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Originally Posted by Akrapovic
(Post 10591179)
It does matter if 50 people walk in above you . . .
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Not clear from Seabreeze1 post whether 50 ex tcx skippers are being employed as DEC or FO |
They are after 50 ex Thomas Cook DEC.
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Originally Posted by 763 jock
(Post 10591290)
They are after 50 ex Thomas Cook DEC.
TUI Airways will create jobs for over 100 pilots and over 200 cabin crew, with 50 Thomas Cook pilots guaranteed to fill the vacancies. Dawn Wilson, managing director for TUI Airways said: "We are delighted that our additional flying allows us to grow our team of ‘moment makers’ at TUI Airways"Every year we welcome new cabin crew and pilots and this year is set to be our biggest and best yet. "I’m particularly proud to be able to commit to offering over 50 Thomas Cook Captains the opportunity to join TUI Airways and continue to fly customers on their holidays.” So of the 100 pilot jobs they’re all DEC with 50 going to ex TCX? 🤔 |
Its 100 pilots, 50 of which are TCX DEC. Who will join the bottom of the seniority list as captains. Round of applause to whoever came up with that. |
Originally Posted by pudoc
(Post 10591397)
Its 100 pilots, 50 of which are TCX DEC. Who will join the bottom of the seniority list as captains. Round of applause to whoever came up with that. |
I think if you read the communication released by TUI and by their CC it is clear that they are taking the 50 TCX skippers on because they don't have the training capacity to promote enough FO's into the left seats created by the sudden rapid and unexpected expansion of their s20 operation. Now, in a balanced world the TUI FO's in the command pool may feel aggrieved, but had TCX not gone bust it is likely that the same number of them will have got upgraded as will now. Handled badly, this could really sour industrial relations, but it really shouldn't if sufficient effort is made to explain to the TUI FO's that they have not been disadvantaged. Sadly, history tends to not show that hese things are handled well, so fingers crossed eh?
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Airline managers will do what they want to make a profit. Make no mistake, your career aspirations mean nothing to them. This will be sold to the TUI pilots as being far better than 3rd party ACMI being used to fill the void. Either way, the result is the same. |
Originally Posted by 763 jock
(Post 10591546)
Airline managers will do what they want to make a profit. Make no mistake, your career aspirations mean nothing to them. This will be sold to the TUI pilots as being far better than 3rd party ACMI being used to fill the void. Either way, the result is the same. Totally correct. The fleet preference has always been Boeing and this is obviously a short term plug - Good move from TUI to secure airframes and crew at a lower price and to grow ...... This will no doubt leave significant backlash from existing crew but surely the DEC or Crews will be joining bottom of the rank - nevertheless this will significantly increase the time to command for experienced FOs |
Originally Posted by macdo
(Post 10591524)
I think if you read the communication released by TUI and by their CC it is clear that they are taking the 50 TCX skippers on because they don't have the training capacity to promote enough FO's into the left seats created by the sudden rapid and unexpected expansion of their s20 operation. Now, in a balanced world the TUI FO's in the command pool may feel aggrieved, but had TCX not gone bust it is likely that the same number of them will have got upgraded as will now. Handled badly, this could really sour industrial relations, but it really shouldn't if sufficient effort is made to explain to the TUI FO's that they have not been disadvantaged. Sadly, history tends to not show that hese things are handled well, so fingers crossed eh?
I have always shrugged my shoulders and said “decent career move can’t knock it” when many an FO I’ve flown with over the last number of years has said they are joining TUI. For what’s it’s worth I won’t be anymore if this shambles goes ahead. I wish no bad on the TCX guys, but I genuinely feel for the guys in the RHS at TUI. Its absolutely wrong and you know it MACDO. Would this have happened in TCX if the roles were reversed? |
If TUI are getting extra aircraft at short notice then yes it makes sense i'm afraid - if you promote 50 TUI FO you also need to recruit 50 FO to replace them and 50 for the extra aircraft.
TUI are taking advantage of TC demise and why shouldn't they. The thing TUI must do however is keep promoting FO's for the current establishment such that the current (loyal) FO's are not discriminated against. I'm sure BALPA have put this message over strongly. They should also say that should any of the 50 DEC leave then they are replaced by TUI FO rather than more DEC such that the (loyal) FO's benefit again. This is NNUTS - Nothing New Under The Sun - many other airlines have done this before |
Did Tui do a similar thing back in 2004( roughly) with the creation of Thomsonfly? What happened then? I can’t remember, I’m not with Tui. |
This happened at BA when British Midland disappeared and there were restrictions on what the direct entry captains could do. Subsequently not all were happy with their lot. It would be interesting to know how that has developed. Given the airbus versus boeing split with TC and Thomson I wonder what they are going to be flying? |
Seen why they have done it but totally disagree with it. Always saw it coming this though TBH. what if another credit crunch happens or the Brexit things explodes? Another 5yrs waiting! With guys junior to you making a lot more cash and holding Lhs. |
There are no Boeing pilots from TCX. It has been all Airbus for a while. A handful might be able to do a quick LPC to get the 757 renewed. But only a few. |
Have the ex-TCX pilots who overwhelmingly voted to stop any DECs at TCX now changed their minds on DEC? Amazing how quickly an opinion changes when the mortgage needs paying. Would TCX Pilots have been happy if the roles were reversed? Tough times for all but perhaps it’s time to have a rethink on strict seniority in certain airlines and also the use of DEC where appropriate. |
In the knowledge of how much this has already ruffled the FO’s feathers at TUI, I’d be very surprised if any TCX DEC would even want to set foot into the left hand seat of a TUI aircraft. They’re not going to be the most popular of people that’s for sure, as many senior FO’s have waited patiently for their turn in what has always been traditionally a legacy seniority based airline. |
Business is business. If the airline can come up with a plan to manage this expansion then it will be good for everyone. Some might think they have been disadvantaged in the short term but in the long term it should mean more job security. If the airline cannot manage it the alternative is to give the work to a third party operator and in that case no one in the company will benefit. If it is well handled I don't think anyone ex-Thomas Cook should have any fears about joining TUI.
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Originally Posted by twogoodstarts
(Post 10591809)
In the knowledge of how much this has already ruffled the FO’s feathers at TUI, I’d be very surprised if any TCX DEC would even want to set foot into the left hand seat of a TUI aircraft. They’re not going to be the most popular of people that’s for sure, as many senior FO’s have waited patiently for their turn in what has always been traditionally a legacy seniority based airline. Thomas Cook pilots will be welcomed into TUI with open arms. At TUI, been through loads of mergers and changes and the pilots from the ‘other’ company are never blamed. I and others look forwards to meeting any new pilots from Thomas Cook and hope it works out for them. This is an unusual situation and the rapid and huge planned TUI expansion wouldn’t be happening if Thomas Cook hadn’t gone bust. |
Also true, it’s undoubtedly ruffled a few feathers but I think we can all say as TUI FOs we would extend the same courtesy and professionalism towards whoever occupies the LHS. Whilst I won’t fly with any of them on the 787 (that would cause a riot!) I look forward to meeting our new ex-TCX colleagues and hope you are very happy here. You’ll have to give up the Airbus for a right shed though 🤪 |
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