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Old 12th Jan 2012, 15:22   #1 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 777-200 East of the sun, west of the moon
Age: 31
Posts: 310
AviationCV (ASG part) Lithuania

Hello mates,
as most of you have you heard recently was and still running a 737CL program conducted from AviationCV an affiliate of ASG( avia solution Group) using the BAA TRTO center.
First group should star at the end of this month but I heard still a lot of people in dubt and perplexed as the contract does not give any safe future!
The only things for sure is: 6 years contract with a 48 thsdn bucks loan to repair !!

What are you think guys?
who is in the process to start?
what did tell you ?
which information could you provide for those that still want to apply?

I'm waiting forward to hear a lot of you very soon as well as I'm in the process to show you all the information in my possess due contacts I had from partecipants and collegue in BAA itself!
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Old 12th Jan 2012, 15:44   #2 (permalink)
pzn


Probationary PPRuNer
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: 5500
Age: 28
Posts: 4
I think:

too much money in debt
too many years (6)
too little salary
too little safety for us about contract (ex: you have to pay fine, besides the rest of 50k !!, unless they can't get job for 2 years)
Airplane not promising future, better Airbus or NG

Vantages: You can pass the first employment and get jet hours!
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Old 12th Jan 2012, 18:36   #3 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 777-200 East of the sun, west of the moon
Age: 31
Posts: 310
well,
let's start to say You that the owner of the management of AVIATIONCV dosn't know anything about aviation nor having any contact or deals with current Airline Companies.
They are new and protected under the nameof ASG (aviation Solution Group) and BAA (baltic aviation academy)and they are in the same building area of AVG and SPA (Small Planet Airlines).

CONTRACT:
-Loan of 48 thsnd bucks
-10 thsnd Bucks downpayment
-5,5 % interest rate
-6 year agreement with agency
-no garantee job after TR
-Fines if you fail to comply with any terms, training and check ( from 5 thsnd to 10 thsnd bucks )
-contract stipuleted with Ciprus pilot Managements (in Cyprus and they can close for bankrupcy in any time, as far as I know nowadays)
-if you work, loand deducted, if not ..nothing happen but...contract will be EXTENDED!!!
-if you leave the agreement repair the full amount of the Loan with fines
-if they failed to find you a job, you can leave with 15 thsnd bucks discount, but still remain 33 thsnd buck (+10 thsnd before, makes total of 43 thsnd bucks for the 737 cl 500 tt)

SALARY:
1 year= O Euros
2 year= 1500
3 year= 2000
4 year= 2500
5 year= 3000
6 year= 3500
Salary are approximately and not after deduction of the loan

STRUCTURE
Pay 10 thsnd bucks join the 737CL TR (wihout any pre-assessment, which previously was mention in the PDF illustration package and detailed in the contract).
Pre-assessment is just to assess your own quality if you wish, cost 250 Euro, not compulsory)
After TR wait till 3 months approx. (be carefull after the TR will expire) for BT and LT.
After BT( base training,6 touch&go) waiting LT (Line Training, 500 TT), SPA assessment !!!!! ( not even mentioned in the contract)
SPA assessment: Oral and practice test and final SIM Check!
If you fail the Test, leave the program but before, pay another 13 thsnd Bucks! ( 13+ initial 10= 23 thsnd bucks)
So you could pay 23.000 Euro for TR on B737 CL and left out the door!!
If you pass the assessment in SPA, start LT for 500 hours in POLAND, WAW (warsav base).
After LT...bohhhhhhhhhhhhh maybe left alone, maybe working sometimes and maybe maybe maybe.-...----.....---...--..-..-.-.
maybe finish 6 years with less than even 1000 hours and still have to repair the total loan!

CONCLUSION
For Apllicant: Too may traps , too many risks, few guarantees, effective opportunities to work equal to zero, too many steps, slave of Aviation CV for minimum 6 years!

For AviationCV: sure to take 58.000 bucks + interest rates in their pocket

THE DREAM
Only best scenario...everything is fine , you work for all the time and you finish your bond achieving +4000 TT on JAr 25.
Sure scenario same as one day you will see a PIG is flying in the Skies.


SUGGESTIONS

Dear pilotsleave this story just a story not even let them start this reality show.
Please think carefully and don't rush!
you are you are master of your own future, do not let others decide what to do...do not put your life in AviationCV hands!
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Old 13th Jan 2012, 14:26   #4 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: london
Posts: 4
Red face Euroavia trto

Hi guys, do you know something about their program? I tried to speak with the guy from the website but he is not so professional and doesnt say to much about the line training.... the cost of type and line is about 50000 E, so if you have something more about it please reply....
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Old 16th Jan 2012, 13:42   #5 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: On a lovely Island ...
Posts: 112
Hello any information regarding this program???
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Old 16th Jan 2012, 21:07   #6 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Europe
Posts: 17
AviationCV is a new company, they only have been existing for 7 months. The people they employ are not very good either and actually dont really understand what they are talking about.

