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You can easily take the local contract and commute though, plenty of guys doing it. Can't say anything about skippers but FO t&c are far above ezy and the likes, might be one of the best in Europe
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Originally Posted by mesh
(Post 10233152)
Any current updates on wow? Spoken to a few old colleagues and they seem to like it. Salaries seem to be amongst the best being offered compared to UK. Cold and wet but company seems to be young and forward thinking. Command upgrade with experience around a year. Is this bull****? |
Why tomorrow? European base is needed to maximise the operations I would have thought. There has been alot of talk but no confirmation.
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So do you have any credible sources for your post oceancrosser?Both Iceland airlines have been suffering due to high fuel prices and the establishment on the rock would like to see the purple upstart gone. |
Originally Posted by tubby linton
(Post 10245152)
So do you have any credible sources for your post oceancrosser?Both Iceland airlines have been suffering due to high fuel prices and the establishment on the rock would like to see the purple upstart gone. If you read Icelandic there is lots in the Icelandic media, here is an example https://turisti.is/2018/09/oljos-tid...-mala-hja-wow/ The latter one deals with how WOW´s CEO has been making inconsistent remarks in the media. And they have not yet filed WOW´s 2017 results as required by law. It should have been in the public domain last week. |
That is not exactly them going bust in the next few days, which is what you wrote though is it?Iceland's media write something about both airlines almost on a daily basis and nothing you have quoted is recent. Skulli was at an aviation meeting last week Aviationfest18 talking up the company's prospects and Wow is launching winter flights to Orlando to start in December |
Originally Posted by tubby linton
(Post 10245288)
That is not exactly them going bust in the next few days, which is what you wrote though is it?Iceland's media write something about both airlines almost on a daily basis and nothing you have quoted is recent. Skulli was at an aviation meeting last week Aviationfest18 talking up the company's prospects and Wow is launching winter flights to Orlando to start in December As for adding routes, Air Berlin pretty much did that to the bitter end Air Berlin launches four new transatlantic routes - BusinessClass.co.uk |
It gets dicier fast. https://www.mbl.is/frettir/innlent/2...stodu_wow_air/ (apologies, Icelandic only). In essence it says according to sources, ministry officials met over the weekend to discuss WOW aIr´s situation. These people do not meet on a weekend without significant cause. |
As I have said before the establishment of Iceland will always support Icelandair and ensure its survival. For balance the CEO of Icelandair left recently due to losses and competition from low -cost airlines https://www.routesonline.com/news/29...-ceo-departs-/ |
https://icelandmonitor.mbl.is/news/n...r_the_company/ Guess this has nothing to do with overexpansion. Sorry ex Monarchs... But shooting the messenger is always popular. |
Whoever wrote that article doesn't understand that most of Wow's customers are not actually visiting Iceland , just merely passing through for a few hours.Currency fluctuations will also apply to Icelandair as well.
I remember Skulli taking out an advert last year for pilots when Icelandair laid off 148 pilots. A full detailed analysis of the two airlines can be read here: https://centreforaviation.com/analys...wow-air-424077 |
Originally Posted by mesh
(Post 10233152)
Any current updates on wow? Spoken to a few old colleagues and they seem to like it. Salaries seem to be amongst the best being offered compared to UK. Cold and wet but company seems to be young and forward thinking. Command upgrade with experience around a year. Is this bull****? |
I've been offered, as Captain, something like 9.5K Gross calculated with an average of 15 Days of work (the salary is made off a Basic + per diems). That's not one of the best salaries you can find, considering Iceland is not cheap, it's a gross figure (and you should pay some taxes in your Country as well. Yes, that's true, if you still have something linking you there like a House, a car, business etc.) and you can travel for free on their network only.
If you want to call a salary "above average", it should be higher than 7000-7500 Euros NET for 80 hours. Good T&C must include (at least) a good pension scheme (State pension + Additional Private scheme), if commuting, a good network if no staff travels are agreed with other airlines. If one of these factors is unsatisfactory, the salary must be even higher. |
Originally Posted by Breakthesilence
(Post 10248425)
I've been offered, as Captain, something like 9.5K Gross calculated with an average of 15 Days of work (the salary is made off a Basic + per diems). That's not one of the best salaries you can find, considering Iceland is not cheap, it's a gross figure (and you should pay some taxes in your Country as well. Yes, that's true, if you still have something linking you there like a House, a car, business etc.) and you can travel for free on their network only.
