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Oskar I have to agree with you the new proposed new deal is complete and utter c**p! Everyone is getting s*****d. The proposed new sector pay is ridiculous for all concerned
I write this from a Second Officers point of view having just come off half sector pay. They arrived at this SO rate by stating that due to SO being on half sector for 6 months then full sector pay for 6 months you earn 75% of the full wack. OK so if this deal would go through SO's having just come off half sector would now have to accept the new rate effectively giving them around 60% of what they would have been entitled to under the current conditions.....RIDICULOUS:yuk: . This is how I see it and please correct me if I have got it wrong. I base this on an average of Ģ1900/month sector at STN. 1900 x 12 = 22800/yr 22800/900 = 25.33/hr 75% of 22800 = 17100 (Currently for SO) 17100/900 = 19.00/hr So the proposed figures of Ģ15/hr for 4 or more sectors & Ģ17/hr for less than 4 ???????????:confused: As i see it there are bugger all 2 sector days left in STN anyway so Ģ15 x 900 = Ģ13500 sector a year :yuk: Thankfully the general feeling amongst pilots in the meeting I attended was that any difference in pays between the ranks should be reflected in the basic (which it currently is) and not in the sector. What do my colleagues think have i got it right or completely wrong? LOOP:ok: |
You got it absolutely right . It's a rip off .:ok:
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O.k....... who :mad: LEO off,and by the looks of it hes really :} ....! Well I think its high time that we start to stand up for ourselves and go down the same lines South West went down 10 years ago.We cant take this deal and if we do we deserve every bit of **** that comes with it. I find it pretty amazing that they had the balls to offer something like this but then again this is Ryanair.I'm sick of hearing "oh its only this or that",well "this and that" has added up to a hell of alot over the last few years. "We Need To Make A Stand".Cant get onto repa today for some strange reason but is there going to be a meeting next week any time.:cool:
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vanw you should have got a text about "possible meetings Mon 13th" from the ERC. REPA is hopping and the rebellion is gathering momentum. I too had a short period of the site being slow to access, but I got on after a short period.
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Thanks Aloue......! I was waiting 20min and gave up there was to many on the site.Glad to see its begun....!:rolleyes: Have'nt been in Stn for a week and didn't as usual hear about the town hall slaughter...!Does any one know what s/o are starting on now and what are f/o starting on now.:ok:
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Originally Posted by jedy
OK so this is how is going to work:
* No we get 12 days of our leave allocated at companys discretion = before I could use these days as I wish and for every 6 days of my leave I actually get 12 days off. TOTAL LOSS 12 DAYS * Now I go to the sim on my days off = before no f*****g way. TOTAL LOSS 4 TO 6 DAYS * Now if I go sick when I get back I will work 5 on 3 off or 5 on 2 off to compensate my absence = before no f*****g way. TOTAL LOSS FEW DAYS * Now because all of these rules my roster patern can change frecuently = before I had a very stable roster. TOTAL LOSS STEADY ROSTER * Now because we fly 5 on 4 off I will be spreading my 900 hours throughout the year = before I enjoyed at least 16 days of not available because I have been very high on hours every single month and I will also lose my January, February and March of not flying because I don't have any more hours left = TOTAL LOSS 16 DAYS and JANUARY, FEBRUARY AND MARCH OFF * Now because all these benefits the company will change my flight pay = before no change. TOTAL LOSS 15% REDUCTION * Now we won't get pension, medicals, loss of license, food, water, car park = before I did'nt get that either. TOTAL LOSS MY SENSE OF HUMOR * Now we get s**t share options but for that you will have to stay in this company for the next 5 years = before we did'nt get that but quite frankly who wants to stay here 5 years anyway. TOTAL LOSS 5 YEARS OF MY LIFE I am starting to see signs of desperation because the truth is that the current 5 on 3 off roster that we have at the moment it just simply doesn't work. We all get so high on hours every month that they have to give us lots of not available days. By the time we reach January we all don't have hours left so they have to wet lease just about every airline in Europe to fly for us and if they don't change something I wonder where are they going to find enough captains to fly their new and shiny 45 B737-800 that are coming next year. Just say no and say yes to 4 on 4 off, medicals, loss of license, pension, etc. Finally the market is changeing and is time to get what we lost. |
I am looking for the Camel.