The aim of aviationCV is to have a pool of pilots that they can lease whenever and wherever they want. At first sight this looks great even perfect for a low timer. But what I can tell you is after reading their contract and after having extensive contact with them, is that they are trying to enslave you in scheme that will cost you a lot of money to get out of. You can't terminate the contract unless you pay 50k plus a fine of 15k. They are also allowed to put you on non active for as long as they want and they dont need to be paying you. If you work you will be paid close to nothing.

They also have the intention to earn as much money on your back as possible. They make you pay for a TR of 22k with BAA (sister company). If you do a TR with BAA without going through AviationCV it will cost you 13k. And then they will earn on every part of your training.In reality what your bond should be is 30k but not 60k plus 15 k fine.

AviationCV also has no track record so it's a big step in the dark that you are taking if you decide to go forward with them. The best thing to do is to negotiate with them and make them offer you a gurantee of employment. I decided not to go forward with them is because the disadvantages weigh much more than the advantages. Please don't be blinded.

Last edited by pimp4life123456789; 16th Jan 2012 at 21:40.
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Old 18th Jan 2012, 08:24   #7 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: 14 days away 14 at home
Posts: 716
So you go and work for a new company, sign a 6 year contract with a cyprus based finance company to fly for a shaky small airline.... Compared with this Astreaus looked as stable as the bank of England.....

Agree with Pimp: this is daylight robbery. If you decide to do this than you have just failed the selection process of the university of life and you deserve such a contract
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Old 29th Jan 2012, 18:39   #8 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: boh
Posts: 95
Hi guys,
your infos were really useful!!
Doubt:
In the requirements i found:
..
"Valid TR on A320 or B737",,
TRAINING PROGRAM | LINE TRAINING | TRAINING | Aviationcv.com
so there's no need to apply for the type with them ?, i think .
Bye. !
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Old 30th Jan 2012, 21:36   #9 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Palermo
Age: 27
Posts: 16
I've asked something more about their program for pilot already rated, and they told to me that the program is: 500 hrs and after that you'll sign a contract for other 5 years. The pilot have to pay 4000 euros, and nothing else. they will take back something every month because they'll do a bond of 32000 euro. so are about 400 euro each month retracted from the salary.
If you decide to broke before the end of the contract, you have to pay 15000 euro.
Anybody know something more? Any real story about this agency?
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Old 7th Feb 2012, 07:52   #10 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: 777-200 East of the sun, west of the moon
Age: 31
Posts: 310
STAY OUT

Guys I heard lot of you are going to attend the TR course set on 14 february in LITHUANIA WITH AVIATIONCV AND BAA...Bad Idea.
Don't do that!!!!
They will treat You as A shit!!...
they will they you that the Hotel is included, yes but guys check the hotel: I can tell you, shit place, very cold, no heathers,internet troubles...room very small and breakfast counted!!!
Then what about the course:

ENGLISH= ZERO!!!!
You'll be left alone, CBT on line valid just 90 days after all nothing!!!
They will give you the Being 737 copy manual, fotocopied and printed from SMARTCOCKPIT....and many other problem!!!
They will treat You very bad and you'll not have priority of nothing as for BAA you'll be the last one in the list as per internal agreement with AviationCV.
Once again,
if You don't believe me, I can give You many contact of previous guys doing this shit scheme!!!
Believe me guys stay OUT!
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Old 9th Feb 2012, 16:32   #11 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: northpole
Posts: 19
JQKA,

Please may you explain why the hotels are sh-t?

Also please may you explain why they will treat you like sh-t?

Did you go for the assessment?

Did you pass the the assessment?


Thank you
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Old 29th Feb 2012, 07:08   #12 (permalink)


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Join Date: May 2011
Location: Vilnius
Posts: 1
Hi there,
Well I am about to apply,just a shame their both programs are closed for this year..
I found their program of TR+LT quite appealing,well maybe the bond for 5 years sounds a bit scary. But still,the nice thing is the funding is in a form of loan and you don't have to make return payments while they do not find you a job.

