Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.

BA bidline

Old 7th Mar 2019, 10:17
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Cheltenham
Age: 70
Posts: 4
BA bidline

Is Bidline still in use at BA?
biggles744 is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 10:20
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 828
Touching a raw nerve here, no is the answer.
RexBanner is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 12:22
  #3 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Cheltenham
Age: 70
Posts: 4
Originally Posted by RexBanner View Post
Touching a raw nerve here, no is the answer.
What happened?
biggles744 is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 12:28
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 950
They replaced it with a “better” system that appears to have not been well recieved.
Johnny F@rt Pants is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 13:05
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 828
Not well received because virtually all of the promises made by Balpa before the vote as to the how the system would operate have turned out to be complete falsehoods.
RexBanner is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 14:12
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: southeast
Posts: 419
Don’t forget the ‘they’ is the pilot workforce who voted it in......funny how I never seem to fly with anyone who voted ( or admits to having voted) for it. Strange world. My view at the time was quite simplistic, if the company wants the new system (JSS) in place of the old (Bidline) , then it will certainly benefit the company. And yet, the pilot workforce voted it in...go figure.
sidtheesexist is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 15:09
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,650
I didn't vote for either......!!!!!

What got missed by some (wishful thinking?) was that there was actually an element of fairness built onto the line bidding system.... .if you wanted plum trip A you may well have to also do duff trip B, though of course the savvy could mitigate some of the rubbish.

Chuck in the fact the vote on JSS was conflated with the issue of flying pay and Bingo.


Last edited by wiggy; 7th Mar 2019 at 18:19. Reason: Phone induced errors removed..
wiggy is online now  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 16:35
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Uk
Age: 38
Posts: 428
I get the same dross I got before but now it is minimum rest and 5-6 day blocks. The nice surprise trips I used to get have vanished. Early to late reports and 4 sector day trips. 9 weeks in and I am going to have to bring it up at my medical. I can’t sleep properly, I have fell asleep in my uniform in a service station and I show signs of fatigue or possibly depression. Still “Let’s chat” said NP........shame no f#£ker is listening.

Its not the volume of work, it’s the construction of the work and the intensity of it. Mentally I am exhausted.
bex88 is online now  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 17:06
  #9 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Cheltenham
Age: 70
Posts: 4
biggles744

Is there no equivalent of Flexi cap, or whatever it was called under Bidline?
biggles744 is offline  
Old 7th Mar 2019, 18:38
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,650
The flexible credited hours target is still there...(as was the case in the final days of Bidline), but the problem (one of many) is it’s magnitude...and that is a function of the pilot establishment and flying programme....variables that are firmly in the hands of the company.

One big problem at the moment - it appears easier under JSS for senior bidders to get a higher percentage of high credit trips than under Bidline (despite continuing attempts by pilot reps to reduce that ability through putting blockers/inhibitors into the software) this is leading to some junior pilots picking up multiple multiple low credit trips...and that’s just one issue for starters, I’m not sure we have time or space to talk about all the other gripes, such as how quickly the system gives up on looking at junior pilots preferences for trips, or has to ignore preferences, in order to get the work covered by the available pilots.....


wiggy is online now  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 03:40
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: North
Posts: 37
Mandatory reporting

These levels of fatigue all sound quite terrible. For everyone one’s sake I hope that you file fatigue reports and forward them to CAA and also report not fit when deemed necessary.
Icejock is offline  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 05:20
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,650
I think historically at BA there’s a been a bit of reluctance to report fatigue (after all we had Bidline...best rostering system in the world, etc, so there couldn’t be any fatigue......) and that in turn appeared to lead to a mindset by some in management that BA pilots simply can’t have fatigue problems.

Fortunately that is now changing (at the pilot level) -and IMHO some of that change is driven by to DEPs coming into BA from other airlines which have a slightly more enlightened and modern attitude to fatigue and the reporting of fatigue

Last edited by wiggy; 8th Mar 2019 at 05:59.
wiggy is online now  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 06:05
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: London
Age: 41
Posts: 134
Originally Posted by Johnny [email protected] Pants View Post
They replaced it with a “better” system that appears to have not been well recieved.
I would go with received with mixed feelings.

Direct entry long haul did indeed get a whole lot more

With shorthaul comparing the JSS junior roosters to the old blind lines it looks very similar. The group of junior pilots does look a bit bigger under JSS. The criticism from the other SH pilots (non junior >40% of the bottom) is the amount of tempering of the system the BALPA reps are doing. The amount of destinations with inhibitors on them is just getting ridiculous (39 destinations) Quiet a few complain emails have gone to the guys doing all this tempering with regards to what on earth they did with the April bid.
Jumbo2 is offline  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 06:57
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: North
Posts: 37
This type of seniority-based rostering feels so archaic, I understand that everyone who has been in the system for several years want to get their time to get a good roster but to judge junior pilots spare time as less important than others is quite strange. I fully support that seniority rules upgrades and fleets and so on but everyones time off and chance to spend it with family should all be treated equal.
Icejock is offline  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 07:02
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: The Back of Beyond
Posts: 364
Oh here we go, a snowflake chimes in from the peanut gallery...
Flying Clog is offline  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 07:16
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,650
Originally Posted by Icejock View Post
This type of seniority-based rostering feels so archaic.... I fully support that seniority rules upgrades and fleets and so on but everyones time off and chance to spend it with family should all be treated equal.
Problem is you need the wisdom of Solomon to sort this out, because what some would regard is a “good” roster with time off in the right places, others would regard as pants and awful for family life.....and this in part one of the reasons for some of the complaints about BALPA reps interfering with the process.









wiggy is online now  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 08:00
  #17 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Cheltenham
Age: 70
Posts: 4
Smile

Retirement! It is waiting for you all, no JSS or Bidline, in fact it is a rostered system, I do what my wife says!
biggles744 is offline  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 11:20
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 1,635
I once had a Pilot who hadn't flown in a month and he still complained about the flight assigned. Trying to keep "Nigels" happy is something that's for the best part of 40 years been really hard to achieve....
Mr Angry from Purley is offline  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 22:40
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Cloud Cookoo Land
Posts: 1,271
Can anyone explain how JSS was sold to the pilots? As it seems to me, BA had massive crewing headaches and wee unable to fill lines of work under Bidline; so JSS was mostly beneficial to rostering and crewing?

As you can probably tell, I’m not BA however the current system seems to be a real sh1tfest for junior crew. I realise PPRuNe is far from a true reflection however there are some horror stories. I hope you make it bex88; look after yourself. I’ve felt how you’re feeling.
Callsign Kilo is offline  
Old 8th Mar 2019, 23:05
  #20 (permalink)  

PPRuNe Person
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: see roster
Posts: 1,265
The balance of the ruleset known as “bidline” is still intact. What people are talking about here is the roster production element.
overstress is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.