'd stay well away from paying for all this without a job!
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Tell me about it I am I'm same position would really love to progress but just don't have the capital.
Another thing to consider is hidden costs such as day to day money for going out, accommodation, food & drink etc
I qualified end of last year and tried for the Fly Dubai type qualification programme but didn't get it, now have 100k of debt to pay off!
Most folks work there whole life to pay off there houses and retire, Im gonna work my whole life to pay off my training.
Since this fly dubai scam went tits up I have had major fall out with parents, lost my GF of 5 years & lost touch with most of my freinds due to the sheer demand flight training consumes.
The 100 grand is secured against my parents home and is being paid over 20 year repayments!! I also borrowed 10k from the bank and used my entire life savings 20k to get this far fATPL & MECIR with 737NG type.
To say im in a hole would be an understatement
I would love to know where people get the money for this LT?!?!!
Another thing to consider is hidden costs such as day to day money for going out, accommodation, food & drink etc
I qualified end of last year and tried for the Fly Dubai type qualification programme but didn't get it, now have 100k of debt to pay off!
Most folks work there whole life to pay off there houses and retire, Im gonna work my whole life to pay off my training.
Since this fly dubai scam went tits up I have had major fall out with parents, lost my GF of 5 years & lost touch with most of my freinds due to the sheer demand flight training consumes.
The 100 grand is secured against my parents home and is being paid over 20 year repayments!! I also borrowed 10k from the bank and used my entire life savings 20k to get this far fATPL & MECIR with 737NG type.
To say im in a hole would be an understatement
I would love to know where people get the money for this LT?!?!!
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Last post on this as I don't even want to entertain it but i'd double check the sources of them figures and make sure your talking EUR and not $ and even then 8k is a stretch for JFO.
Not having a pop just saying if your seriously thinking of spending that kind of cash I would make sure you've got some realistic numbers.
Good luck to everyone on getting a job none the less!
Not having a pop just saying if your seriously thinking of spending that kind of cash I would make sure you've got some realistic numbers.
Good luck to everyone on getting a job none the less!
Last edited by JulietSierra6; 25th Apr 2014 at 09:13.
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Prostitution. 
. WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU JUMP INTO THIS.
If you do so, you are an respectless person to all your flying colleagues. Because this SCAM brings down the T&C's.
People who get them selves in deep s..t because of this. I dont feel sorry for you guys. You had a choice when you started your initial flight training. To do it or not.
Myself I am also jobless, but I am looking for other ways to get in. And with a bit of luck I get good news today, for another job in aviation.
Just sending out 100's of CV's does not work.
Taking the way of the least resistance says a lot about your character. I would not really like to be with you in one plane. And that is an understatement.
Actually these days , NOT the best pilots are sitting in RHS, but the retards who are stupid enough to pay for that seat, and accepting to work for 0 or low salary.
I'd rather be jobless, then working for such conditions.
Paying for initial rating with afterwords a job and long term contract with PROPER salary is a different story. For instance FR. You pay for training. And if you work hard, then you will make it through your Line Check. Then you have 0 hour contract, but you will fly around 70 hours atleast per month. And payment per hour aint bad.
. WHY THE HELL WOULD YOU JUMP INTO THIS.If you do so, you are an respectless person to all your flying colleagues. Because this SCAM brings down the T&C's.
People who get them selves in deep s..t because of this. I dont feel sorry for you guys. You had a choice when you started your initial flight training. To do it or not.
Myself I am also jobless, but I am looking for other ways to get in. And with a bit of luck I get good news today, for another job in aviation.
Just sending out 100's of CV's does not work.
Taking the way of the least resistance says a lot about your character. I would not really like to be with you in one plane. And that is an understatement.
Actually these days , NOT the best pilots are sitting in RHS, but the retards who are stupid enough to pay for that seat, and accepting to work for 0 or low salary.
I'd rather be jobless, then working for such conditions.
Paying for initial rating with afterwords a job and long term contract with PROPER salary is a different story. For instance FR. You pay for training. And if you work hard, then you will make it through your Line Check. Then you have 0 hour contract, but you will fly around 70 hours atleast per month. And payment per hour aint bad.
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I get your point, but I don't think the pilots even give the industry or their fellow pilots any consideration when going for this.
If there was a job flying A330 but to get to that job a few other pilots had to fall or loose some kind if benefit would you decline that job just to keep them happy or would you grab it with both hands and be ruthless?
