The 747 sim still exists, no knowledge of whether it’s planned for recruitment use though.

I think the recruitment team already have an idea of the rough numbers required for each fleet. They know that 95+% of internal bidders are unfrozen, so that'll cover most if not all LH and SH Captain slots. The only outstanding question will be how much SH recruitment is required to backfill those leaving SH for pastures new I think.

Obviously this is all based on a forward looking plan, based on current projections of demand etc. Personally I don't think it'll change too much, but if you can predict the future you'd be better off playing the lottery than being a pilot.

Thanks for the answers. Wow 787, I guess the 320 sims are under extreme pressure. I don't think I know of anyone doing assessment prep on a 787 just yet. Do they usually give much notice between interview and sim?

An a320 sim would hardly be a challenge, would it?

surely the purpose of shelling out to hire a 787 sim for ‘prep’ defeats the objective of an assessment…?

I had the impression the BA sim assessment was more about teamwork and making sound decisions, than about the ability to fly a given aircraft to within an inch of its life. That’s not to say you shouldn’t brush up on raw data flying etc.

My username is just a username ;)

Anyway any jobs I've been applying to have all used narrowbody aircraft so 787 is definitely not the norm, unless you're rated on it and going for a job on it so. I agree regarding assessment prep, but they exist for a reason and genuinely do boost your chances as I have experienced.

I'm also sure that's the case, as it is with nearly all airlines. However the more familiar you are with a particular environment and particular aircraft's characteristics, the more spare capacity you will have which you can use to focus on the soft skills.

Any decent sim assessor would be able to tell if a 320 rated pilot had practice on a 787 sim… Pretty sure they used to discourage prep sims, iirc.

I can understand where you are coming from. The thing is though, these assessments are exams. You don't go to any exam without preparing the best you possibly can (certainly not exams you seriously want to pass anyway), this includes mock exams for A levels etc. They do it because it works. A prep sim is essentially a mock exam. I can't talk for BA, but I have been to 3 airline open days where the pilot speakers actively encouraged doing it and made strong arguments for them.

I don't like them entirely because I think lots of them price gouge, but that's mostly down to a lack of serious competition in that particular market and is an entirely different conversation.

Preparing for a sim assessment should never be a bad thing and shows an early enthusiasm towards the job position. Wether this be a practice sim session or just some armchair flying. . Perhaps circumstances such as cadet entry level would I possibly advise against it if I was an assessor, Only so that you get a clear indication of someone’s natural ability to learn and improve throughout the session.

Any ideas as to when BA will start arranging interviews?

If you are out of practice, I would certainly recommend plenty of raw data flying to up your capacity and scan rate.

Has anyone heard back from submitting the online application yet or are they just waiting to garner a stack of interested applications before sifting through them?

You should answer the questions very carefully and spend considerable time on the application up to a week.
The HR department can spot the ‘back of a fag packet’ responses,they’ve seen it hundreds of times before.
Before submission ask your soulmate to critique it..
When you reach the interview stage,download IAG Financial Results for 2021.Enormous amount of information including sections such as the threats facing the company.You need to present yourself as someone who stands out for the right reasons.Good Luck.

What has anyone put for the salary expected question? I don’t want to undervalue myself or come across greedy, any advice?

I just put the salary they advertised for the euroflyer position ..

Makes sense, thanks 👍🏻

I don’t recall such a question being asked during the last recruitment process. I’m not quite sure why it’s being asked, as my understanding is pay isn’t based on previous experience or individual performance.

Indeed the application form appears to have been ‘streamlined’ and is now basically very much ‘upload your CV, answer this one question and good luck!’

Notwithstanding the above, I’d echo the advice to answer any questions put carefully.

When is the last time management came in the crewroom and asked: "Nigel(lette), what should we do, the shareholders aren't happy?". The only reason for a pilot to know about the financial performance of the company they are applying for, is to make sure they can pay him. HR should be interested if they are a good pilot. HR asking pilots about company financials makes as much sense as HR asking accountants applying at BA to recite 747 engine fire memory items. And yes, with this attitude I will not get hired at BA, Got it, Thanks!

Hans,I think with respect you are missing my point.Having been on the team a question often asked was ‘what are the threats facing The Company’ This is not exclusive to Flight Ops.
Good Luck.

It shows that the person is keen to get the job & is willing to put in the extra work to get it

Slightly off topic but where on earth do LHR short haul Nigels live? Quick glance at rentals in West London is enough to make your eyes water.

No, I will respectfully disagree. Have applied for countless jobs, have been asked all the questions, jumped through all the hoops, and understand about putting the extra work in to get the job. Got my last job by going to HQ with my CV in hand, uninvited. And with 10 years to go, at (hopefully) my final airline, will try to go the extra mile for the company to succeed every time I am in uniform. When I look for a job I look at how they will treat me. And I just happen to believe that the only reason the company will do good is if they treat their employees right, before they treat the customers right. Me knowing about the financials and threats is for me. They should be interested in what extra I would bring to MY job, to make theirs easier.

in the home counties where rents are less harmful to the optical equipment

Even Home Counties, Herts, Sussex, Berks etc. They’re tremendously expensive places. A look on rightmove- £1000/month gets you 1 perhaps 2 bed noddy and big ears box - some look like they’ve been the scene of the odd crime. £700/800 month a room share. Student life. Not so ok when you’re 30s onwards. Suppose depends if single or spouse can contribute. Children etc.

You can start further away down the M4 or up the M40 but you’re into petrol cost and sometimes hotels before earlies and extra duty hours at the beginning and end of your day sitting on the motorway in traffic.

