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Old 12th Mar 2016, 09:28
  #41 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 196
I always assumed that we only had to preserve the identity of PPRuNe members. In other words not "out" their true identity. No one has linked a PPRuNe alias to Jo.

Anyway, I have a copy of that email so possibly 4000 was used to justify Flybe getting involved with CTC and to simmer the frustration amongst the applicants. Deano777 obviously knows her personally so maybe 1300 is accurate. It's still a significant number of applicants.
maxed-out is offline  
Old 12th Mar 2016, 09:58
  #42 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 670
You're not allowed to refer to management figures by name nor anybody else who does not authorise it. It's got nothing to do with whether they are on PPRuNe or not.

(I'm not trying to police anything, I just think it's bad form to be using an HR person's name on a public forum without their consent - and somebody has previously posted her surname too - which I suspect is why that particular post has disappeared indicating the mods take the same opinion as me).
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Old 12th Mar 2016, 10:15
  #43 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 196
Okay. I'll wait to hear from the Mods or they can simply delete my post. In the BA forum a certain persons name has been mentioned consistently without anyone getting their knickers in a twist.

All the best.
maxed-out is offline  
Old 12th Mar 2016, 10:18
  #44 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 670
Look at it this way, if you were in charge of recruitment at an airline and already snowed under with work, would you then want your name and position advertised on PPRuNe so every Tom, Dick and Harry can come searching for you? Granted a lot of people do already know this name but this just increases the pool even further. I would suggest you might not be happy with people doing this. That's not getting your knickers in a twist it's just common courtesy.
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Old 12th Mar 2016, 13:21
  #45 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Somewhere In The South China Sea
Posts: 960
To be honest I don't think any harm has been done. Her last name hasn't been mentioned and if I were to mention a "Gertrude" or something in relation to BA then I am sure there would be someone called that within BA. I've edited mine just as a precaution.
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Old 14th Mar 2016, 18:08
  #46 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: England
Posts: 105
Deano777: I can actually here your sarcastic tones punching through there. lololol.
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Old 17th Mar 2016, 21:22
  #47 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sweden
Age: 43
Posts: 2
Scandinavian contract?

Does anyone know how the SAS contract is crewed? Is it a "separate" recruitment or is it manned by ordinary Flybe? Also interested in their pay / roster / hiring situation for those scandinavian routes.

Last edited by flyinA; 17th Mar 2016 at 21:45.
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Old 18th Mar 2016, 14:07
  #48 (permalink)  
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: European Administrative Area (Western District and Islands)
Posts: 211
Its a completely separate setup, the flight crew are all employed through a contract agency. Interestingly they have just fought for and won some better terms and conditions. Some useful background information here:

Flybe expands white-label operations after Swedish strikes | MRO Network
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Old 18th Mar 2016, 16:22
  #49 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: On the road
Posts: 159
I like that Flybe uses a term - white label- that comes from the underground rave/house record music scene of the 1980s and 90s. How down with the kids are they
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Old 18th Mar 2016, 20:57
  #50 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sweden
Age: 43
Posts: 2
Originally Posted by six-sixty View Post
Its a completely separate setup, the flight crew are all employed through a contract agency. Interestingly they have just fought for and won some better terms and conditions. Some useful background information here:

Flybe expands white-label operations after Swedish strikes | MRO Network
No much info to be found about GEC I'm afraid. Does anyone know if they use other bases than ARN? Saw them at TRD the other day and figured they might have opened up at Gardemoen... wishful thinking I guess!
The new terms, details anyone?
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Old 20th Mar 2016, 23:47
  #51 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: SE England
Posts: 35
It's a good airline for your first job, but that's about it. The recruitment was a bit of a mess. We all received the "Dear xxx, There are no jobs at present", 2 days before being called for interview!

The rosters are very tiring but I was always impressed with the safety culture. As for base moves, promotion etc.... This was controlled way too tightly by HR with little policing and consequently people moved out of seniority. If you complained, you were told to wind your neck in. Be careful of getting stuck on the Dash as you enter your 30's. Flybe are aware that the prospect of a Jet job diminishes from this point onward and you suddenly feel you are being left out to pasture, as those around you move onto Jets. A friend of mine was told his D8 command would have to be back at the base he spent 18 months getting away from, despite vacancies existing in his current base. When he complained and threatened to leave, the response from HR was "and where do you think you will go??".

Needless to say there was a mass exodus in the early 2000's and we all moved to Jet operators. If they offered a more stable lifestyle and better roster stability but kept the same salaries, then for some it would become a career airline. Alas, they were never that sharp, so a constant revolving door of pilots adds to training and recruitment costs, which eats away at the bottom line. Cest la vie.
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Old 21st Mar 2016, 08:07
  #52 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 670
Former Flybe Dash 8 driver here. First jet job at 33, now flying for the UK's flag carrier. Take the above with a pinch of salt.
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Old 21st Mar 2016, 13:35
  #53 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: FL380
Posts: 33
RexBanner I wouldn't disregard matxpenetrations post I would simply say it was most likely an earlier time. The current wave of UK experienced pilot recruitment will not last forever and while Flybe is by no means a terrible place to be, my advice would be to get out now while the going is good. Mass exodus has been ongoing for over a year and still no improvements in T&Cs. Below average pay for above average workload.

