Air2000 BALLOT - can we trust management today?
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Air2000 BALLOT - can we trust management today?
The company's proposal;
2.5% pay rise, not the 3.5% they insisted on pushing through last year.
A salary review next April, not the 18 month pay freeze they initially wanted.
Work to a far inferior scheduling agreement now, and negotiate for a new agreement, "with a view to agreeing" this by the end of the summer season. (Doesn't this sound like stalling for time until the summer season is over and the management take the advantage once again?)
I do not trust our management to come up with a suitable solution at the beginning of our next winter season.
We should make a stand now whilst the "BUSY" summer season is ahead of us and on our side.
If we don't make a stand now, we'll lose the advantage, and our career prospects will be affected for the rest of ours days.
Look forward to temporary contracts for our First Officers, temporary Captains, early starts after days off, 'Block Window Protection'. "What the h*ll is a 'Block Window Protection'?" I hear next year's new starters saying.
A 'work -to-rule' now will put the fear of god into the board at FC House. Any risk of the media publishing 'Industrial Action within Air2000' and the bookings won't recover this season.
All I am asking for is fair treatment.
Stop the practice of temporary positions, as per Peter Long's statement: "It doesn't work" - this will go some way in keeping the middle and junior piots on side simply by giving them a career path forward.
Honour the pay award agreed of 3.5%. If the managemnet cannot keep their word, what trust can they expect in the future?
As a result of bad management we find ourselves short of crew! One too many knee jerk reactions has put us in this position. Due to this we are unable to operate the summer program under the "Old Scheduling Agreement". - Should we not be insisting on a signed agreement NOW for the "Old Scheduling Agreement" to be made contractual in Nov 2002.
The Board should stop thinking of us as a bunch of "over paid London cabbies or bus drivers", who don't (quote)"have the balls to do anything". It is insulting and embarrassing; insulting to our profession and embarrassing to all of us who have "Directors" on the Board who seem to be wollowing in jealousy. GROW UP!
2.5% pay rise, not the 3.5% they insisted on pushing through last year.
A salary review next April, not the 18 month pay freeze they initially wanted.
Work to a far inferior scheduling agreement now, and negotiate for a new agreement, "with a view to agreeing" this by the end of the summer season. (Doesn't this sound like stalling for time until the summer season is over and the management take the advantage once again?)
I do not trust our management to come up with a suitable solution at the beginning of our next winter season.
We should make a stand now whilst the "BUSY" summer season is ahead of us and on our side.
If we don't make a stand now, we'll lose the advantage, and our career prospects will be affected for the rest of ours days.
Look forward to temporary contracts for our First Officers, temporary Captains, early starts after days off, 'Block Window Protection'. "What the h*ll is a 'Block Window Protection'?" I hear next year's new starters saying.
A 'work -to-rule' now will put the fear of god into the board at FC House. Any risk of the media publishing 'Industrial Action within Air2000' and the bookings won't recover this season.
All I am asking for is fair treatment.
Stop the practice of temporary positions, as per Peter Long's statement: "It doesn't work" - this will go some way in keeping the middle and junior piots on side simply by giving them a career path forward.
Honour the pay award agreed of 3.5%. If the managemnet cannot keep their word, what trust can they expect in the future?
As a result of bad management we find ourselves short of crew! One too many knee jerk reactions has put us in this position. Due to this we are unable to operate the summer program under the "Old Scheduling Agreement". - Should we not be insisting on a signed agreement NOW for the "Old Scheduling Agreement" to be made contractual in Nov 2002.
The Board should stop thinking of us as a bunch of "over paid London cabbies or bus drivers", who don't (quote)"have the balls to do anything". It is insulting and embarrassing; insulting to our profession and embarrassing to all of us who have "Directors" on the Board who seem to be wollowing in jealousy. GROW UP!
JB1.
As the Air 2000 moderator I am dissapointed that you feel the need to place your views on this public forum, when as you are well aware there are four pages of posts and a poll centred on the very topic that you discuss currently attracting active debate on the company's forum. Also of course you may have access to the BALPA forum to state your case.
Since most people reading this will have little if any understanding of the issues surrounding the company's current negotiations, and may well misinterpret your post to the detriment of both the union and the company, may I ask you to think twice and consider whether this is really the appropriate forum to vent your frustration on.
Please mail or phone me if you wish to discuss the matter.
[email protected]
As the Air 2000 moderator I am dissapointed that you feel the need to place your views on this public forum, when as you are well aware there are four pages of posts and a poll centred on the very topic that you discuss currently attracting active debate on the company's forum. Also of course you may have access to the BALPA forum to state your case.
Since most people reading this will have little if any understanding of the issues surrounding the company's current negotiations, and may well misinterpret your post to the detriment of both the union and the company, may I ask you to think twice and consider whether this is really the appropriate forum to vent your frustration on.
Please mail or phone me if you wish to discuss the matter.
[email protected]
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Exactly. I've heard that aircrew were laid off, along with others, in order to manipulate share prices for various means. Hiding that sort of behaviour in private sites hardly encourages those on the outside, of which I am one. And having seen a couple of good mates summarily dismissed by this particular organisation I have no intention of even applying. Most military mates I know would agree, and those within are looking elsewhere. Standard apologies apply: if you are out of a job, I understand. If you need a job: I've been there too, good luck.