I think in general pilots hate that they have to pay, but those that do are doing it 4 themselves to get ahead of the Que., people like me who cant afford it get no consideration, they just looking at the bigger picture IMO
Its like the other day I was at Alton Towers, there are 2 Queues 1 really long que for the folks that bought the standard pass & another Que. for the folk that bought the premium pass, needless to say I got the premium pass albeit at significant etc cost, but whilst the standard pass holders queued 2+ hrs to get on the ride I waited just 20 mins
Might sound funny but i think LT is the same, money talks those who have it get to where they want to be quicker
Even when you board a flight? Who gets called first? Its business & first class right?
I don't think these guys are prostitutes I just think there rich!!
If there was a job flying A330 but to get to that job a few other pilots had to fall or loose some kind if benefit would you decline that job just to keep them happy or would you grab it with both hands and be ruthless?
I think in general pilots hate that they have to pay, but those that do are doing it 4 themselves to get ahead of the Que., people like me who cant afford it get no consideration, they just looking at the bigger picture IMO
Its like the other day I was at Alton Towers, there are 2 Queues 1 really long que for the folks that bought the standard pass & another Que. for the folk that bought the premium pass, needless to say I got the premium pass albeit at significant etc cost, but whilst the standard pass holders queued 2+ hrs to get on the ride I waited just 20 mins
Might sound funny but i think LT is the same, money talks those who have it get to where they want to be quicker
Even when you board a flight? Who gets called first? Its business & first class right?
I don't think these guys are prostitutes I just think there rich!!
Last edited by Alive; 25th Apr 2014 at 09:41. Reason: More info
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Yes, I think also about fellow pilots, and about my own future. Because when you are now willing to pay for this SCAM, that means that you accept the fact, when you maybe later on get kicked out of the airline, even when you have for example 3000 hours. Getting close to Cpt. And then get kicked out for an RETARD who is willing to accept to fly for nothing and pay for his own training. That is the world upside down.
You are the one the airline needs. Without you the planes will not fly. Because you fly, the airline makes revenue. And since it is a job, they need to pay you accordingly to your responsibilities and not to forget your training. Like anywhere else in different branches.
Your comparison is not applicable to P2F Scams.
Those lines where you wait to get in whatever attraction is not applicable here. This will be always the same situation.
In aviation because of you guys willing to pay, will bring down T&C's for the guys who are already further in their flying career and for New Bees.
The experienced guys loose their seat, because why paying for an expensive pilot with experience, when you can also put there an cheap newbee pilot, willing to pay for his or her OWN training.
Myself I always think many steps ahead. Not just short term thinking. Since newbees like you and me are just in the baby shoes of our career, we have still a long road ahead. That long road I would love to fly planes till I have to go with pension. But that wont be possible, if idiots are willing to pay for their trainings and hours.
Besides above mentioned, I think like this. Treat someone else like how you wanted to get treated yourself.
I want to be treated with respect, so I treat other people with respect.
One of those ways is that I am NOT willing to pay for these kind of ****ty SCAMS.. I have studied hard to pass all my exams first attempt , and worked hard on my flying skills , and paid, although my loan aint very big, but still it still money to get my license. Now it is up to airlines to decide if they want to take me or not.
If you work hard, you get what you deserve.
From my class, 1 had an pilot job within 2,5 months. He even could choose between 2 airlines. One he had to pay for rating, but had permanent contract. The other one he did not have to pay for his rating, and even got salary. He just signed a bond.
So it is possible. As long as you play it smart.
As I mentioned in my last post, I hope to get accepted in an EU airline for a non Pilot job first. When I am in, I build useful experience in that role, and will give my self for the full 100% for that job. Listen good and learn everyday new things, and who know, maybe in some time I get job in RHS later on.
Be patient, and try other ways to get into aviation. That does not always need to be straight into the cockpit in RHS. Everything you pick up in other roles, could be very useful when you are a pilot. You know the situation where those people have to deal with, the ones who do your job which you did as a non pilot, and together with that experience you are stronger as a team.
Again. The way of least resistance is hardly ever the best way. Only if you are a short term thinker.
You are the one the airline needs. Without you the planes will not fly. Because you fly, the airline makes revenue. And since it is a job, they need to pay you accordingly to your responsibilities and not to forget your training. Like anywhere else in different branches.
Your comparison is not applicable to P2F Scams.