Recruitment is completely pot luck anyway.
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Old 23rd Mar 2016, 14:54
  #54 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Laos,Kenya,Czech republic,IOM , Eire , France,CAR,Libya...etc..
Age: 45
Posts: 283
Hi ,
Just wondering if anyone has gone through the CTC selection for DEC D8Q400 on the 17th and would like to confirm that it's the usual assessment day that CTC runs for other applicants ? Cheers ,
perceval is offline  
Old 26th Mar 2016, 03:37
  #55 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Leeds
Posts: 167
Can someone explain what the night stops are at BHX?

Is it 1 night after a few sectors or is it positioning down route for 5 days at a time ??

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Old 26th Mar 2016, 08:36
  #56 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 95
This could be out of date now, but previously it was 2/3 nights in the IOM, a Düsseldorf split duty, and the Brussels contract which is a mix of positioning or flying yourself out, then 4/5 day trips.

Then honestly, unless it's changed, which I hear it hasn't, it was anywhere crewing decided to send you that day, (any base on the network) sometimes position, sometimes a taxi, sometimes a hire car, 1/2 nights out of base.

I always found it was best to just regard all days in work as days away from home, regardless of what your roster initially said, then you couldn't be dissappointed. Works for some, not so much for others.
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Old 26th Mar 2016, 09:47
  #57 (permalink)  
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Europe
Posts: 198

Sounds bad. Maybe not at the beginning of a career but certainly when in the LHS and doing the job a while already. Just resigned from an outfit that just did the same - 14-17 days/month not at home at all.

With age you start to appreciate sleeping in your own bed ^^.
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Old 26th Mar 2016, 12:41
  #58 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Uncertain
Posts: 96
RHS - I think it's very very much the same now too. Despite getting some local crews in for BRU, a lot of time is spent out there on split duties still!
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Old 27th Mar 2016, 01:39
  #59 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 317
My view

Having spent 8 years at Flybe and now moved on to a bigger jet operator my take is:

Fantastic training, superb culture, great camaraderie, lovely small and friendly bases. The Dash 8 is noisy, unreliable but fun to fly and a great first airliner type. The Embraer is simply the finest aircraft I have ever flown and way better than the B737-800 and A320 operated by rival airlines. When you think the A320 first flew around 1988 and the Embraer around 2004 it's like comparing one of those yuppie brick phones to an iphone 6!!

On the downside though the workload is punishing - you'll get 9 days off a month and do mostly 4 sector days. This compares with around 12-14 days off at my current operator and mostly 2 or 3 sector days. Factor in the fact that as a new joiner I now earn around 200% of a Q400 FO salary or 150% of an E-jet FO salary and get 3-5 more days off a month and you can see why people are leaving in droves.

I had a great time at Flybe, I owe them a lot - indeed if the e-jet future had been more certain at the time I might have stayed long term but the overriding issue for me was their poor attitude to the plight of staff. If you work your staff harder and pay them less and don't listen when they complain about appalling crew food, poor rosters, low salaries etc then they will leave. Many people would stay even with the lower than market rate salaries if the lifestyle compensated for it, but sadly it doesn't.

Those of us that have moved on still look back with fondness for the camaraderie, the people and the friendliness of the place. In truth you probably can't better it anywhere in England and I truly truly miss that element and in weaker moments sometimes wonder if I really did the right thing. Then I pick up my pay slip at the new outfit, glance at my comfortable credit balance and know why I left...
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Old 27th Mar 2016, 04:04
  #60 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 316
Desk Pilot. What I would have said pretty much. The company I knew has gone. It was a decent ish lifestyle when I was there and certainly the Embraer whilst poor pay for a jet, wasn't that bad when the local lifestyle was as it was. The monthly hours on the Embryo ex Belfast were about 40 in low months to 75, max 82 in the high and an annual of average of 550-600. Then the barman called in the bar tab and the party ended. Now it's a different period so my info is out of date. I hear from friends it is hard work with 900 and the minimum 9 days off.

Ethos back then made it one of the most friendly places I've worked. Like a big family. I think former flybees still consider themselves a wider family. I loved it. I wasn't someone that chose to leave, more circumstances of the time prevailed me into the situation. Although from what I hear the workload is now, I feel that I wouldn't have stayed to be in that same old lifestyle for very long. My memories are primarily from the Embraer which I loved. Fantastic training environment on the Embraer and supporting operation. I wasn't mad on the dash side of things and wouldn't feel mega keen to rush back to that, but that's me.

Duty days were not that long to be honest back then. No jet lag, 1 hour long mini flights to easy enough airports, 7-8 hours duty maybe. Not the mammoth deep night duties you get in Charter or LH. People moaned about disruption when they were changed from an early to a late, but during that pre redundancy period they had nothing to compare it with. I only realised what proper disruption or a long duty was was until I went LH cargoeing, then disruption becomes measured in days, sometimes weeks late coming home.

I would add to Rex that I think the current upswing is responsible for the industry postponing it's predjucide on turboprop time and only temporary. I don't think the upswing will last much longer personally. Bare in mind the terrible lack of UK opportunities in 2012-13 for those facing the push.

As said, it's changed now, so the company I remember most likely doesn't exist in the form/lifestyle I knew it, but hopefully some of the good stuff remains.

Last edited by Wireless; 27th Mar 2016 at 04:42.
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