Where are you? We like to see how are you now going to defend your beloved company on this one. :8 :8 :8 |
kinetic - lack of care for capt. pizza etc is one of the contributing factors in this whole mess.the whole me,me,me concept,greed and avarice is for me an travesty.we are a unique breed of people who have a common bond of doing what we love.no matter how much these mongrels deface us,we have to rise above them.we may not like to fight but there are times when we have to.
most likely a pilot meeting for ryanair pilots scheduled for next monday details to be provided at later stage.i would urge all ryanair pilots to attend and show their caring and support for their colleagues.that in itself would be a good thing.(even non ryanair pilots can come,bring a few tinnies!) LOVE YOU LEO! |
I personally wouldn't give a to$$ if DOB;s money was cut, Capt pizza from Rome got a payrise or guys that i didn't know got sent to the new outer Moingolia base |
GR, I am a little insulted at your insinuation, its about balanced perspectives, believe me I am making my opinion known on REPA about the proposals, I am on the [email protected] mailing list and I am going on Monday to shout my opposition to this scandalous offer.
I don't want to pick a fight with anyone but if I may ask you this GR assuming you're not DUB based, when you heard JG in Dublin was in court for victimisation did you sympathise with him like I?.... am sure you did.Did you want him to wipe the smug grin off O'Learys face??...I bet like me you did. Were you willing to to openly attack the company, without the veil of annonymity, for it's disgusting treatment of your fellow brother?? When the Dub guys walked out of the ERC and into the Labour courts did not part of you rejoice and think...go on lads we're proud of you... I'm sure it did for all of us. Did you make it known to management you sided with them, and wanted to bring your own legal case against RYR in support of your fellow man?? |
come on guys,where is the love!
kinetic,check that stnerc address.maybe intentional,but it is wrong. |
cheers GR corrected
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Some fair points Kinetic. My problem is more with people who refuse to join BALPA/IALPA/REPA and hope the whole problem will go away without it affecting them. I can't understand how people feel that unless an issue directly affects them, there's no need to offer even silent support (which is what joining a union is). I'm not suggesting at all that people are going to put their heads above the parapet and get it chopped off. What I am saying is that their is no excuse for not joining the union - the more members the more muscle. Sympathy isn't good enough, a showing a willingness to stand together and fight is.
The I'm all right Jack, it won't affect me attitude is short-sighted and ultimately counter-productive. What has "direct negotiation" done to improve T&C's?? On the other hand, a strong union hasn't done too badly at keeping things at least tolerable at many many other companies. Make no mistake, if FR win this one, it's time to find a new career. |
CamelHair.... I agree entirely, and I have very recently joined BALPA, even though I am not pro Union. With the impending fights ahead I wanted some facility for legal advice and possibly protection if it gets nasty ala Dublin (Leo don't bother to cut and paste please).
good that its only 0.5% for first year as well so it doesn'y really cost that much...... In fact with the current RYR pay proposal, it maybe the best time ever to join as with all these pay cuts :confused: :yuk: , one advantage is the BALPA subscriptions will go down!! |
ALL REPA MEMBERS.
Formulation of what pilots want in a REAL pilot agreement,started on the Ryanair european pilots website. If you're not in you can't win.www.repaweb.org. |
I have read the proposed agreement, and it's shambolic.
We will be signing up for a large pay cut, victimisation for being sick and reducing days off in return, less annual leave when WE want it, sim on days OFF??? and with promotion to captain you get 85% basic for a whole year?? Are they crazy? Of course all of the newbie cadets won't care, they'll sign anything and could screw it up for the rest of us. If this goes ahead there will be an exodus! Ryanair have stooped to an even newer low. By making this an unhappy place to be can only have an effect on safety in the long run. :* |
I think all this talk of aggresive Ryanair management towards pilots is quite sad to say the least. More so when you conisder that unskilled Burger King employees have far more legal and apparent rights than pilots.
I'm no lover of unions in any sense of the imagination but maybe it's time to take your story of woe and go see Bob Crowe. If he can still maintain momentum for the already fat tube drivers then surely it would be near enough a breeze for him to take on the Ryanair management, at least shake the tree a bit. After all it appears that you're constantly fighting a defensive ordeal with MOL and a quick poke at him will be of some surprise. It will give some degree of satisifacttion to the many aircrew whom he puts through the grinder just because 'daddy didn't buy him a pony when he was younger'. Go get him boys ! |
Morning glory,not sure if you have seen the pilots proposal,but it is very good.Look into it.
