They don't need to replace Senior FO's, 200hr Cadets will suffice for that. . . but, they do need to persuade the Senior FO's to remain & take upgrade (with a 5000€ bond :=) for no more (or even in some cases less) money than they have as FO, whilst giving up their base to be sent to . . . . well, 56 (? ) potential other locations.

For a lot of guys I spoke to recently (most of whom are ,or will be soon, somewhere else) this doesn't (surprisingly :rolleyes: ) add up.

When the Command carrot ("2 yrs here in the LHS & the world is your oyster" ) was working, all was Hunky Dory, but the senior FO's have wakened up & the Nescafe is smelling strong.
Why exactly would you accept the responsibility of Command for less money, when you could go somewhere else & have it there within a year or two for a whole lot more dosh ? :ugh:

@Birdstrike737
 

I appreciate your views. FYI, I am very very far away from Ryanair Headquarters and no vested interests in any form whatsoever in the company.

I know a couple of guys in RPG, and I'll ask them to ascertain whether all this is genuine (including with Themis-Lex and Coficom) - and I can assure you that I'm all for the interests of the RYR pilots and for any scheme which could improve their T&Cs - contrary to what you believe.

If this is genuine, I'll remove my previous post and submit my sincere apologies for having been completely wrong.

PigeonVoyageur.

Right with you there on the scepticism, and your polite offer to retract after due diligence is an example to those who sometimes post rather brusque responses to those not perceived to be following the "party line".

Like you, I hope it will transpire to be complimentary to the fine efforts of the RPG.

Guys, please, please, please....STOP DREAMING, pilot shortage will...NEVER EVER exist because there are (and there will always be) thousands and thousands of young european cadets that would sell their mother and sister(s) just to be able seat on a B737-800 flight deck. They will be so proud to put their pics with 2 stripes and rayban sunglasses on facebook. They will also film themselves on youtube with their gopro camera in front of them while landing or taking off, with a stupid star wars or superman song in the background.

Ryanair will now recruit more and more cadets (that will generate more cash). Ryanair will now make them fly 35 hours a month with a crap hourly salary so they can stay longer with MOL. There will always be some volunters for a LHS upgrade, and if not, there will always be some 5000-10000 hours guys stuck at Dubai or Doha that would come back home as a Ryanair captain, even with a :mad: salary, what matters to them is just returning to Europe. :yuk:

Yeah…Im 'stuck' in Dubai …have been for a while now.
Well actually I'm down route in a nice hotel, on allowances. I hate earning nearly 12000 Euro a month tax free and not wondering when the tax man is coming knocking at my door, I stress about it regularly whilst I drink my bottle of water in the cruise and eat my lunch/dinner/breakfast…. Home tomorrow, hope my boat is out of service, need to get out fishing for a few days ….Happy to have left Ryanair? Oh yeah ….. :}:ok::ok::E

Oh but you can live at Faro, Majorca, Tenerife, and have your own boat with a mini fridge on board, no problem. Every months there are lots of resignations at Emirates, Qatar and Etihad, it seems that your mates are fed up after 5 years in a rented flat earning 12000 dollars a month for a 900 hours/year long haul roster.

At least they did long haul, got wide body experience and got rid of (most of) their loans, which are impossible to pay off when remaining in RYR, on the current contracts/ under current tax regulations / current hrs vs pay

But guys, stop moaning! YOU did accept to sign an outrageous rubbish deal with Brookfield-Ryanair. And now you want to be paid and treated like a SOUTHWEST AIRLINES pilot. That's ridiculous.

If you can't beat them, join them. Then, have a go at beating them.