If you want to call a salary "above average", it should be higher than 7000-7500 Euros NET for 80 hours. Good T&C must include (at least) a good pension scheme (State pension + Additional Private scheme), if commuting, a good network if no staff travels are agreed with other airlines. If one of these factors is unsatisfactory, the salary must be even higher. |
What's the latest from the inside?
I have a friend looking for an Airbus gig about to leave asia.. What about the route cuts this winter? Is there any rumours on the inside about the financial situation? |
Bump, anyone? |
Originally Posted by hans brinker
(Post 10248787)
Holy MoG, things are not well in the EU. Corrected for inflation I made €7.000 gross in 2003 as a 50 seat turbo prop Captain in the EU. Currently working for the second lowest paying LCC in the US, and my base pay is €14.000 gross + 15% into my pension plan.
CP |
Originally Posted by CaptainProp
(Post 10266510)
Yes that is the sad state of things in EU. Your quoted pay is more or less the equivalent to the HIGHEST paying LCC in Europe. CP |
Originally Posted by 172_driver
(Post 10266570)
Sure, but you have to put it in perspective to what you get back as well. Medical care, school/nursery for the kids, state pension etc. Those are big costs. I know you are aware of that, but it needs to be remembered sometimes. Even comparing gross salaries between different EU states can be very much like comparing apples and oranges. Just sayin'... Talking about LCC carriers in EU, Ryanair is going to be (unexpectedly) a good place to stay in some Countries. Considering the first Country signing a local contract (Italy) and compared to WOW Air 7000 Euros gross there's a huge gap. As far as I got, once the transition will be completed in 2019, the NET Salary for Captains flying 70 hours will be around 8600 Euros. On Top of that and paid by the Company, there is a private pension fund (with good investment interests) and a private medical insurance for pilots and families. As part of the deductions from the Gross there is also the State pension paid 1/3 by the pilot ( with 2/3 paid by the company). Even without knowing the exact taxation figures, an 8600 NET with those conditions compared to a 7000 GROSS with some benefits (but nobody says you'll be flying in adverse weather most of the times and living your days in Iceland paying 2-3 times the standard european prices for food etc.) offered by WOW Air, it's hard to compete. You can't pay a Captain flying on A320 and A330 mixed fleet 7000 Euros GROSS only. That's the salary for an FO on short-medium haul in other (non major) airlines, even without some benefits, that's out of business. I'm sorry because it was a very good plan to fly mixed fleet in a young a funny environment but it must comply with minimum acceptable salary standard for our profession. |
Originally Posted by Breakthesilence
(Post 10286541)
Yes that is true. But sometimes, even with rough figures you can easily assess the deal.
Talking about LCC carriers in EU, Ryanair is going to be (unexpectedly) a good place to stay in some Countries. Considering the first Country signing a local contract (Italy) and compared to WOW Air 7000 Euros gross there's a huge gap. As far as I got, once the transition will be completed in 2019, the NET Salary for Captains flying 70 hours will be around 8600 Euros. On Top of that and paid by the Company, there is a private pension fund (with good investment interests) and a private medical insurance for pilots and families. As part of the deductions from the Gross there is also the State pension paid 1/3 by the pilot ( with 2/3 paid by the company). Even without knowing the exact taxation figures, an 8600 NET with those conditions compared to a 7000 GROSS with some benefits (but nobody says you'll be flying in adverse weather most of the times and living your days in Iceland paying 2-3 times the standard european prices for food etc.) offered by WOW Air, it's hard to compete. You can't pay a Captain flying on A320 and A330 mixed fleet 7000 Euros GROSS only. That's the salary for an FO on short-medium haul in other (non major) airlines, even without some benefits, that's out of business. I'm sorry because it was a very good plan to fly mixed fleet in a young a funny environment but it must comply with minimum acceptable salary standard for our profession. |
With due respect the figures being quoted are not current. As a captain on the local contract at scale 7, my NET with flight pay, averages £8k. I’m not on the 330 yet. Yes the cost of living is high. Well the trade off is the country is safe for me and my family. The locals are very pleasant, the education system is first rate. The weather can be inclement, however if you dress up with that in mind it’s not a problem. The flying is challenging and varied. A set 7/5 Roster allows me to plan for time with the family. It doesn’t suit everyone I know. Having been made redundant a couple of times this gig I find very good. I didn’t want go to Ryan air, Easy, jet 2, of which I had job offers, I got a dear John from Virgin. rgds lhs |
