Demotion Policy
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Demotion Policy
I hear TCX are about to re write their demotion policy.
What is your airline's demotion policy? Global or regional LIFO? Ability driven? Assessment? Interview?
Good luck to all at TCX
What is your airline's demotion policy? Global or regional LIFO? Ability driven? Assessment? Interview?
Good luck to all at TCX
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Thomson Airways - Last in first out/Last promoted first demoted.
Captains hold a captains 'shadow' so when promotion start agian they are first back in regardless of senority.
That said we havn't demoted in a long time and in fact we carry did carry a 55 capt surpus as part of recent redundancy terms.
Captains hold a captains 'shadow' so when promotion start agian they are first back in regardless of senority.
That said we havn't demoted in a long time and in fact we carry did carry a 55 capt surpus as part of recent redundancy terms.
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Different country, so different working law. Redundancies have to be done on both sides. Both captains and first officers have to take their share, generally last in/upgraded first out, however additional things that have to be taken into account, for example age (yes, that is required by law), kids and non-working spouses/ex-spouses and any offically recognized disabilities (those are kinda rare for pilots).
As a result it is often a good idea to think twice if uprades are offered when the company is in a difficult situation, as one is the first to get fired as a freshly upgrades captain, but the last one as the highest FO on the list.
As a result it is often a good idea to think twice if uprades are offered when the company is in a difficult situation, as one is the first to get fired as a freshly upgrades captain, but the last one as the highest FO on the list.
In seniority, both for demotions and any subsequnet reinstatement.
Which raises an interesting point - my last company downgraded many captains after 9/11. When things picked up again, new captains were being trained before some of the reinstatements. This is because some of the demotees had been originally promoted out of seniority as they had the minimum required hours, wheras many more senior pilots didn't.
Which raises an interesting point - my last company downgraded many captains after 9/11. When things picked up again, new captains were being trained before some of the reinstatements. This is because some of the demotees had been originally promoted out of seniority as they had the minimum required hours, wheras many more senior pilots didn't.
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DENTI makes a very interesting point about the timing of your upgrade and and the state of your airline.
Had I got a command in the last year or so I would be in a far worse position than staying as an FO in my longterm base and near the top of the seniority list. Whilst I have missed out on the Command time, I would not have enough to get me a job as a DEC, I would probably be force moved out of base and take a 30k paycut. Not attractive.
We have a policy based on Last Promoted, first demoted, but it will be adjusted for sex equality issues. Some will also elect to stay in base and voluntarily demote, rather than be re-based.
Had I got a command in the last year or so I would be in a far worse position than staying as an FO in my longterm base and near the top of the seniority list. Whilst I have missed out on the Command time, I would not have enough to get me a job as a DEC, I would probably be force moved out of base and take a 30k paycut. Not attractive.
We have a policy based on Last Promoted, first demoted, but it will be adjusted for sex equality issues. Some will also elect to stay in base and voluntarily demote, rather than be re-based.
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however additional things that have to be taken into account, for example age (yes, that is required by law), kids and non-working spouses/ex-spouses and any offically recognized disabilities
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Due to my seniority as a Captain I was in line for demotion in VS after 9/11 ..
To me it was perfectly reasonable to demote the last 80 Captains promoted (despite it being very costly as it was not fleet dependant .. i.e B747 Classic Captains being type rated as a 340 Captain and 340 Captains being demoted). It was fair.
Two things pushed me towards taking my redundancy 1/ When I would have been re promoted I would have lost my 4 year Captain's increments I had already earned and 2/ F/O's who were senior to me in the Company (i.e. been there longer than I) would get promoted to Captain before I was re promoted to my original position.
These 2 company positions ensured I exercised my only democratic option ... and that was to leave ..
To me it was perfectly reasonable to demote the last 80 Captains promoted (despite it being very costly as it was not fleet dependant .. i.e B747 Classic Captains being type rated as a 340 Captain and 340 Captains being demoted). It was fair.
Two things pushed me towards taking my redundancy 1/ When I would have been re promoted I would have lost my 4 year Captain's increments I had already earned and 2/ F/O's who were senior to me in the Company (i.e. been there longer than I) would get promoted to Captain before I was re promoted to my original position.
These 2 company positions ensured I exercised my only democratic option ... and that was to leave ..
Last edited by Iron Duke; 10th Feb 2013 at 15:56.
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Gets complex. Easy bit is 'Last in, first out'. I joined a fast expanding company. Three years as a FO I was promoted. However, ahead of me were DEC's with less Company Service (one year). Redundancy hit us as the company downsized. I faced going back to RHS after 4 years company service but the DEC with only one year held his LHS. Actually, while I hated him , he saved me by leaving, not before the house went up for sale, kids were briefed on the State school system & one of the two cars went on the market! Ouch. Painful memories !
LF, I might have been in the same company. Identical scenario befell me. Unpleasant though it is, care must be taken not too involve a company's seniority system with lifestyle choices. My employer went from three aircraft to six in a short time span. I got a quick LHS out of it. The owner then decided to sell three aircraft & we were back at three. Last in, first out and last promoted, first demoted applied. Really, the company was simply turning back the clock. Some DEC's were saved & I faced RHS but the Seniority list looked the same as where we were three years back. I too faced having to turn back the clock in my personal lifestyle choices but was saved by more senior guys leaving. It is, kinda, the same, wherever you go and in most industries. Not for Doctors & Lawyers but don't get me started on that !
