Basically, BA can do what they like with you during your first 5 years. Ordinarily they want to do what is cheapest, so they do not allow any moves from whatever fleet you are on during that time period. You still have the opportunity to bid for your fleet aspirations, and BA will consider them if it suits them. Normally, the only thing that suits them is a move to a short haul command where there are often insufficient more senior bidders.

An example where things might be different this year, is the 747 where they have stated the fleet may be in surplus towards the end of 2020. A new recruit on the 747 could therefore see themselves directed off the fleet to anywhere else (highly unlikely to be a command position), if there are insufficient more senior volunteers. My gut feeling is that 2020 will see sufficient volunteers, but 2021 may be a different story.

We did indeed wiggy. I was responding to this a couple of posts up, which I believe to be misleading information.

The trainers have been told (at least according to the one I was in the sim with, before PRIAM day) to “expect about 250 Airbus recruits over the year, (to include some FPP / White Tail).

Not sure if that answers your question, but it might give an indication of scale.

Last year (bid 2018 for this year’s training) if you joined on the A320 with the required hours you could get a command after the minimum one year in the company. Long haul engagement freezes were waived for about 10 or so pilots bidding for Gatwick commands. This year the most junior Heathrow 320 command in 2020 is about 3 and a half years in the company at the point of the bid results but will be unfrozen for command. The pre command freeze is 4 years so effectively lops a year off your engagement freeze if bidding for an available command.

Current BA policy seems to be that seniority doesn’t apply for commands during the engagement freeze - if you are on the 320 and meet the requirements you will get a right to left ahead of senior but non-rated bidders. This is a consequence of the fact the agreement never anticipated such junior mainline commands.

Bottom line, although relatively junior commands are available, bank on 4-5 years if you want LGW and up to double that for LHR. Don’t come here if you have your heart set on a quick upgrade as disappointment is likely to be coming your way.

I think there’ll be a fair few new 320 pilots needed at LHR, I think almost every unfrozen pilot got their bid. I’m 40% and I’ve got a course for next year, so there’ll need to be a fair few pilot to fill in. BA are opening up 320 specific recruitment this year as well I believe.

I count just over 100 successful internal moves away from A320 FO positions, either to long haul fleets or commands on type. Then there will be age and ill health retirements, resignations due to people realising BA is not for them, people wanting part time, and you yourself say they are at least 40 FO positions short at Heathrow. A minimum requirement of 200 new A320 FOs would be very easy to reach. 250 is therefore probably not a bad estimate for trainers to have been told.

Yeah but that makes 250 total positions, not 250 Airbus positions, surely? If 100 Airbus FOs move then that’s 100 to replace (or 140 if you include the 40 they are short of) or am I missing something?

Im 45% and haven’t :{

Not too much longer now though hopefully, especially as there’s more LH hulls arriving in 2021.

The upside is it moves quickly (well at the moment anyway) on the Airbus P2 List and roster satisfaction will improve faster (if it’s indeed possible to be satisfied by a JSS roster). Not anywhere near as fast moving at the bottom of the Long Haul fleets.

I presume you are still within your engagement freeze Rex? I know you were hoping for the 787, but unfortunately long haul is popular so there is no need to release people from a freeze.

GS-Alpha I know what you’re saying but that just relates to an overall volume of pilots to be replaced company wide. The post I was replying to said 250 Airbus FOs to be trained this year. If you’re talking about an individual fleet then surely the replacements will be on a one for one basis (seeing as virtually no one bids for P32L/X internally) so if 100 pilots move seat from the Airbus this year, plus we’re 40 pilots shy then that’s a total of 140 Airbus Pilots to replace whilst the overall requirement for pilots company wide remains at around 250.

Anyway all this is a moot point for prospective joiners because the fundamental crux of it is that if you’re looking to join BA on the Airbus your chances are good right now.

Yes to the engagement freeze, I started right at the beginning of 2016. A couple of months earlier I could have been in luck.

Except that the overall need for pilots company wide has been published by the department, as just under 300 pilots. I personally think 250 is probably a rounded up figure by trainers who know that the company often changes the plan and demands more of them. I can easily see the figure being above 200, and 250 should not be taken with a pinch of salt.

I know it is disappointing not to get that move you were hoping for, and some lucky people do occasionally get released from their freeze when needs must, but unfortunately it is not the norm. With a super high training requirement on short haul already, it is unsurprising that they are not adding to it by releasing more A320 FOs than the agreements dictate.

Play the game. Bang in the application and pic up some overtime if you can

Or Dave

(I’ll get my coat)

Some terrible advice by others here. Be careful signing the application declaration saying you have xxx hours/sectors when you do not.

A320!GW
RTFQ
Spend at least five days on the initial application and run it past friends as to its authenticity
HR do not like people winging it.

Hello folks,

Starting soon A320 LHR and looking forward to it.

Couple of quick questions, if I may...

-Am assuming I will start on the newly ratified £63,xxx DEP scale (as per PPJN) not the £58,xxx I signed electronically a month or so back?
-Any top tips for getting the “best” commutable rosters? (I am looking purely to minimise total commuting time and expenses on my own $ and have no issues with working long days/all weekends/deep nights/loads of sectors etc)
-Have read the thread fully but did we find a conclusive answer to exactly how junior SH LHS is running at the moment?
-Likelihood of getting LH inside initial engagement freeze? And does a rating on a BA LH type “help” or is it purely seniority?
-Any idea how long until one could realistically expect to achieve 50% working pattern?
-Any other top tips?

Many thanks!

FRYVA: first off congratulations and welcome

LH inside of your engagement freeze is very very rare for SH to LH.
Commuting roster: It’s going to be tough to have any control for a good year or more. It all depends how many join under you. My advice would be to bid for 2-5 day tours as H++. You should be able to easily get 2 day 6 tours but you may need to do some trading or swapping with other pilots.

Pay, you will be on the same as everyone so the new rate effective 1st Jan.

Aspirational part time is currently not available. Right to request is generally 2 years, put your request in ASAP and see what happens. You can always decline it.

Commands, someone will correct me as I did not pay much attention to the bids but I thing LHR commands were around 7-8 years. Gatwick a little less. The general trend is returning towards 10-12 years for SH, 20...ish for LH.

Advice. Find a local LHR hang out. You will need it for reserve if more than 2 hours away and for the odd night stop at LHR. Crew will help you out on that one with all the tricks.

Buy us yourself a reusable cup because Pret give you 50p off with each coffee ;)