Can someone elaborate as to what might cause this? Are the 787 routes/schedules objectionable? Are we talking about 5-6 flights per month to Sanford, Cancun, Barbados, Punta Cana or Male? For those of us who don't have the option to fly Dreamliners to hot, sandy beaches, any insight/opinions would be appreciated...

PMs also welcome.

it's just the first Captains on the fleet are now rapidly approaching retirement, the first F/Os on it are all getting their commands on the 737, the fleet expands by 1 this year, 1 next year and another in 2018, and the lifestyle doesn't suit everyone, those with young famillies appreciate being home every night, and currently, the 787 is ONLY based at MAN and LGW so if you are not based at those 2 bases, you will not get on it. And believe me, we have tried, but the Co only want 787 pilots based at MAN and LGW.
I don't believe it's a negative lifestyle (my own personal opinion), it's not that people are leaving it in droves, just a requirement for more pilots!!!!

Iver,

For many it's a lifestyle issue. And long haul flying is mind-numbingly boring!

Regards.

It's great for the first six months.

It's great for the first six hours.......

787
 

Smudge sums it up in part. The fact that the 787 has gone down to the bottom of our seniority list speaks volumes . Make of it what you will.

At least your airline offers a choice of longhaul vs short haul. After a few years traveling the long, boring oceans to sunny beaches go back to busy intra-Europe flying.

Iver having seen your posts for a number of years, you seem to have a considerable case of 'shiny jet syndrome' - although I'm not part of Thomson I know the lifestyle well, and I know the outfit has much more to offer than Dreamliners. It's fair to say for many of the boys and girls it isn't their main motivation for joining and some of the above posters have given you some very good reasons why not!

Indeed, the variety of flying at TOM is a great advantage. The 757/767 fleet was great with a mixture of short and long haul flying. The 787 was introduced as a purely long haul aircraft, but is already going the same way with short haul flights as well. True, you have to be at a "787 base," ie LGW or MAN, but many have gone for a commuting life, being based at one of the two, but continuing to live near their previous base. The introduction of short haul to the fleet has put something of a spanner in the works for them, as commuting was achievable on a long haul roster, but more complicated with short haul in the mix. Personally, after many years of flying long haul on the 767, I elected to pass on the 787 to return to the 737 NG in order to have more home time. I now work a part time short haul roster and it is great for me in my declining years! Part time working was, until recently, also not on offer on the 787. A significant number of others have done the same, or are unwilling to move base just to fly the 787, hence the progress a long way down the seniority list to attract takers. The flying itself is not particularly "objectionable " as you put it Iver, it's pretty straightforward really. What I found wearing in the end was all the hassle having arrived overseas. Hot bedding of hotel rooms leading to having to wait for your room on arrival, and long duty days positioning from your original arrival point to a different departure point, often on overbooked scheduled services, and trying to shepherd 13 crew through Miami without losing anyone in the airport Malls took the shine off it somewhat! Every other flight an unacclimatised night sector, and then being a rat bag at home for a couple of days whilst returning to UK time. Aah the glamour... Mind you, a night Bodrum doesn't tickle either! Horses for courses I guess.

It's like herding cats

Then don't do it, I gave up years ago, they are all grown men and women and should be able to position.

Anyway back to the subject, I love the 78 lifestyle, June roster is two bullets (48 hour trips) one week of reserve (which I didn't get called on) and three shorthaul flights. Meaning this month I'll have 21 days off. July is three bullets and another reserve so probably 19-21 days off. Plus several of those work days, involve getting into bed at 8am so I consider that a day back after a quick sleep.

Comparing my roster to the short haul roster of the 757 days and I would hate to go back now.

DooblerChina that 787 summer roster sounds great. I'm hoping to go on the 787 soon, so was wondering if you would be able to give me an idea of a 787 winter roster which I guess is all long haul with a bit of poitioning to/from Scandinavia? Are the trips longer or are there still bullets?

On the subject of the differing lifestyles on the various fleets, what's people's thoughts on the 787 once the 75's and 76's are finally retired. Is there a chance the 787 could do even more of a mix of short and long haul like the 756 used to before the 787s introduction?

What are bullets?

a LH flight with around 24hrs off downroute.

