Middle East and commuting.
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Middle East and commuting.
The present situation for european pilots pretty much dictate that new jobs have to be found outside our hometurf. One of the closest place to home is The Middle East companies who are expanding and taking in pilots. Some of us are so "unfortunate" to have a house, a family and friends that also requires our attention. If you want to commute to your home the options seems extremely limited.
Are there actually any companies offering commuting jobs in The Middle East? Do you believe the situation will change due to the high demand for pilots?
Let me hear your opinions ;-)
Are there actually any companies offering commuting jobs in The Middle East? Do you believe the situation will change due to the high demand for pilots?
Let me hear your opinions ;-)
At this stage none of the "Major" ME companies offer commuting contracts and actively discourage you from living anywhere but where they are based.
At this stage, this is not limiting their expansion for want of applicants.
Unless this changes, either take the plunge and come out,look elsewhere, stay where you are, or understand the opportunities to see your family will be limited.
At this stage, this is not limiting their expansion for want of applicants.
Unless this changes, either take the plunge and come out,look elsewhere, stay where you are, or understand the opportunities to see your family will be limited.
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Commuting to the Middle East is feasible, as long as you're on a long haul aircraft, like 777 for QA. Quite a few do it, and are happy doing it.
Come check it out and you ll see 90% of the ME threads are BS, and this place is not so bad at all. It's what you make of it, and the possibilities (for travel, career, relaxing,...) are endless compared to Europe and certainly the UK.
By experience, you will see (If you haven't seen it already) how limiting your world is if living in the same place your whole life. Be expat for 5 years and you ll realize all your friends are still there when you go back, live in the same place, go to the same bars and restaurants, and have the same jobs.
You, on the other hand, will return home with a pocket full of money and loads of nice (and bad) experiences and new friends.
You're right about one thing though, Europe and the US are not attractive at all anymore, even the major airlines are cutting new joiner packages in half. Middle East and Far East seem like the only option for the next 10 to 20 years.
Remember, human beings will always complain, it's in their nature. So you can get depressed and read/believe all the crap ME stories, or go for the experience. It worked for me, my first job was cleaning aircraft for 800 euro gross a month, now I fly a 777 all over the world for 10 times the salary.
Come check it out and you ll see 90% of the ME threads are BS, and this place is not so bad at all. It's what you make of it, and the possibilities (for travel, career, relaxing,...) are endless compared to Europe and certainly the UK.
By experience, you will see (If you haven't seen it already) how limiting your world is if living in the same place your whole life. Be expat for 5 years and you ll realize all your friends are still there when you go back, live in the same place, go to the same bars and restaurants, and have the same jobs.
You, on the other hand, will return home with a pocket full of money and loads of nice (and bad) experiences and new friends.
You're right about one thing though, Europe and the US are not attractive at all anymore, even the major airlines are cutting new joiner packages in half. Middle East and Far East seem like the only option for the next 10 to 20 years.
Remember, human beings will always complain, it's in their nature. So you can get depressed and read/believe all the crap ME stories, or go for the experience. It worked for me, my first job was cleaning aircraft for 800 euro gross a month, now I fly a 777 all over the world for 10 times the salary.
NC,
What exactlley is possible at QR WRT commuting? Could you give an informed insight into the number of consequtive days off one could expect in a month?
What exactlley is possible at QR WRT commuting? Could you give an informed insight into the number of consequtive days off one could expect in a month?
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Happens quite frequently. You can bid for destinations or for consecutive days off. 4 to 5 is easy at least once a month, 6 to 7 is no exception, though not too often.
Depends on the destinations you get really. Fly 4 long hauls and you ll have 15 days off a month.
However, don't come here with a commuting mindset, come here to relocate, and it will be a bonus whenever you can get home.
(quite honestly I don't even bother, too much fun around here. Loads of different areas and countries to explore)
Easy for Europeans, Americans and South-Americans are less lucky. For us, all it takes is a 5 hour flight in business/first with a one hour zone difference, and you are home.
As a general rule, they DO start to care for their people. I had about 4 requests since I joined about a year ago, and all were granted. Believe me, they wouldn't have been granted in Europe.
Depends on the destinations you get really. Fly 4 long hauls and you ll have 15 days off a month.
However, don't come here with a commuting mindset, come here to relocate, and it will be a bonus whenever you can get home.
(quite honestly I don't even bother, too much fun around here. Loads of different areas and countries to explore)
Easy for Europeans, Americans and South-Americans are less lucky. For us, all it takes is a 5 hour flight in business/first with a one hour zone difference, and you are home.
As a general rule, they DO start to care for their people. I had about 4 requests since I joined about a year ago, and all were granted. Believe me, they wouldn't have been granted in Europe.
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One of the most sweeping statements ever made on pprune!
Although I am sure the poster can account for every airline in Europe. After all, the mentality in the middle east is known by everyone to be much more accommodating than in Europe!
Head in the sand (quite literally!)
Although I am sure the poster can account for every airline in Europe. After all, the mentality in the middle east is known by everyone to be much more accommodating than in Europe!
Head in the sand (quite literally!)
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Thanks guys. FYI I am an experienced FO and have been expat for several years. I agree with NC, when abroad be sure to view the world with open eyes and enjoy the adventures available. You also realize the best place in the world is - home..