Y
Originally Posted by LHS320
(Post 10286706)
With due respect the figures being quoted are not current. As a captain on the local contract at scale 7, my NET with flight pay, averages £8k. I’m not on the 330 yet. Yes the cost of living is high. Well the trade off is the country is safe for me and my family. The locals are very pleasant, the education system is first rate. The weather can be inclement, however if you dress up with that in mind it’s not a problem. The flying is challenging and varied. A set 7/5 Roster allows me to plan for time with the family. It doesn’t suit everyone I know. Having been made redundant a couple of times this gig I find very good. I didn’t want go to Ryan air, Easy, jet 2, of which I had job offers, I got a dear John from Virgin. rgds lhs local are very pleasant sure, but you are always an outsider.. don’t even get me started on Other issues... so much you have missed or you seem not willing to see in your short time here.. All the best fór the merger... |
Originally Posted by Krugerpark
(Post 10308022)
Y scale 7 with £8k net? You must have been smoking good stuff mate, while reading your Icelandic payslip... With scale 9 and and trainer pay I barely make a 7k euro figure..may be You are nót payed in iSK, which btw lost 15% of its purchasing power in the last 2 years?...or may be you are one of those selling all their days off and considering perdiem in foreign currency as the best part of their wages, ( interesting point of view in this part of the world)...may be you missed the 22% taxation when you transfer it overseas?....education system is first rate? Í guess it all depends on where you are coming from.. you did not want to go to work in your Country for those outfits , bigger and better? .. interesting: á 46% taxation is fór sure a very attractive deal for foreigners.. how could Í miss that? local are very pleasant sure, but you are always an outsider.. don’t even get me started on Other issues... so much you have missed or you seem not willing to see in your short time here.. All the best fór the merger... I'm scale 7, not a trainer and with 14 per diems, no off days sold, and no overtime for September, had a NET salary of 1.053.000 ISK. The corresponding supplementary pension was another 169.000 ISK. Just sayin' |
Originally Posted by booze
(Post 10308229)
Bs...
I'm scale 7, not a trainer and with 14 per diems, no off days sold, and no overtime for September, had a NET salary of 1.053.000 ISK. The corresponding supplementary pension was another 169.000 ISK. Just sayin' |
Originally Posted by Krugerpark
(Post 10308246)
which is less than 7k euro , just saying...and by the way I9, believe with 14 days per diem you only fly to europe? And probably your pay scale is different than anybody’s else.. level 7 base + shift is Gross 116800isk isk.. may be you don’t know how to read your payslip.. I pity you..Another troll in the office.. my best compliments... Also just have a look at the attachedhttps://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....999fbfe1b8.jpg https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....1d8b85dbea.jpg |
I see you are ready for a position in CP office or as a project manager.. one of those ah???? .... I see also you don’t know difference between gross and net and also you appear to get 14 days of pay duty per month.. interesting roster yours... you talk about pension: are you planning to cash that? Good luck with that , especially after Brexit... tax credit and tax return?.. happy you mentioned it.. tax return for what: per diem should have been taxed and for creativity and interpretation have not... did you know? Are you sure your per diem should be tax free? So you are counting in your monthly payments also what you get back for medical bills from your homeland insurance and your dividend return for that condo you bought 3 years ago in Florida? Why don’t you put in that also the leisure cards for kids or the fact that in Iceland tap water is free? You must be one of those who voted for a contract renewal that grants you a 8% rise in 3 years versus an inflaction per year of 10% ör one of those who are happy that á newly upgraded fo with 3000 hrs total time and zero PIC should get more that a seasoned wide body TRE just because.... thank you for explaining to me how it works here.. another newbee that knows it all... put yourself in the queue... plenty of those here... |
A320 FO salary
Can anyone confirm average salary for First Officer 320 on local contract (Net)?