Birdstrike737 No probs at all earlier :)

windcheck the problem so far is that these deals are always signed on your own without any bargaining power on a take it or leave it basis. It´s you vs. the world. It becomes a real problem if the airline or whomever else is doing the same thing is determined to reduce the terms year after year as there is nothing you can do to prevent the decline. On top of that no complaining which in combination with the above can become a bit masochistic really ;)

Now it looks like the pilots have decided they want to reverse that trend and improve the outlook, all in one go by creating this new agency taking back control of their own labor. Instead of using intermediaries that have failed to keep the pilots interests in mind for a very long time. I think the idea is great also and fail to see why it should be considered ridiculous to improve your own working environment. I think everybody should give credit to them instead for doing this and supoort them since they deserve all the support they can get.

Could you pls tell me where you earn 12000 euro? As far as I remember Ek captains are on abt 9k a month...

It says $ now, don't know if it said € before.

In EK and its Euro not dollars, in dollars it was a little over $16000 last month. I live out so I have the housing allowance and bought my own place. You have a choice to live rent and utility free in company accommodation or take the money and do with it as you please. Some say that that doesn't count as salary…well to me it does since in the rest of the world the companies just pay you a salary and you have to sort out your own accommodation…

Yes I could live in Faro, Tenerife or where ever with FR …. I did FR and hated it in the end. I moaned daily about how the terms and conditions had dropped how we were continually being bullied and badly treated…now I fly and I am content….and thats all I want. Maybe I will buy a place in Tenerife or where ever for holidays ;):}

Not noticed many of my 'unhappy' mates leaving, but I guess I don't notice that from the inside Windcheck ;) I have noticed how many ex FR pilots we have coming through the door, I wonder how many go the reverse direction? :zzz:

You obviously have a fantastically large ego to go with that salary of yours. Thanks for your look at 'me, me, me' post. It reminds me of the reason why I turned down the assessment with Emirates. Nice one.

PigeonVoyageur, the guys behind GTD are legit, they are flying the line 5 days a week like the rest of us :ok:

Nobody's out to take anyone's money, lawyers don't come free, simple as that, especially with the legal :mad: they will get in from FR.

The "general" has to spell out the strategy, otherwise the 3000 random "soldiers" won't join together and fight...
(I don't like your analogy, but just rolling with it anyway)

The phrase behind GTD may be pushing it a bit far, but we've been pushed a long way... Think of it as a dig in the ribs for calling pilots that in the first place.

PM me if you like if you want to know more.

FYI, before anyone says it, I'm not personally involved in it, but man, do I support it 110%, and so should everyone else who is "a service provider"!!! :ok:

felix
 

Life with no kids, elderly parents or a sick relative to care for.

Well done you.

The point is C/S Kilo is that there is life outside Ryan, you have a value…don't let then treat or tell you otherwise. Its not me me me its US US US as a pilot body.

Best of luck to you, I hope it works.

You guys are soooooo naive! :rolleyes:

Any relatively expensive pilot that leaves a low-cost airline will be quickly replaced by a cheaper one!

There are tons of 737 rated EU pilots out there, working for peanuts for some kind of dodgy airline (ex. Indonesia) who would love to come back to Europe. On top of that, there are plenty of unemployed pilots out there, who would love to jump at the chance to make a deal with the devil and pay for their own type rating in order to get some "valuable" (?) jet time in return. "Valuable" of course has quite a relative meaning, because the only thing it allows you to do is eventually do the same thing that this topic is about: either, leaving Europe for the Middle East, or jumping from one lo-co to the other. (same :mad:, different name)

I'm sure managers like it when people are leaving. From any airline management's perspective there are just basically two limitations;

1) how fast can you train the new hires to replace the ones leaving, and
2) keeping the attrition rate to a certain level so that crewing levels don't fall below an absolute minimum.

To the ones leaving for the Middle East for a bigger, shinier jet: good luck! := :ugh:

@directvector
 

Thanks for your input. As I said in my post #23, if it's legit, I'll retract all that I have said, remove my original post and submit my apologies. If it's legit, I also support the scheme as you do - 110%. The RPG has got quite a few queries from pilots concerning this scheme and they will be enquiring, and I hope that they issue a statement about this.