I have asked about their contracts with the airlines and apparently its Small Planet airlines they work with. I really don't care if its a small or big airline,all I know that even having a type rating I would have no hours and sit jobless or driving a taxi.
I had a very long conversation with Aviationcv and some of the things you guys mentioned here are really not true: for example hotel is not included into the price,they just can recommend you some. Salary that they show in the presentation is after tax and AFTER loan deducted.

Well, we all know that our job requires a lot of investment and time. Its really a shame that we, pilots with little hours, can not be valued in the market like equal players and that we have to pay to fly. its been my dream to fly from the times I was a toddler, so I am not going to stop. Of course, guys, you can chose other ways, but after long communication with AviationCV I found their program quite fair and affordable to me.
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Old 29th Feb 2012, 11:47   #13 (permalink)


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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: LEVX
Posts: 5
Hi everyone, I'm an spanish pilot who's currently in the line training program for the B737.
I've chosen to do this program after being more than one year jobless and due to my refusal to pay thousands of to companies that could be a scam or for programs after wich you pay a lot for a few hundred hours you would be jobless again...because, opposite to the other line training options I considered, this aviationcv.com option gives you the opportunity to get a job after the line training and you don't have to pay all the amount of the line training but you can return it from your future salary, so I think that's the main factor why it's different from the rest and why I've chosen it, and also the fact that I didn't pay anything until I passed the assessment with the airline, wich, to be truth, was quite difficult, and I think it's to remark that this is not an usual line training as all these that are arising this last months.

Things are going smooth and quick and I begin flying next month. I suggest you to visit Vilnius if you can, to talk with them carefully, or if you want PM me. Before someone says it, I don't work for them, it's just I wanted you to have the opinion from someone who's in the program and just don't understand when reading some opinions made by people that don't understand the program very well as they were inside. Feel free to PM me.

Best regards and good flights for everyone!
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Old 2nd Mar 2012, 14:30   #14 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: northpole
Posts: 19
Dear Patto,

I do agree with your views to a certain degree, but you must also consider that the bond carries interest which will be added from the day you start the contract.

I do understand that you won't be paying when you don't work but you still have to pay the bond amount back in 5 years, so if you are not working that's ok only if the bond is interest free.

I hope this makes sense and if you can pay the bond quickly then do so, or you will have to pay alot in 5 years.


One more question, SPA only have 6 737's in their fleet and they've got 20 guys in the pipeline for LT, that tells me they will be laying off F/O's in order to fly you guys on line. But the main question is what will happen once you've got your 500 hrs, because there's already a queue behind you.

These days you have to think commercially, such as how long will you be sitting in the RHS and how much it is going to cost you. Those days of flying with respect are over.

Please do keep us updated as my views could be totally wrong.
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Old 2nd Mar 2012, 17:43   #15 (permalink)


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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: LEVX
Posts: 5
Dear 737Max,
You are right about all you say but, of course, I want to add that I think in the optmistic way, not in a situation in wich the worse is going to happen. But knowing the staff and the organization that is behind this program, I'm feeling safer here than choosing any other option I had.
About SPA, as a charter company, its market is very volatile and changing, so they just recruit pilots adjusting to their punctual needs (except a basic pool), so basically, if they like you, they will consider to take you always they need rated and 737 experienced pilots. Is a company with a lot of movement. Let's see what happens but I like the way they work and I'll do of course my best to make them like the way I perform!

Best regards and even better flights!
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Old 9th May 2012, 19:40   #16 (permalink)


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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Cockpit
Posts: 1
Hello, guys, I'm on a hunt for some rumors about about this AviationCV company as I was contacted by the company with a very vague request to send my CV. Anybody know anything about this company? Are they a recruitment agency or just a leasing company? There is very little information on their website.
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Old 28th May 2012, 14:22   #17 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: SKYLAND
Posts: 204
Well guys,
I've been reading all your post, specially negative ones, and I can't understand why such words, and why from people that I even don't know as I'm in the program and I know very well the people involved and the agency.
What can I say right now to all of you, interested people, that the program runs for the first time this early 2012 and I was one of the first lucky person to join in the program.
Yes of course, it require a small amount of money, but where nowadays you can find fligh deck position for free and be in the same time low hours pilot??...nowhere!!
Now all are asking for huge amount of money and the difference here is AVIATIONCV, an agency willing to help low hours pilot to achieve they dreams and let them to take off.....with a very small amount of money.
People at AviationCV, are great and very nice, working with them is not like a normal agency but you will feel like been part of a family.
Of course it depends also from you, because you will be asked to study and pass the assessment otherwise you will not start! it's not just money as most of you are thinking.
Now the selection for this year are closed and this is another prove of the genuine program...why?-....because they could invite more and more people and let them to pay for the assessment and fail them, so to achieve some money!! but they didn't!!
So please guys, try to think carefully and to distinguish real people stories and bullshit!
Till today with other 7 people we are flying for an airline company and I'm sure this will help for our future career.
I'm putting this post as I'm not only in the program but I like people in AviationCV as they helped me and continue help me so I felt that is not correct in their respect to receive this bad propaganda and this guys must stop lying to yourselves.

