July, lol, there will be no strike.

THERE WILL BE NO STRIKE.

there will be no strike because when it comes to it, BA pilots don't have the balls!

As for the dole queue - well, it ain't me threatening IA. Better to speak softly and carry a big stick.

Must have caught that from you boys.;) Lend us your lube will you mate? (if you have any left)

Speak for yourself, PM me and we can meet up and I'll explain it face to face.

If your mum lets you out for that long... :}:}:}:}:}

(only a few posts until someone accuses me of being Hand Solo or Tandem!)

Open Skies Predictions
 

Prediction # 1

By Christmas 2008, Open Skies will be a successful transatlantic pax carrier from at least two, and probably three, European airports to major US destinations.

Prediction # 2

There will have been no strike by British Airways pilots.

Prediction # 3

BALPA. [and hence most BA contributors to this forum] will applaud their victory at achieving whatever face saving concessions Willie has decided to give them.

Question:

How long before Open Skies is subbing BA cancellations, and then going onwards to actually operate UK LH routes?
I hope it will be possible to buy OS shares at some stage.

Kurtz
 

Your error with prediction 2 also makes prediction 3 false.

A Pilots strike following the T5 debacle will mean Willie and his leadership team will take a walk into the wilderness. BALPA and the majority of BA Pilots know this.

Rocky times ahead for shareholders no doubt, but massive changes at the top should see things right in the long term. BA has been a very sucessful airline at times during the past and with the right actions it can again be.


Regards
Exeng

Well I suppose everything's a gamble - but look how often Rod and Bob were written off on this forum. Granted events overtook Bob eventually, but his tails lived on for a long time.
OS is too profitable a concept not to go ahead. And I'll be right there!

Hulk
 

I agree that Open Skies will go ahead and that it should prove to be profitable; however I also believe that the crewing concept will be slightly different from that currently proposed by the current BA leadership team.

Incidentally I believe Eddington always steered BA with a steady hand, Ayling however was a different matter - he was removed so he could cause no further damage, much as Walsh I suspect will be in due course. I think that this time the it will not only be Walsh who will take some pain.

I would imagine that the only reason the tailfins remained for so long was because of the expense of a dedicated re-paint for each aircraft - each will have been done when sufficient down time for maintenance occurred.

I wish you all the best in your future career with Open Skies, I'm sure it will be an exciting time for all of you.


Regards
Exeng

Interesting to speculate how much WW will get as a bung if he and others actually are removed (and I agree with exeng it's more likely than not).
If only a single FTSE 100 Company could bring itself to dispose of top mangement the way they dispose of everyone else who screws up, then I'm sure it would be of benefit to the whole business community.

Nice post exeng, very courteous too. Have a good day!

Those predictions may be right or wrong, but I don't think I'd be handing in my notice to take a position with OS just yet.
It's not the IFALPA stance that would worry me (didn't achieve much for the HK boyos did they?) far less the BACC; it's just that until things look settled, well, they're not settled are they? Jam tomorrow is all well and good, but you need to eat today as well.

God bless all on board!

Sad fact is, most pilots know very little about the operation of an airline and the management actions that are accepted by shareholders.
T5 will calm down and work reasonably well in a few weeks.
If WW can show that the pilots (BALPA) are being unreasonable with their demands, shareholders will give the affirmative nod to management.
Will it turn ugly?
Nope, don't think so.
The BA pilots don't have the starch in 'em.
About the only thing that the BA pilots can hope to achieve is some kind of assurance that OS will not disrupt BA schedules, so that they (the BA pilots) can claim success.

Kurtz has it right, unless of course BA pilots have been sniffing the wrong stuff for too long...:rolleyes:

Blast from the Past!
 

In the days when we could run ballots on here, I thought everyone may be interested in the results of one relating to the BACC, and what everyone thought at that time.

View Poll Results:
Do BACC have the best interests of CitiExpress at heart with their Scope Clause ??

Yes 32 15.92%

No 73 36.32%

Nope, only their own wallets!!! 96 47.76%

Tous c'a change, c'est toute la meme chose! :E

The only ballot that matters is not the one on an internet forum.