Those lines where you wait to get in whatever attraction is not applicable here. This will be always the same situation.
In aviation because of you guys willing to pay, will bring down T&C's for the guys who are already further in their flying career and for New Bees.
The experienced guys loose their seat, because why paying for an expensive pilot with experience, when you can also put there an cheap newbee pilot, willing to pay for his or her OWN training.
Myself I always think many steps ahead. Not just short term thinking. Since newbees like you and me are just in the baby shoes of our career, we have still a long road ahead. That long road I would love to fly planes till I have to go with pension. But that wont be possible, if idiots are willing to pay for their trainings and hours.
Besides above mentioned, I think like this. Treat someone else like how you wanted to get treated yourself.
I want to be treated with respect, so I treat other people with respect.
One of those ways is that I am NOT willing to pay for these kind of ****ty SCAMS.
. I have studied hard to pass all my exams first attempt , and worked hard on my flying skills , and paid, although my loan aint very big, but still it still money to get my license. Now it is up to airlines to decide if they want to take me or not.If you work hard, you get what you deserve.
From my class, 1 had an pilot job within 2,5 months. He even could choose between 2 airlines. One he had to pay for rating, but had permanent contract. The other one he did not have to pay for his rating, and even got salary. He just signed a bond.
So it is possible. As long as you play it smart.
As I mentioned in my last post, I hope to get accepted in an EU airline for a non Pilot job first. When I am in, I build useful experience in that role, and will give my self for the full 100% for that job. Listen good and learn everyday new things, and who know, maybe in some time I get job in RHS later on.
Be patient, and try other ways to get into aviation. That does not always need to be straight into the cockpit in RHS. Everything you pick up in other roles, could be very useful when you are a pilot. You know the situation where those people have to deal with, the ones who do your job which you did as a non pilot, and together with that experience you are stronger as a team.
Again. The way of least resistance is hardly ever the best way. Only if you are a short term thinker.
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If flying wasn't so enjoyable and thrilling we would never have this problem to begin with.
I often fantasies what i would be like to be a real life airline pilot, flying these big cool jets and making PA's.
Getting that big salary every month & driving back to ur flash apartment in your brand new sports car
All the female attention
Its all these perks that make guys do anything to get in that RHS
The very job of FO itself is the very cause of our problems
I often fantasies what i would be like to be a real life airline pilot, flying these big cool jets and making PA's.
Getting that big salary every month & driving back to ur flash apartment in your brand new sports car
All the female attention
Its all these perks that make guys do anything to get in that RHS
The very job of FO itself is the very cause of our problems
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Alive, I'm not going to say what everyone else would tell you about paying a #$%&load of money for a fantasy of yours that's not ever going to happen.
Don't be lazy man, do some research at least if you're so intrested about flying, I'm sick and tired of reading on this forum about people paying for 500hrs LT and hoping for a job with EY or ETD. Are you for real? Even had a look on their min requirements?
It's just not the way dude! If I had that kind of money I would consider opening up a business. Couse yes, it's not that fun to fly in the middle east and have other
as bosses. Trust me on this one!
Off that chair and put some muscle in it!
Don't be lazy man, do some research at least if you're so intrested about flying, I'm sick and tired of reading on this forum about people paying for 500hrs LT and hoping for a job with EY or ETD. Are you for real? Even had a look on their min requirements?
It's just not the way dude! If I had that kind of money I would consider opening up a business. Couse yes, it's not that fun to fly in the middle east and have other
as bosses. Trust me on this one!Off that chair and put some muscle in it!
Alive, get real. Etihad are not going to look at a cadet with 300 on type neither are Qatar. I have no idea about China Southern but I'd imagine, in any case, they are only interested in taking Captains not FO's. Your figure of predicted earnings on the A320 are staggeringly unrealistic. Believe me I know. The A320 is stated to be the "golden type rating". It speak volumes that the only jobs available with this golden type rating right now are in the Far East. Fine if you want to live out there, miles from family and friends but many don't. Of course if you want to stay in "Europe" you may fancy earning less than a bin man's salary to fly max hours at Wizz Air and even then their recruitment is about to stop for the summer. Eastern Europe is also not the most pleasant place to live and is now firmly in the sights of the Russians.
The market is astonishingly bad right now even on the A320 and even with a so-called "economic recovery" going on.
The market is astonishingly bad right now even on the A320 and even with a so-called "economic recovery" going on.