Thank you! |
Originally Posted by Oblivion67
(Post 10316321)
Hi Guys, Sorry if this repetitive but I have a couple of questions with regards joining Wow. Firstly can anyone confirm that they are still recruiting given the current situation with Icelandair? I was told they may have Type Rating courses starting in Jan 2019 and was wondering if these will still continue? I am very hopeful to join the company, it would work for me on a lot of different levels. I have read the posts about pay on the local contract but was also wondering if someone could give me an indication of the Net salary on the Parc contract. I've gotten some conflicting information regarding rosters etc but the way I understand it, there is no 7/5 on the CAE contract? With the local I am obviously liable for my own accommodation? Which lead me to believe that the CAE contract would pay less net as the accommodation is included? I am aware that the currency has taken a hit etc. If anyone is there and could PM I would appreciate if I could pick your brain. Thanks a lot for any info!! Unfortunately i have no clue about the PARC contract, but regarding the rest feel free to PM me. Cheers, booze |
Firstly can anyone confirm that they are still recruiting given the current situation with Icelandair? 1. The deal goes through, which I seriously doubt, then up to 10 a/c will be axed from the purple fleet.... 2. If not, WOW goes bust! All contracts currently being advertised are pure fantasy, given the current state of WOW. |
From the Icelandic newssite Vikurfrettir: WOW fækki í flotanum um átta þotur Agree with Early Right, this would probably represent a “best case” scenario. If either rejected by FI shareholders or by the Competition Authority that will be the end. |
I'm really positive about the deal going through. Rumors about political pressure on all parties (Icelandair Group, Wow and the Competition Authority), otherwise the Icelandic economy and kronur will suffer big time. Guess no one wants that.
It's such a pity, really. Lovely place to live and work. |
Originally Posted by Early Right
(Post 10318711)
There are two scenarios.....
1. The deal goes through, which I seriously doubt, then up to 10 a/c will be axed from the purple fleet.... 2. If not, WOW goes bust! All contracts currently being advertised are pure fantasy, given the current state of WOW. Unfortunately someone is still attempting to lure people to join with a “promise “ of unbeatable conditions.. (. But .....Hey... feel free to PM him, by all means...) If fleet is truely downsizing do you expect they will retain on payroll newly hired pilots on local contract or contractors ? Wow has a union issued Universal seniority list ( it means captain and first officer are all together, listed in order on DOJ basis, with a few exceptions....no comment) ; hence SHOULD they opt to go with it , things are a bit more articulated then what ones would expect...I am sure you can figure out the picture. The real question to ask is ? Who benefits from hiring short term with exodus in progress, low seniority low pay scale pilots , on any capacity or contract? Iceland air migth as well lay-off pilots.... Do yourself a favour: before taking a decision, do your homework and research on real terms and conditions and tax facts... and read the fine printing. Good luck to all of us. |
Originally Posted by booze
(Post 10319147)
I'm really positive about the deal going through. Rumors about political pressure on all parties (Icelandair Group, Wow and the Competition Authority), otherwise the Icelandic economy and kronur will suffer big time. Guess no one wants that.
It's such a pity, really. Lovely place to live and work. |
Originally Posted by austrian71
(Post 10319157)
...WÄÄÄÄÄÄHHHHH - come on - "Pressure on all parties" - in which world you live ? Its all about money, if there is no profit, the hot potato falls down, fullstop. BTW - how important is it , that people fly for less than the price of the taxi drive to/from the airports over the atlantic? Can you explain this please? Just because we, crews , a minoriy in the population think we are so important?
Remember this is not the EU. They can pretty much intervene as they please and so should they if anything is learned from the crisis back in '08-11. |
Regardless “ the world expert, know it all,spin doctor” optimistic opinions, on geo politics and economics , todays update from the CEO is
“the proposed transaction with Icelandair will take longer time than expected and is still dependent on further Due Diligence. This is not a surprise per se since it´s a very complicated transaction and a number of issues that need to be addressed in a very short period of time. It is also important to note that we have received interest from other investors as well which we are pursuing in parallel.” What this means for the pilot population is not given tó know... á deafening silence from office and Union execpt there is á plan B,C, D... Xmas party is a priority now and CAE Parc aviation is recruiting fo and captains for wow... but hey... we are not part of eu ( never heard of EEA?) .. and 1400 people are essential to the global economy.... if you are joining ( are you?) and are thinking this gig could be the perfect solution for you in commuting, wages and carreer , think twice about bringing family and local contract..unfortunately many acquaintances whom fell for those promises are now regretting their choices ... bitterly |
Originally Posted by Krugerpark
(Post 10320829)
“the proposed transaction with Icelandair will take longer time than expected and is still dependent on further Due Diligence. This is not a surprise per se since it´s a very complicated transaction and a number of issues that need to be addressed in a very short period of time.