Que les un tas de vieilles conneries

Why is it that almost every thread about BA mainline quickly descends into this slagging match??? (Maybe they deserve it! :E)

What really p!sses me off, is that all the mainline guys I personally know are REALLY nice, down-to-earth lads, and unfortunately you get the same arrogant jumped-up t0ssers posting here who end up tarring the entire company with the same brush. (And I do honestly believe that they are a minority with a HHHUUUGGGEEE chip on their shoulders.)

The problem is that, they are the reason that most will feel no sympathy with the normal day-to-day guys/gals who suffer at the hands of Willie Walsh.

I personally cannot help but gloat at the shambles WW has created for himself, both with T5 and OS, and cherish the thought of him squirming after his abysmal treatment of BACX staff (and BAR, who he royally sh@fted and put on the dole queue). Unfortunately, unlike the grassroots staff at those companies, he will not be financially inconvenienced, as his personal pension has been very well topped up! Funny how Rod Eddington no longer looks like such a scheister!

The shareholders can affirmatively nod to BA management until their collective heads fall off - the fact remains that a sufficiently unified labour force prepared to strike over the issue will render its implementation untenable.

The shareholders are irrelevant and don't enter into the equation, they're simply along for the ride with the controlling factor being the willingness (or unwillingness) of the pilots to strike.

Thoughtful view from R&N
 

BA is a dead firm walking. It is a relic of a day gone by and is not fit for the modern world of CAT.

Its cost base is too high, its aircraft are poor and its staff demotivated and the likes of Hand Solo and Tandem Rotor areintent on ensuring the company has no future.

Best thing would be for it to be shut down, sell off all the slots at Heathrow and give good value to the custmers.

I used to always make the effort to support BA come hell or high water especially as a passenger but not now.

ABBA - Anything But BA

Hand, Tandem, care to comment?

Interesting thread relating to Openskies here:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthr...=319542&page=2

Yes:

I find it interesting that you ascribe motives to me despite knowing neither myself nor my motives. The rest of your quotation is just plain bolleaux written by chrisbl who clearly doesn't find it necessary to justify such nonsense with any hard facts.

Bullseye!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Sorry, were you trying to reel me in by writing rubbish Fox? If you wish to look a tit then you certainly have hit the bull.;)

PS I found this in one of your previous posts:

How's that CitiExpress Gatwick base coming along?;)

yup, convinced now. Tandemrotor and Hand solo are the same person. Same bullying traits.

Aaah the 'bullying' accusation. Don't like what they have to say, must be bullying then! If your arguments are so weak that any counter argument is considered bullying then perhaps you shouldn't be allowed on the internet unsupervised. Maybe some of my 'victims' can sue Danny for emotional trauma!

not denying you and tandemrotor are one and the same then?

No I'm not Tandem Rotor, and if you suggest it again I'll steal your dinner money.:}

Foxone

You really are a tit mate.

"ba has no future" - amazing for a company with a £7billion turnover.

"it's planes are poor" - Ok the small number of 757's left and old A320s' are a bit shabby but the 60 odd almost new Airbii and 45 or so 777s'? Have you actually been on a BA plane lately?

I hardly ever come on here anymore now as the amount of ****e written is getting beyond a joke. Also every thread; in time seems to degenerate into bashing either BA or Ryanair.

foxone is the same person as 757flyer, 's obvious!

Well, after BAConnect, oops, BACitflyer Express, oops, BACitiExpress, oops, CityflyerExpress Ltd....are quietly absorbed into mainline in 18 months(ish) time, still on their sh1te Ts and Cs, you will then inevitably see the spread of those Ts and Cs to the the Gatwick base, and also to the London City base.
Meanwhile, OS will have formed, and will be taking business more profitably away from selected mainline routes. This will be a trend which will increase over the next few years.
Inevitably my dear playground bully, the times they are indeed a changin', they've crept up on you and you didn't notice until it was too late. Oh, I'm sure the compromise will be dressed up as a BALPA win, but let's face it - you've had erosion of those Ts and Cs in real terms for quite a while now, and with the cost of oil and inflation generally, not to mention the LIBOR effect being passed on to industry borrowings and leverage - (a particular problem for BA) - the good times are well and truly over.
But I don't hold grudges, you - (or Hand Solo) - can be my co-pilot (PNF) any time!:ok: If you're grown up enough to fly long haul, we could even be a heavy crew - I'll get the first round just to show there's no hard feelings!