Simple premise but often out of one base and back into another, expect lots of faffing at either end.

Horses for courses, it suits some people for sure and others not so much.

Any word on the numbers recently recruited?

Interesting reading about the 78 thanks.

Trips longer in Winter, January gave me four trips, 1 was a bullet, the other three were 4-5 days long. visited Scandinavia once. 13 rostered days off plus two arriving in bed by 8. Feb was 1 bullet, one longer trips of 4-5 days a ferry and a sim block. Same days off as Jan.

Any longer trips at all in the summer (to the lessor served destinations - MRU/LIR/VRA etc) or is it all scheduled flights and taxis to other ports to return home?

Yes but only for LGW based pilots, they have a week stay in Mauritius.

I'd estimate 60% of my trips involve some kind of positioning this could be taxi to BHX, taxi back from EDI or scheduled service Cancun to Puerto Vallarta via Mexico City. I use own way travel when I can for example I can get to BHX for 10 quid on the train so do that and go late at night and claim the cash back from the company. To some it's a hastle but considering I'll position two or three times a month, compared with the average commute I can handle it.

767 scheduled for Dubai and Barbados this Winter, when it leaves the fleet is anyone's guess, I think the latest plan is 2018/19 with the 75 around till maybe 2022 but it changes every year. They are great workhorses and the lease rates on the 76 is cheap compared to the 78, so it always seems to pick up extra work.

I have recently been a passenger on a few Thomson flights mainly due to the kids liking the Family Life and holiday village hotels.

All the crew both flightdeck and cabin crew seemed happy to work for the company and had mostly positive things to say when I chatted to them during slot delays.

I am wondering when they have the next round of recruitment whether Thomson could be an option for me to consider as already type rated 737-NG Currently based in the Midlands so easy and be happy to be based at EMA,BHX,LTN or maybe DSA

What are the shift patterns like on the 737 fleet during the summer, do you get back to back longer sector days/nights e.g PFO Sat,LCA Sun and DLM Mon.

Looks to me that most of the deep nights are mostly PMI,IBZ and BOJ flights

Do you get many down route aircraft swaps ( This may not be regular but happened in both directions on recent holiday causing us to miss slots)

The fleet seems quite modern and generally reliable which is good and do crew have good relationship with Ops and engineering ?

I am not sure if I would be interested in the Canadian contract in winter due to family is there any pressure to do so.

Back to back long sectors? Yes absolutely. But so to might you get back to back short sectors e.g UK to MAH, IBZ, PMI etc. More often it will be a mixture of short and long sectors with around 14 flying duties a month in the summer. In the winter significantly fewer.

The aircraft are excellent. While the B757s are a bit old and need a bit of tlc, they are well maintained. The B737 all fairly new and well equipped and the airline start delivery of the MAX in 2018. B787 very nice indeed - just whether you want long haul or not.

Aircraft swaps? Sometimes. Is this a big deal??

Canada is purely voluntary! It is significantly oversubscribed in FO rank and undersubscribed in Capt rank. This is no doubt due to many reasons but probably include demographics and family commitments to name just two.

Thanks Boeing 7E7 for the reply and it all seems quite positive so far, In the summer you don't get any problems then with back to back longer night sectors with duty hours. I presume at present on the 737 the longest days are the LCA & PFO sectors although I am sure SSH will be back soon. What happens with the Cape Verde flights are they a stop over sectors ?

No down route aircraft swaps are not a problem if organised correctly and not done at the last minute like on my recent flight where all the bags were loaded and then decided to do the swap or like at my previous employer do an aircraft swap with an aircraft you know is running 1hr30mins late already.

At present I am not to fussed about the long haul and Canada would be ok for a few weeks but not for the whole winter with family life.

All in it looks quite appealing I will keep my eyes open for the next recruitment drive and see what position I am in then.

I just like to read threads like this to see what's going on in the industry. I have to wonder: is this really something that people are looking at when considering a potential employer? I can't think of anything less relevant.

To alleviate any fears on an a/c swop.

FO leaves the rest of the crew on the a/c to go to the new a/c.
Vice versa on the other a/c.

That way someone always on board to catch that APU Fire and all PPP and CDU preflight can be compeleted before the rest of the team arrive.

Simple!