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Morning glory.you obviously haven't been on repaweb.I Won't indulge you.Take care.
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MORNING GLORY.
Think you missed the word "pilots" The Pilots proposal, not the companies. please join or sign into http://www.repaweb.org and join in the debate/action to change our future. |
Ok point taken. I do think that sim on our days off is wrong though.
There is another issue which exists that nobody seems to care about. There are experienced first officers joining the company who start on a much higher basic than many of the senior F/O's currently employed with more hours. How can this be fair???? When the point has been raised - No answers! Any new deal must also address these issues to ensure the pilot body is an equal and fair place to be. |
I thought the EU rule was 4 weeks leave + Bank Holidays. The 20 days leave is calculated on the assumption that a working week is 5 days, as in office workers. Don't get sold down the swanny with 20 days leave in a 24/7 industry. It has to be 4 weeks. It would be illeagal to reduce this, and by definition any duty at the company's request can not qualify as a day off. Thus how can you perform sims on a day off? It also follows that you can not de denied leave or forced to sell it back; only that in excess of 4 weeks. Any company can say what they want, but even MOL has to abide by the law.
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but even MOL has to abide by the law. |
A question for those of you flying for Ryanair....
To what bases does the new 5 on 4 off apply? I dont have access to repaweb :bored: |
Kinetic alluding to someones profile is wrong, which you did in one of your previous posts.:yuk:
People have the right to say what they want whether right or wrong. It is an opinion on an anonymous forum. Please edit your post. Going back to the supposed Agreement. My advice is that it sounds like a pile of :mad:. There is nothing being offered to you, 5-4 is an illusion. It is 5-2 for all intents and purposes. You are taking a pay cut with no t+c's to sponsor cheap tickets. Do the right and only thing. REJECT IT. |
Ryanair pilot meeting.
Monday March 13th. Hadham suite,Hilton hotel Stansted. 1100 and 1430. Pilot committee available from 0900 to 1630. If you care anything for your future,attend make your opinion known. |
Flybe tried to pull a fast one on thier employees's too by changing from 6/2 to 6/3 ;they took control of the doil's(bank holiday) so they could use them for the extra 3rd day off.
Luckily enough it was spotted and balpa said it was an illegal manouever as you cant willing change contractual leave and bank holidays....beware :mad: |
PPrune even quoted in the new Flight International; not bad!:ok:
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Well, that's it then, what ever it is it must be true!!
Errr.. what is it (the quote, that is)? |
Well, its a whole article about the new proposed deal (title: Pilots Ponder Ryanair deal) ; which is apparently partly based on the info given in this thread (like the info that certain duties will have to be performed in these 4 days off as a result etc.).
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www.repaweb.org
Spread the word, this thing is starting to develop some momentum. Well done to the company for pushing us into the arms of Ialpa. |
So now they come up with having different agreements based on each pilotīs base choice. Please donīt be foolish, and stick together. The best thing they can do in order to ruin our T&Cīs even more is to divide the pilot group. Stick together, and we will be stronger. And please, with inflation as it is, 1% rise per annum is a big decrease, not an increase. JUST SAY NO
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RYR-Pilots, check crewdock : Letter to all Pilots . But increas in CPīs salary ??? - I donīt think so, there are no figures mentioned! The hell, I should know, itīs an increase or decrease?!
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And further : New figures mentioned to STN-Pilots per hour as sector pay.
Anybody who already calculated, whether itīs gonna be better for us??? :confused: |
Just log in www.repaweb.org . There's been a lot of discussion on that .
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What again is the new figure for Ģ/per block hour?? Also is Luton/Liverpool/Prestwick being offered same deal as the STN guys??
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RednexThe debate elsewhere has move on a lot. I think most of us would prefer all of this to be done together in a non-public forum. Also, it's not quite so easy to answer your questions as the issues are being "re-framed" in the other debate.
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Just saw the article about the "mysterious" changes to schedules for Ryanair pilots in Flight International (I was late in reading it). I don't understand why someone can't just crunch the numbers to determine the net benefit/cost of this proposed change? Has someone done that already?
So, what's the deal? Will this be good or not for the pilots? I am thinking 4 days off is a nice break, but if you can't control your holiday schedule, then this might not be as great. However, you can take some nice breaks during those 4-day periods, right? Still pretty confusing... |
This is Ryanair, so things are not how they seem. The fact that Ryanair pilots have not grabbed this "wonderful proposal" tells you all you need to know.
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