And no, I'm not proud to worker harder than you for less than you, but I need the job, my family need the income, and if it means taking your job - I suppose you'll find yourself in an inevitably shrinking quad (playground to you old lad).
Do I care? Is the Pope a Protestant?

fox one.
oh my god, another brilliant quote from an industry bottom feeder. You guys are incredible. just to get facts straight its working harder for peanuts.


anybody who wants to do back to back jfk's 3 times a month must be pathetically desperate to do long haul. they are either such a poor standard of pilot that they are unable to get a job flying long haul with any other operator or one whose present long haul experience is on MS FS2000. last time i checked they where planning to do all there trips 2 man, not sure that stealin mitt planning any heavy crews (maybe it's new banter that you don't get).

Whats worse is that you insinuate that this will be a pay rise for you! how desperate must you be? just how poor a candidate for a decent job must you be? I can only guess that anybody wanting a job for OS has bombed out everywhere else!

fox 3 kill the fwit in the rj!

Don't worry the heavy heavy.
This is a guy that hasnt got anything relevant to say looking at his previous posts.
Just opinionated and not open to arguments.
It's a shame that this is what we are up against.

So in the meantime I let the foresight of the 'new' BACC do the talking.

reading his posts do make me feel wonderfully able and successfull though :O

fox one is an interesting choice of name. i doubt very much its a term he has ever used in the air? :confused:

Yeah, just like they did when (the much larger) Cityflyer Express was merged into EOG. Clearly a man who doesn't concern himself with the lessons of history.

seems to have gone very quiet about OS, have the problems with BALPA been resolved? I gather they now have their AOC.

"It's quiet. Too quiet!"

The issue goes to the High Court on May 19th. BA have had to disclose all documentation related to OS to the court. In 10 days well see just what their assurances are worth.

Are OS due to commence service soon? What will happen to the pilots already flying for them? If Balpa gets its way will they be integrated into the master seniority list or tagged on the bottom? Interesting for some of the BA retired pilots who have joined OS, one minute they are top of the list then they are bottom!!

to The Heavy Heavy
 

From your choice of callsign old lad; youd only ever have called RABBIT RABBIT when you heard mine own.

Oh and Handyboy -

Pity you didnt do the same with the much smaller BACX......but of course you didnt need to, did you....

Contrary to popular opinion, it is not in the gift of BALPA to decide who BA Plc chooses to employ.

OS pilots were recruited to 'different' criteria to mainline (according to BA) BA may choose not to retain them at all, in preference to granting them access to mainline fleets.

Absolutely nothing is certain!

However, they will all have realised the uncertain position they put themselves in when they chose to defy the IFALPA recruitment ban. With such a tiny number of individuals affected, and all with less than 2 years in the company, I am unsure as to what protection from redundancy they could expect?

BA, under WW is now more 'slash and burn' than 'caring employer'!

Hear hear - can you see the headlines - BA makes pilots redundant, BA breaks employment rules, BA breaks contracts, BA breaks European law, BA appear in the European court of Human Rights, more Sunday Broadsheet front pages......it's enough to make you realise that BALPA would be on their case, wouldn't that make for an interesting thread on here!
Obviously Hand Solo would support ANY vocal pilot group trying to protect their jobs!
Yup, I think our careers with OS are safe.

Well a lot of you guys will get what you wanted, a back door into BA.
Expect a very quiet time down route as you'll struggle to find a skipper that will join you in the bar. As for cabin crew....well it's BA crew after all.. :}

Welcome back PontiousPilot/ROTPS. I think you may have slightly misjudged BA management if you think they give a jot about bad headlines. BA could of course tag you all on to the bottom of the mainline seniority list, just like they did with Cityflyer. Of course if you then fail to make the grade within mainline they won't hesitate to chop you, just like they did with some Cityflyer pilots. That'll give some people something to think about if they've repeatedly failed to make the grade in mainline.

of course, modern management believe that any headline is free publicity. BA will pick and choose who they want by selective failing of OPC/LPC.