Ryanair 5/5 Floaters Anyone on it?

[zerotohero]

Just looking on the Ryanair website at the 5/5 Floating deal. Its €199 PSBH these days. It was circa €140 when I left it in 2012. I was on the old BRK deal then where they just paid all the money into my bank and me and my own local accountant hashed out my tax and NI liabilities and paid HMRC direct as a self employed pilot.

I did move onto the LTD company farce for about 18 months in a UK base which was a pain in the hole as I had to do all the online expenses stuff but came out with a decent wage most of the time when they did not cock it up.

What I hear though is that I was supposed to be paying employer NI contributions as I sort of employed myself. This is as we know very inefficient as its about triple what a self employed person pays.

Has this all been sorted out now if I was to come back as a contractor on the 5/5 deal? or will I get shafted or...........Do I have to take my wage as expenses to make it pay? therefore sort of avoiding paying myself a real wage but still getting the cash in my bank? This was what really drove me out as it was legal ish but just shifty in my eyes and begging for an audit.

Any actual 5/5 contractors able to comment on this?

I did like the 5/5 life as it was nice to just go to work and live in hotels to get good rest and the job done then jumpseat home for days off with no chance off been called as your always too high on hours so could just down tools and have a bit of life. Main negative was trying to get A/L to have a couple of weeks off as the 10 ad hoc days you could book were never allowed in the summer.

Anyway just looking for info on the 5/5 take home and how it works currently.

Thanks

[Boeing 7E7]

Ah yes, the whole “self employed thing” where “we” the tax payer foot the bill for all your/ Ryanair expenses.

[MonarchOrBust]

How did you figure that one out?

[Boeing 7E7]

Oh come off it! Everyone knows the scams that pilots at Ryanair pull in order to reduce their tax bill, increase their earnings and allow Ryanair as a business to not pay for costs that are normally associated with running an airline - HOTAC, Headset’s and much more. Ultimately, when you claim things back from the taxman, it is tax payer that pays up for it. The rest of us!

[zerotohero]

Ok.... All great arguments and worthy of discussion at length.

But anyone able to answer the query?

[Boeing 7E7]

Originally Posted by midnight cruiser

Nice rant - but whether its a contractor or the company that provides allowable expenses such as headsets, hotels etc, the company would reclaim the expense from business tax just the same as a contractor would, so there is no difference.

So why don’t Ryanair do it? Like most airline business. It’s because there is fiddle going on and if you’re not part of it, you’re paying for it.

[ICEHOUSES]

All Airline pilots operating on a Ltd company basis as disguised employment in the UK supplying only one customer are operating illegally and can expect a knock at the door by the Taxman.

[clvf88]

Originally Posted by midnight cruiser

However, cadets who join Ryanair from flying school as a contractor have a massive tax advantage because they offset the cost of prior ATPL training, so you could argue we all pay for that.

No one offsets ATPL training - none of the RYR assigned accountants would allow it as it’s not permissible. Perhaps you’re getting confused with the type rating course?

[The Foss]

I believe they now have a floating contract for Italian bases and German bases, where you only operate from one country but have a directly employed local contract.

As for the normal floating its still the limited company setup, so paying both employer and employee social insurance as well as income tax. Works out as a very high tax bill unless you have a significant amount of expenses to offset it, but think the guys still make reasonable money.

[Charlie_Oskar_DA42]

Originally Posted by zerotohero

Just looking on the Ryanair website at the 5/5 Floating deal. Its €199 PSBH these days. It was circa €140 when I left it in 2012. I was on the old BRK deal then where they just paid all the money into my bank and me and my own local accountant hashed out my tax and NI liabilities and paid HMRC direct as a self employed pilot.

I did move onto the LTD company farce for about 18 months in a UK base which was a pain in the hole as I had to do all the online expenses stuff but came out with a decent wage most of the time when they did not cock it up.

What I hear though is that I was supposed to be paying employer NI contributions as I sort of employed myself. This is as we know very inefficient as its about triple what a self employed person pays.

Has this all been sorted out now if I was to come back as a contractor on the 5/5 deal? or will I get shafted or...........Do I have to take my wage as expenses to make it pay? therefore sort of avoiding paying myself a real wage but still getting the cash in my bank? This was what really drove me out as it was legal ish but just shifty in my eyes and begging for an audit.

Any actual 5/5 contractors able to comment on this?

I did like the 5/5 life as it was nice to just go to work and live in hotels to get good rest and the job done then jumpseat home for days off with no chance off been called as your always too high on hours so could just down tools and have a bit of life. Main negative was trying to get A/L to have a couple of weeks off as the 10 ad hoc days you could book were never allowed in the summer.

Anyway just looking for info on the 5/5 take home and how it works currently.

Thanks

You now have the option in Ryanair to go as mobile pilot on a 5/5 and be a direct employee of Ryanair. Not self employed or a contractor. As a captain the salary is €80K plus €80 PSB

[Fly4Fun]

Is Ryanair still offering the floating contracts?

Thanks in advance

[Floater19]

only for moroccan bases.

[Lazyturtle]

Originally Posted by Floater19

only for moroccan bases.

Not true

[fredthedog]

Originally Posted by ICEHOUSES

All Airline pilots operating on a Ltd company basis as disguised employment in the UK supplying only one customer are operating illegally and can expect a knock at the door by the Taxman.

Not necessarily there are plenty that simply tot up what they earned in the fiscal year, minus expenses and submit a self assessment and pay the taxman accordingly. Me being one of them.

For example for the year 2023-2024 I just submitted and paid my tax bill which was essentially half of what I earned. Sickening but keeps the taxman away from the door!

[58730]

People buy their coffee at Starbucks, groceries at Tesco, everything else at Amazon and then post using their device running MSFT, Apple or Android (google) to post complaints that a 20 something starting their career isn’t paying their fair share.

[Pizza Express]

Who is paying your APD when you are travelling to and from work on a free flight? Ryanair employment practices have done nothing other than drag down the whole sector. Forming umbrella companies based it the Isle of Man and then getting paid though Dublin via the Caymen Islands to avoid paying your Tax. Get a proper employment contract with a proper airline would be my advice. And yes you should be paying your NI contributions.

[PPRuNeUser481044]

Originally Posted by Pizza Express

Who is paying your APD when you are travelling to and from work on a free flight? Ryanair employment practices have done nothing other than drag down the whole sector. Forming umbrella companies based it the Isle of Man and then getting paid though Dublin via the Caymen Islands to avoid paying your Tax. Get a proper employment contract with a proper airline would be my advice. And yes you should be paying your NI contributions.

When you are travelling on your "free flight" as you put it, you travel as a supernumerary. There is no ticket issued as you are a crew member, so there is no APD. You must wear your uniform etc and you are noted as a supernumerary on the loadsheet.