It is also important to note that we have received interest from other investors as well which we are pursuing in parallel We’ll see if WOW can pay their bills on Dec. 1st. Feel sorry for the lot working there. |
Originally Posted by oceancrosser
(Post 10321243)
So having sold the company to Icelandair with the usual caveats, he claims to be still talking to “other investors” on the side! WTF??? We’ll see if WOW can pay their bills on Dec. 1st. Feel sorry for the lot working there. Well said! in the meantime today’s paper: The Iceland Stock Exchange temporarily halted trading on shares of Icelandair, by request of the Financial Supervisory Authority (FME), Rùv reports, casting doubt on a WOW Air buyout. As it stands now, whether or not Icelandair Group, the company which owns Icelandair, will be able to fulfill all the conditions of the buyout has been called into question. According to an FME announcement, trading was halted on Icelandair shares “to protect the equality of investors”. While trading resumed at 12:30 this morning, Icelandair Group issued a statement to the Icelandic Stock Exchange that they consider it unlikely that they will be able to fulfill all the terms and conditions of the WOW Air buyout before this Friday’s investors meeting, when the purchase will be voted on. Icelandair Group announced the intent to buy out WOW Air Earlier this month but that purchase was still dependent upon approval from Icelandair shareholders and the Icelandic Competition Authority. The involvement of the Icelandic Competition Authority is critical. Between the two airlines, their combined share of air traffic to and from Iceland is nearly 80% with the buyout giving Icelandair Group control of the vast majority of flights to and from Iceland. As reported WOW Air has struggled with significant financial losses, even while growing its market share. With the combination of the two airlines, WOW Air may add more destinations to its roster, with the help of Icelandair’s resources. All that hangs in the balance now, as Icelandair Group works to find a way to fulfill the terms and conditions of the buyout in a timely manner. WOW air downsizes its fleet by four aircraft WOW air is downsizing its fleet by two Airbus A320 aircraft and two Airbus A330 aircraft in cooperation with its lessors. This is a part of necessary restructuring of the airline and to ensure maximum utility of its remaining fleet. This restructuring will not impact WOW air´s current plans to fly to India. For more information, please visit WOW’s website SF, VP Communications This information is information that WOW air hf. is obliged to make public pursuant to the EU Market Abuse Regulation. The information was submitted for publication, through the agency of the contact person set out above, at 16:15 GMT on November 27, 2018. |
Letter tó the bond holder ( from wow web site) Dear WOW air bondholder, Since the closing of our bond offering in September a number of external and internal events have unfortunately worsened significantly and we are now working hard on securing the long term funding of WOW air. During and following our bond offering we had significant bad publicity about the financial health of WOW air which ended up having a more negative impact on our sales and credit position than anticipated. As a result, our Q4 results are materially worse than originally anticipated. Secondly when Primera air collapsed in October the negativity escalated which has further worsened an already challenged situation. We were making with finalizing a sale lease back agreement which has since been cancelled resulting in USD25m less inflow than originally planned. Thirdly and due to the continuous negative events all our lessors, creditors and authorities have been monitoring the situation even closer and demanding stricter payment terms then before further putting pressure on our cash flow. Last but not least oil surged to new heights in the weeks and months after our offering which at that time also put pressure on our financial outlook. While this has since retreated the impact on our position during these weeks has not recovered accordingly. With the above in mind we have been working diligently to seek additional funding and have received interest from a number of parties including Icelandair as has been publicly announced. Timing is a consideration as the situation described above has resulted in these funding initiatives becoming a necessity for the business. While this is not a situation that any of us envisioned in September and I personally invested EU 5.5m cash in the bond as I was convinced the funding would be sufficient to take us to and IPO in the next 18 months. So having to write this note is not taken lightly by any means and I can ensure you that we are taking every step possible to ensure the continuous operation of WOW air. This is however where we are and hopefully we can together finalise an acceptable solution. Regards, Skuli Mogensen Reykjavík, 27.11.2018 |
4 aircraft returned to lessors last night. No deal from Icelandair. Wow Air is on life support.. |
Originally Posted by fruitbat
(Post 10323078)
4 aircraft REPOED by lessors last night. No deal from Icelandair. Wow Air is on life support.. |
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