P.s.
If someone wants some real information about all the process fell free to contact me in private
Bye bye
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Old 29th May 2012, 18:19   #18 (permalink)


Probationary PPRuNer
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 2
Aviation CV

Hello Guys, I am relatively new to PPRuNe and have found many of the threads and comments in previous forums very useful however this is the first one I have had personal experience of.

It is fair to say that aviationcv do come across as a very professional company and to a point I think they are. Their responses to emails and queries are very quick and they even send out Christmas cards... small things amuse small minds I guess. The contract was also sent within a few days of showing an interest, the cynic in me finding that a little odd.

Cutting a long story short I was ready to sign on the dotted line but for whatever reason stopped and asked for some legal advise, just to double check the contract. I was somewhat unnerved of the response I received. There were 3 pages of queries and questions with a couple of points where my legal adviser (he works directly with aviation contracts and other exciting things...) said I should not proceed.

One point specifically highlights that you are expected to fly when told irrespective of whether the flight is illegal or dangerous. Sound like I am being a little bit 'wet' however is it not fair to comment that this sounds like 'commercial pressure' before even on the flight deck. There were many more alarming points.

I could drone on for a while. I am a cadet and I am looking for the foot in the door like many on here. Those that are in the scheme I wish them the best of luck and for the rest of us, we just must keep plugging on!

Thoughts comments appreciated.
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Old 30th May 2012, 08:54   #19 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: 14 days away 14 at home
Posts: 716
@Precision you did the right thing. Off course it is great to "be part of the family" as AXL point's out but if that family is the mafia I think you might reconsider....

Yes you all want a job but signing your heart away to a new company for 5 years through a strange Cyprus construction should really put your guard up. AXL thinks it is all great and I wish him the best off luck. But I am more interested to hear from him in 3 years time when the pink glasses are removed.. Experience shows that all these special programs tend to die after a while and leave most people crying on the wayside...
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Old 30th May 2012, 13:08   #20 (permalink)
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: SKYLAND
Posts: 204
Precision22:

I like YOU I had a lot of concern when i saw and read all the contract, but it's not so bad like it seems...I was just lucky because I was already familiar with this type of contract and specially with the Agency located in Cyprus.
If you had any doubt then , you are grown up enough I think as You want to be a pilot, so in my opinion you should go there and see them personally, ask them, get your replies and so on....try to assure yourself..or better try to understand if is worth or not!
What do you think guys??...that we are all stupid because we applied then? ..i don't think so..even because I know all other my collegues, and I can tell you that they are very clever and professional people not mention even good pilots.
The difference between who applied and who didn't is the INFORMATION...
we get all the information we needed it and we got our assurance, that's the point.
Precision22 in the same time I respect your choice.


No RYR for me:

Dear my friend,
first of all I don't have pink glassess...As I don't need any glasses
Secondly Before to tell you..I just want let you know that i'm not the first "stupid" felt down in this industry but I know what i choose..I'm in the aviation industry more than 9 years and I have a lot of connection and know a lot of airlines, but I never found anything free...after 2002...so I decided to join in this program, but as I told to Precision22, i did my research before..that's all!!
All the contract, specially in Aviation, seems to be very tricky and actually they are..not just the contract of AVIATIONCV..but try to have a look, QA agreement or KA agreement etc..etc.
I'm not agree with you about calling them MAFIA...as I don't even understand the reason.
They give you a service, different from others: you don't have to pay for the line...they ask you and advance of 4000 euro..and then you sign the contract for 5 years...is that a problem??..
I mean in the mean time after your LT they will try to find you a job...or maybe you will find, and you will repair the Loan...But they give you the opportunity to start to fly and to be in the market with "no"money...and they did not ask you for money if you are jobless..
If they are Mafia like you said...in my opinion all the word are Mafia and the banks first of all...or maybe you are living in a word that is not yours

Be positive, not judge, know before...
and sure I will be here whenever you want..I will update you about me and my career as a Pilot...
I saw your Join date is even 2 years before mine..and you still here writing or better criticizing..and if I can give You a suggestion, try to make much effort in finding a Company where to fly!


have good discussion!

Last edited by axl76fg; 30th May 2012 at 13:13.
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