If you are better than me, stay where u are and get paid ur worth on the lefthand seat,i wont disturb your career :-)

I am expressing my opinion, not any wishes or intentions since i am still employed and paid my worth at a "major" with T and Cs that you would consider much better than FR (infact it is not so, sadly) i see not many others being so aggressively opposed to me as you are.
Just get an interview somewhere and study to pass it, that will keep you busy.

PS Most of italian airlines pay captains between 5000 and 6000, net...of course, a legal net, not a made up net. But still, not such a big issues for some of us.

This statement should be put into context: such figures ,at least in the 3 Italian airlines I have worked for, are correct for an average of 50/60 hours per month.
I have seen numbers around the 10k figure when flying 90+ hours but my average was between 7k and 8k with about 70 to 80 hours.
That was net of local taxes, standard skipper with no training allowances, with pension, healthcare and other goodies.

My friend in Ryanair is a non-contractor trainer, flies on average 75-80 hours/month and barely makes 7k net of Irish tax without a single extra benefit.

Italian hours
 

True,
but the average Italian pilot yearly hour-count is 600 while ryanair in CIA at the moment are doing 800 (trapani 850) That puts the money in the same region, plus in Italy the roster is so hectic that you end up in uniform 21-22 days a month vs 15 in ryanair.

I am not a fan of either style to be honest, but the advantages of Italian airline vs ryanair is slimmer than in other countries.

Had I flown an average of 850 hours per year in Italy my monthly $$ would have been in the region of 8k to 9k and not under 7k like FR for the same amounts.
For what rostering and off days is concerned I used to have 10 days free of duty and an additional 4-5 days of unavailability because the contracts were protecting your days off, say you finished your duty late tonight then tomorrow would have been an unavailable day before your off day.

LCC the best !!!! in aviation = slavery system .:yuk:

Ah gee Superced, why didn't you say so sooner?

Superced = more useless bullsh1t / waste of bandwidth :mad:

What 5 Star operator are you flying for now?

From ERC meeting in DUB March 9th:

FR offered 0% pay raise, agreed was 2%. Allowance increased by 1000 EUR per year.

5/4 to remain, at least in my base (NYO).

Offering Brookfield F/Os FR contracts was discussed, nothing decided though.

And that was on basic I take it…..and not flight pay, so at the end of the day its about 1%


Now can someone please remind me what inflation was.

Great Deal :ugh:

Shocking. And that was 'agreed'??

That cannot surprise anyone, I expected nothing, & it appears i'm right?

And let's just remind ourselves (from BBC News Web site 31st Jan 2011) :-


Good innit ?


:(


PS Resignations (from a reliable source within management) are now well past the 230 mark since the beginning of the year - I wonder why ? ..................

If your contracted to brookfield and your only customer is Ryanair for a long period of time with possible clauses of you only flying for them regarding public transport hours.

Wouldn't a government tax authority either in Ireland or your home country, take a position of you being an employee of Ryanair. Also, assuming your main place of work or rather base. How come you dont pay tax in that location? Is it the whole Irish company and being employee of it.

I spend a lot of time in Norway working and offering my services in another profession. Although I live in another country, I have to pay tax also in Norway, partly because its outside of the EU.

I find it quite interesting in how this all works and assume the EU will be trying to look into this and reading a few of the threads of this forum regarding Ryanair and France etc.

Heard bases with greater than 3 aircraft currently on 5/3 are proposed 5/4. No pay raise or allowances to change. BRK rates to remain frozen. Bases on 5/4 can receive a 2% rise and 5/3. So give the pilots something that costs nothing or threaten the only real thing of value that we have to avoid paying an additional 2%. Another coup for MOL. Unreal.

There's the head,

Over there is the sand (pit).

Incredible.

For us to change to a 5/3 from 5/4 we would have to be offered at least 2% a year for the four years or so that we have forgone the pay rise in order to have the 5/4 roster. I make that at least 8 or 10% on BASIC PAY!

Remember ladies and gents, no more off day working if you're on a BRK contract without off day pay.
That's what I'll be doing anyway, as for the 2%, some nerve !

with 5/3, don't you end up with aprox 20 more working days in the end of the year? more salary? or a more relax schedule because you reach 900hrs earlier?

Alpagueur, you beat me to it. :)

It means more standbys and more time away from home, for no more money. :mad:

And what´s this about 900 hours? Do people still believe that old chestnut. Ryanair FOs do 750 on average. 800 if you´re lucky, 700 if you´re unlucky.

Yea, 5/3 would either make for a more relaxed schedule or more unavailable days at the end of the flying year. The problems are that there are lots don't live at a base, so we will actualy loose days at home each week, the other thing is if we are up to the 900 hours we will probably just be given unpaid leave. Win win for Ryanair, loose loose for us!

Well you certainly can´t keep flying if you get to 900, so it would be unpaid leave! Mind you, can you get ´leave´ if you´re merely a contractor - surely you´re simply unemployed ;)

Regardless, on the topic of 900 hours I refer you to my last post. Nobody will get more hours over the course of a year whether they´re on a 5/3 or 5/4....It´s just a question of the number of standbys.

No, its all relative, the same number of flights will still exist if its 5/3 or 5/4, the additional day gives additional cover. Essentially, you will be on duty for more days for the same pay. You will only make more money if they reduce crewing numbers per aircraft which will introduce the same problem they're trying to negate by the supposadly wide implemention of 5/3.

There will always be some willing to do it for whatever reason

So the crux of it sounds like the FR of old….

FR want you to do 5/3 and they are willing to offer 2% (plus i suspect more) but wont tell you because they want a carrot to lever in the 5/3, so they offer you 0% pay deal. They then turn around and out of the kindness of their hearts say OK 2% if you do 5/3. The pilots rush to accept because originally they had 0% and now think they are lucky to have got 2% and one over on the company….

Same old same old…OH and dont forget 2% in Frland isn't really 2% either !

@ Wayupthere

Yes you are right, but I think it will be mostly newbie cadets, think most of the old boys are as fed up as the rest of us...bring on summer think its going to be an interesting one.

MikeHotel, Not everyone is a contractor so unpaid leave is unpaid leave if you are employed!
If I was acontractor I would be happy to do the 900 hours in 9 months and take the other 3 months off, if an employed pilot does this they take a 25% pay cut.

pass on the message to all you know, do not work on your off days for any reason other than swaps, you will do no more hours in the long run, just kill any chance of better terms.

@ Sky Goose

In most bases I'd agree but in our base we have very few cadets and most of them go home on their days off.
Yet the seats always get filled despite the fact we're short at the moment

How many times have I heard his :0( No disrespect intended:)

superced is right. LCC :yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk::yuk:

It seems management are busier with other things ;)


The Daily Mash - Ryanair unveils flimsiest ever price hike justification

We dont do fuel charges, we just have a selection of other names for it!!!

Check-in charge
Printing boarding pass charge
Gate baggage charge
Debit card charge
100g over weight baggage charge
Priority boarding charge

About time the travelling public wised up. Like the mass exodus of pilots has proven we have!!

SmilingKnifed

thanks for that link!

v funny

Seems there are more things that will keep them busy, my italian is far from perfect but I still understand most of it from my charter days down there: the link below says the tax man in Pisa wants 1.2 million euros in unpaid social contributions for Ryanair workers that, according to the investigation, are not based in Ireland but actually permanently based in Italy ad therefore subject to Italian law.
Pretty much the same happened in Marseilles.

http://www.inail.it/repository/Conte...8705/XDF1O.pdf