Aircraft swaps would never put me off applying for a job just so much better when planned well.

I have just had bad previous experience with another employer who would quite regular plan these and know before you have even left the UK that the aircraft they want to swap and for you to bring back to UK has a couple of hours delay on it and can assure you not much fun waiting around on the ground waiting for your inbound aircraft when you should be nearly home.

I am pleased to hear that this does not seem to be the case with Thomson and things look rather positive

Thomson are opening recruitment again sometime in September.

This just arrived in the company e-mail....Good luck, guys and gals!


Good afternoon

We are preparing to launch our second pilot recruitment campaign of the year and we will be accepting online applications from Monday 12th September for two weeks to join Thomson Airways as 737, 757, 787 and Non-Type Rated pilots at bases across the country.

The links to apply will be going on to Crew Portal on Monday for you to share with any interested colleagues and associates or alternatively refer them to Find your next career in travel with TUI Jobs UK our company careers page where they can review the job description and apply for the roles.

OOI, Part year contracts to begin with?

Oh bugger, we started him off again!!

Are they still not getting enough internal pilots bidding the 787 that they need newhires for it?

787
 

Iver,
It's true to say ,quite junior pilots have successfully bid on to the fleet.

The lifestyle is not for everyone.

It doesn't help that you need to based at either of the big two. Quite a lot of pilots would opt for the fleet if base options where considered. A lifestyle enhancement perhaps?

deleted. Found the answer myself.

Any idea of an average salary and a typical monthly roster for a FO on B787?
Thanks

Last few months about £4400 take home. Three day sim and five shorthaul and one bullet long haul last month. This month two short haul one bullet long haul and two weeks leave. Average is four long haul a month unless a long month and I've been here 11 yrs.

4.5k a month without overtime, three or four long hauls a month depending if the trips are bullets i.e. 24 hours downroute or longer ones. (Some trips are 8 days long) Only a bit of shorthaul in Summer but for me literally only 4 shorthauls this year. Overtime is a mixed bag, I got loads last year, dried up a bit this year but that's the nature of the beast. Interestingly, I've picked up 5 days overtime this month making my take home in excess of 6k. Can't really comment on take home on the new contract but that only affects basic pay, duty rig and hourly pay is the same as new joiners making each bullet worth between 4-500 quid. Four of them a month and variable pay is well in excess of 20k a year. Add in annual pilot bonus (not guaranteed but the company is doing really well so for now we expect it) usually around 1700 quid paid in December pay, holiday pay of 600 paid each June and share options that add a couple of grand in free options plus decent staff travel which you can add to tax free! discounts at every retailer under the sun it seems and finally 42 days leave with the ability to add 15 gold days (days off you can choose) and it's a top place to be. Oh and I forgot, my roster means my roster, it's rock solid and never changes unless I add overtime.

Still think it's the best gig in town although the part time contract will put lots of people off (understandably) and new joiners are offered an inferior pension contribution. Also factor in 10+ years to command, not something that bothered me as I joined at 25, but someone joining in their 40s is faced with a much bigger predicament.

Good luck to those who take the plunge and I would say see you on the line but as I see a crew room twice a month on the 78, maybe I won't... cheers

Thanks guys for the quick replies!
It does not seem bad at all...
Just the last questions: how many days off/month? Any chance to get some of them consecutive in order to commute?

If it's just a LH roster it's easy very nearly always three days (in general) off after a trip. Not really less. A few pilots I know of commute to France Channel Islands up further north.

Whats the latest please with the commands? Are more people looking to retire now?

Forget coming to Thomson for a command, they are currently running at 13 years and although we have a decent retirement bulge coming, (70 within 3 years) that still only takes it to those who joined 11 years ago. after that, pretty steady at 20-30 a year, and new joiners are around 400 off the most junior Captain.

If a new joiners joins the offered terms, what would be the average monthly take home pay


This position is a Permanent Part Year contract which means full time working between May and October (peak period) and 2 weeks on / 2 weeks off from October through until May. The salary for this is 81.3% of the Full Time Equivalent Salary and is spread equally across 12 months. Pension contributions are based on actual salary.
For the first 3 years a payment of £7,000 is deducted from monthly salary prior to tax / NI deductions for training costs.