Best stretching it as far as you can feel comfortable driving without dipping frequently into hotel before duties territory. That’s the road to notown doing that long term. You’ll blow lots of your time off and money on hotels and fuel just to do the job and it’ll drive you crackers eventually. I’m in that position, not by choice. I think it’s sometimes overlooked that BA agreed pay is fairly good but it’s perversely a very expensive job to do. Either upping one’s life to live nearby or spending £300-£900 a month getting to and from work with hotels/petrol or flights. That’s £3k-£9k a year allowing for leave. So as a commuter knock £5k min off the annual salary (and the delta too)

My advice if you’re looking at doing the BA thing with years on SH is draw a circle around Heathrow based on a radius of time factoring in you’ll have been operating knackered for long duties. It won’t actually be a proper circle as going too far round the M25 means 30/45 mins say is awful close whereas it’ll arc out a little more down the M4. (On a bad time of the day 30 mins still has you watching aircraft take off above your car just outside Heathrow)

Good luck.

Cheers Jack. Bit past flatting in Twickers at my age but you never know. At least it’s close to the footy field!

...
My understanding is that the Delta salary subtraction (expected to be minus 9% next year) is applicable to all BA and Euroflyer new hire headline salaries as well as to existing pilots.

See the BA Delta thread - https://www.pprune.org/terms-endearm...pay-cut-2.html - and the BA pilots current ballot on the subject.

You might wish to factor that into your salary expectation and the advertised salary.

Warning - Questioning the Delta or why Easy LGW pilots get paid 50 % more for the same job, or mentioning the ongoing Osborne/BA Employment Tribunal case - https://www.gov.uk/employment-tribun...841-slash-2020
- may well be fail points.

Good luck to you all ... LFH
...

I've been told by 2 close colleagues already working at BA that they're confident that the 'delta' doesn't apply to new colleagues (something that everyone - almost rightly - seems to be dearly bitter about). Contradicts the consensus on here though that Delta will apply to everyone - Anyone got a concrete answer?

I think it'd be a difficult pill to swallow when you're asked to sign a contract with a stated pay scale and then someone says "actually, we're running a payout at the moment so this isn't accurate.."

PRP (redundant pilots) do not have the delta paycut, new hires externally, do. as mentioned previously in the thread.

With the best will in the world (and an understanding that airlines throw logic and reasoning out the window regularly), why would a new hire be expected to take the ‘delta’? If the purpose was to save jobs and retain talent through the various hold pools that are now empty, why would the delta continue, let alone be a burden of an external hire? Do the PRP waive the pay cut simply due to being based at Gatters?

No, Lot of PRP are based at LHR. I suppose reasoning is that the Delta arose from Balpa sort of 'selecting' the pilots in the PRP and the cost difference associated, so they could hardly make the PRP pay for their own redundancy, hence why PRP is exempt.

Pools might be empty but BA pilots/ balpa signed the delta deal in 2020, doesn't mean it goes away.

You might sign a mortgage, if your house price falls doesn't mean the mortgage goes away just because the market has changed...

If said new hire doesn't want the delta, no one is forcing them to submit the application and go through a three-step hiring process to join.

Thanks. Makes sense, I guess quite the faux pas from BA BALPA to let that be indefinite.

Edit: to use the mortgage example, if you signed a 3% interest mortgage and were stuck in it and then they advertised a new rate of 2% to new customers, why would the new customer have to accept the 3% just because you did historically?

Wasn’t the danger that a new entrant could be on a higher salary than a pilot currently working for BA?

If new hires didn’t pay it, there’d be 3 scales. The A scale- PP24 people paying a delta. The B scale - you guys- new joiners not paying a delta and the C scale - current PP34 pilots hit with the delta.

The terms they will trumpet in Q and As are the terms we’ve seen challenged year on year

For what it’s worth there’s hardly a non management pilot that thinks anyone should be paying this permanant (if you’re over 30 something) pay cut/tax

the customer can go to a different bank…? Or stay with their current bank. Nothing forcing them to go through the process with this bank and signing up for a mortgage.

Alright so my banking metaphor wasn’t great! The appeal (as has always been) of BA is the longevity and variety your career can have there, along with a decent paycheque. I’m not saying that anyone is forced into applying, but it doesn’t make sense to me that a new entrant would be presented with a pay scale and then told that a random, incalculable percentage will be deducted monthly from now until retirement. Internally, whilst still an awful deal, it was at least accepted by the union and its members. Isn’t the delta up for negotiation at present anyhow? Surely it can’t last much longer.

In terms of multiple scales; just playing devil’s advocate but it sounds like a great way to divide pilots and reduce faith in the union. Not that the company would like to do that or anything…

not saying it’s fair, but applications are inundated and this thread is full of people desparate to apply at any cost (even when people applying weakens Balpas negotiating position) so that all that really needs to be said … some sheep will do anything even when warned by multiple sources.

BA has always been inundated by applications whenever DEP opens up, and frankly I can’t see that changing anytime soon. Whilst things are far from rosy at BA, and weren’t when I was there, you only have to visit for instance, the Middle East forum to see that the grass isn’t necessarily greener elsewhere.

That’s not to say there are no better options out there, that depends on your views and your situation…a young, single person with no financial commitments could view BA in a very different light to someone with a mortgage and family in their mid 30s…

As for BALPA/BA ….no comment.

Applications don’t weaken too much. It’s weakened only if those guys actually accept a contract with the Delta. If all applicants refused it, it would strengthen their position. However, sadly I can’t see many purple Airbus operators refusing a contract even with the pay cut.

I mean an application to ba is as good as accepting it. Huge interest to join the company hardly does balpas case justice….

same principle different label whatever