Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.


Old 7th Feb 2003, 20:10
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Northern Europe
Posts: 1
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Question Scope

Have you been fighting to get a scope-clause with your airline? If so, how did it go, and what could I expect if my pilot union takes this step?

In case you're not sure, what I mean with a scope is a deal that regulates what is to be flown by a Major airline vs. its subsidiaries.

What's best and worst (in your opinion) with your scope?
MrBardman is offline  
Old 8th Feb 2003, 08:09
  #2 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2002
Location: gamma quadrant
Posts: 275
Received 7 Likes on 1 Post
Mr Bardman,

If you relate to BA Balpa's scope plan's, I understand a small family run highly professional airline in the S/E UK is currently on the top of their list to be scoped...
I can tell you there's a funny smell around the place recently!!!!
Me think's someone is going to be S**T on..
propaganda is offline  
Old 8th Feb 2003, 16:17
  #3 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: SE UK
Posts: 242
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
As a BA pilot I would have no objections to your seniority list being merged with ours (If you're referring to GB Airways). The fate of CFE and Dan Air have riddled our seniority list with anomolies, Grandfather rights and most of all it has made too many of my colleagues demotivated and cynical.

We have too much to lose if GB/Bmed are played against us as 'alternatives' so to share resources would make both business sense but also provide a little more protection for our futures.
Land ASAP is offline  
Old 10th Feb 2003, 14:28
  #4 (permalink)  
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: The Deep South (Sussex)
Posts: 783
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Forgive my ignorance, I have never worked for either BA or GB, but wouldn't placing the GB pilots on the BA seniority list only really benefit BA pilots?

In the event of an expansion, being on the BA list might eventually enable a GB pilot to bid for 744's at LHR. But in view of the probable down size in mainline, the most likely scenario would result in the GB pilots being used as cannon fodder as most of them would be propping up the bottom of the combined list.

When BA is reduced in size, they would be the first to go with their commands going to "redundant" long haul pilots.

Lou Scannon is offline  
Old 10th Feb 2003, 20:03
  #5 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: uk
Posts: 17
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts

I am presuming from your post that you would be happy for a pilot who has been at GB for 6 years to gain 6 years BA seniority. As it is BA BALPA who is pushing for a merger I think this would be right and proper. However, how many of your fellow BA pilots would think this a good idea?
Reality Checks is offline  
Old 10th Feb 2003, 20:41
  #6 (permalink)  
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: England
Posts: 335
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
This seems like picking up from a lively thread near the end of last year when the BA Boffins were under pressure by BALPA to scope GB to prevent a bun-fight out at in the sticks at MAN and BHX. With so much un-certainty at the mo with BA and the old boy handing the company to his son, I wouldn't be surprised if GB is not scoped within 18 months...With Maersk getting sold off it leaves just BMed and GB...How long before BA offer a offer they couldn't refuse ???
Jet A1 is offline  
Old 11th Feb 2003, 10:25
  #7 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2002
Location: uk
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Jet A1 says he wouldn't be surprised if a deal was done in the next 18 months. I doubt it. Nothing will happen for over 5 years - ie nothing before the franchise deal expires and comes up for renwal and renegotiation.
If BALPA force Rod Eddington to put onerous or expensive rules regarding who can or cannot fly GB aircraft (when painted in BA colours) into the next franchise deal, then GB may have to sign up with some other big partner who is interested in doing business. Perhaps Easyjet might still be around by then, and would be interested in a partnerhip or franchise. It would be a financial blow to BA and a diaster for about 100 BA staff(check-in, ramp, line engineering) at LGW who depend on contracts from GB for work. I am sure that GB would rather retain a link with BA, as it has a continuous link that goes back to 1931. GB, for many years chartered BA aircraft and BA crews to fly some of its routes. Until a few years ago BA used to own half of GB, but BA decided to sell when it was pointed out that a franchisee can't be a franchiser at the same time!. GB is a business, not a club that is there to provide jobs for pilots, so the final decision will have to be well and truly positive from a financial angle. Hopefully BA Balpa members who are obviously thinking of themselves, will also think about the effect their Scope Clause will have on Balpa colleagues in GB, and their own colleagues in BA whose present jobs depend on GB being a successful business.

For those in BA, please remember that GB is a profitable business, that tries hard to live in a diificult commercial world. BA, while commendably profitable in the recent quarter figures, is struggling under debts of 6 billion and a pension fund shortfall of 1 billion in an equally, or possibly more difficult commercial world. If the two groups of pilots ever have to sit round a table to do a deal, please treat GB with some respect.
fiftyfour is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.