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If you have a short term tactical advantage over management this summer then use it! The chances of any union successfully negotiating from a position of weakness next winter are poor in my opinion.
Good Luck BP
Good Luck BP
Keeping Danny in Sandwiches
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Boeing boy,
To quote a Britannia manager (formerly on the CC) "daylight is an excellent disinfectant".
Far from being the wrong place to discuss this, air the grievance that what PPRuNe is for.
To quote a Britannia manager (formerly on the CC) "daylight is an excellent disinfectant".
Far from being the wrong place to discuss this, air the grievance that what PPRuNe is for.
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Monty77
Speaking as an active member of the Air 2000 forum, I don't recall seeing your username within it. Which means that you are probably not an Air 2000 employee.
BoeingBoy, whom you seem to think is running an active campaign to stifle debate is actually very active in promoting the very same within our forum, acting equally to allow criticism or praise of both company or union alike, and without predjudice.
So Monty, if you'll pardon us, we'll keep our problems within closed doors so that those of us who know what we're talking about can discuss it free from the neanderthal level of conversation that you seem to want to relate to.
Speaking as an active member of the Air 2000 forum, I don't recall seeing your username within it. Which means that you are probably not an Air 2000 employee.
BoeingBoy, whom you seem to think is running an active campaign to stifle debate is actually very active in promoting the very same within our forum, acting equally to allow criticism or praise of both company or union alike, and without predjudice.
So Monty, if you'll pardon us, we'll keep our problems within closed doors so that those of us who know what we're talking about can discuss it free from the neanderthal level of conversation that you seem to want to relate to.
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Ella
This is a public pilot rumour site, in a section dealing with pay and conditions, on which JB1 chose to discuss your company. Are you saying that anybody not employed by Air2000 knows nothing about the company and therefore has no right to contribute? I hope not, because you may as well shut down Terms and Endearment and keep the private airline forums.
It does indeed seem to me that Boeing boy is uncomfortable with critical Air2000 posts on this forum. Where there is factual error then by all means moderate, but he should be very active in promoting debate here as well as on your private forum.
You admit your company has problems and I have discussed them at length with friends who were 'let go'. I am in the military and on that forum we are not allowed the luxury of the privacy you enjoy, for some reason. So, no. I will not pardon you to keep your problems within closed doors, I will not pardon the 'you're not in the company so you obviously know nothing attitude' and I will not dignify the playground jibe with a response.
This is a public pilot rumour site, in a section dealing with pay and conditions, on which JB1 chose to discuss your company. Are you saying that anybody not employed by Air2000 knows nothing about the company and therefore has no right to contribute? I hope not, because you may as well shut down Terms and Endearment and keep the private airline forums.
It does indeed seem to me that Boeing boy is uncomfortable with critical Air2000 posts on this forum. Where there is factual error then by all means moderate, but he should be very active in promoting debate here as well as on your private forum.
You admit your company has problems and I have discussed them at length with friends who were 'let go'. I am in the military and on that forum we are not allowed the luxury of the privacy you enjoy, for some reason. So, no. I will not pardon you to keep your problems within closed doors, I will not pardon the 'you're not in the company so you obviously know nothing attitude' and I will not dignify the playground jibe with a response.
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Whooa>>>>BoeingBoy - Ella,
I feel very strongly that once you start to hide things behind 'Closed doors' it is a very slippery slope and some people may try to hide things that would be challanged in the 'open air'.
I am distant from your comany & beleive that I have no bias here [but I am open to anyones point of view] someday I hope to hold a ticket for the "Front-end Seats" and what I experiance now will play a part in my opinions later [why condem the NewComer to make the same mistakes as my forbears] help others to understand how things come together, otherwise I could find myself paying 'through the nose' for a crop spraying seat and thinking that I have done well ??
Yea, i need help !!!!
I feel very strongly that once you start to hide things behind 'Closed doors' it is a very slippery slope and some people may try to hide things that would be challanged in the 'open air'.
I am distant from your comany & beleive that I have no bias here [but I am open to anyones point of view] someday I hope to hold a ticket for the "Front-end Seats" and what I experiance now will play a part in my opinions later [why condem the NewComer to make the same mistakes as my forbears] help others to understand how things come together, otherwise I could find myself paying 'through the nose' for a crop spraying seat and thinking that I have done well ??
Yea, i need help !!!!
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Although there are times when such "dirty linen" should be kept in the closet, in this case the decision has been made to air it in public. After all, when times get better Air 2 bob will be looking for pilots and it is important that applicants are fully informed as to the type of management running the company that they are applying to. It is also possible that the management concerned will read this thread and, maybe, reconsider their attitude!
I have recently lost my job as a result of a very underhand management trick and I shall be posting details of this on PPRuNe for the same reason (with the appropriate moderator's approval) at the right time.
Wishing all the best to all those pilots in Air 2 bob
I have recently lost my job as a result of a very underhand management trick and I shall be posting details of this on PPRuNe for the same reason (with the appropriate moderator's approval) at the right time.
Wishing all the best to all those pilots in Air 2 bob