This does definitely not mean I want to be home all the time, but to plan to commute in an environment, that is not geared towards commuting while bonding yourself for a very long time seems - well - a little risky..
From other sources it seems like especially QR is accepting and to a certain degree accomodating commuting pilots. Would like to hear more about your experiences.
This does definitely not mean I want to be home all the time, but to plan to commute in an environment, that is not geared towards commuting while bonding yourself for a very long time seems - well - a little risky..
From other sources it seems like especially QR is accepting and to a certain degree accomodating commuting pilots. Would like to hear more about your experiences.
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Thanks for your kind words Full left rudder.
I expected the insults would come quite quickly. Ironic enough it came from a British gentleman. Enjoy your next airport hotel, I hear the happy hour is excellent and cheap! No need to go check out the outdoors! Expat life is not for every one...
I do not pretend I can account for every airline in Europe, but after 10 humble years in the European region I do have some comparison.
As for the middle eastern mentality, that is exactly what is changing. They do realize that if they wanna become a major player, they have to start thinking otherwise, they have to start treating their people better.
Open up for the world you don't know, in stead of reading from forums, and you might be pleasantly surprised. Anyways, you are not the one that needs convincing, enjoy Europe and it's blooming aviation industry.
(Before this turns into a racist post, I do quite like the British, too bad the occasional one has very limited views. But who am I, my head has been in the sand for too long)
I expected the insults would come quite quickly. Ironic enough it came from a British gentleman. Enjoy your next airport hotel, I hear the happy hour is excellent and cheap! No need to go check out the outdoors! Expat life is not for every one...
I do not pretend I can account for every airline in Europe, but after 10 humble years in the European region I do have some comparison.
As for the middle eastern mentality, that is exactly what is changing. They do realize that if they wanna become a major player, they have to start thinking otherwise, they have to start treating their people better.
Open up for the world you don't know, in stead of reading from forums, and you might be pleasantly surprised. Anyways, you are not the one that needs convincing, enjoy Europe and it's blooming aviation industry.
(Before this turns into a racist post, I do quite like the British, too bad the occasional one has very limited views. But who am I, my head has been in the sand for too long)
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Just a word of warning, at QR nothing is a given - you can bid for days off and it isn't un-heard of to get 6 or 8 days off (some guys I know are getting them but it has taken 3 months of bidding for it to finally get it) in a row BUT you are purely in the hands of the rostering gods, the rosters here even though you bid for blocks of days off might come back with 3 days 3stbys and 2 days tagged on the end, which, if your trying to get back to somewhere in the region of 6 hour flight times won't work.
It is fleet dependant it seems too, the 777 fleet seems to be the one where its most achievable, 330 and 320 are under crewed especially for FO's!
At the end of the day, what you sign up for certainly isn't a 'commuting contract'.
It is fleet dependant it seems too, the 777 fleet seems to be the one where its most achievable, 330 and 320 are under crewed especially for FO's!
At the end of the day, what you sign up for certainly isn't a 'commuting contract'.
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Ninja chauffeur . . .
Commuting to the Middle East is feasible, as long as you're on a long haul aircraft, like 777 for QA.
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Yes indeed, that's exactly what I want to do. Brag about myself, that's why I use an alias and try to answer this post. Jezus.
Look dude, all I want to do is be objective and answer the man's question. I don't care about what I am about, I don't care what you think about me.
I had the ****tiest jobs in the world just to pay my rent, you really think I'm a bragging jock? The bigger the aircraft, the easier to fly. You really think I'm proud of flying a 777? Try flying a King air without duty time regulations, making flightplans, manual W&B, slot requests, overflight and landing permits, cleaning cabins, making coffee, carry pax bags, etc... Did that too, it doesn't even compare. You can teach a monkey how to fly a 777.
I do fly all over the world, I do get those days off, maybe I'm lucky, I don't even bid for anything, because I'm happy with whatever, I don't want/need to commute, and as for pay, it's only 7000 euro per month due to the high dollar (but I expect that will change in the future). It's more than 10 times what I used to earn for a much ****tier job, in Europe. Not bad for an FO, according to my standards. You won't find any contract like that in my country, not even as a Cpt.
Sometimes I wonder why I even try to help someone answering his question, only to have to deal with subjective ladies like you.
The cpt I flew with today did a bid for 3 Bangkok's last month, received 3, and spent about 16 days home, in Europe!
Enough spit , thx for discouraging me to visit this website again.
@Sevenfive: don't let those posts put you off, my advice, go find out for yourself. Humans will always complain anyways.
Look dude, all I want to do is be objective and answer the man's question. I don't care about what I am about, I don't care what you think about me.
I had the ****tiest jobs in the world just to pay my rent, you really think I'm a bragging jock? The bigger the aircraft, the easier to fly. You really think I'm proud of flying a 777? Try flying a King air without duty time regulations, making flightplans, manual W&B, slot requests, overflight and landing permits, cleaning cabins, making coffee, carry pax bags, etc... Did that too, it doesn't even compare. You can teach a monkey how to fly a 777.
I do fly all over the world, I do get those days off, maybe I'm lucky, I don't even bid for anything, because I'm happy with whatever, I don't want/need to commute, and as for pay, it's only 7000 euro per month due to the high dollar (but I expect that will change in the future). It's more than 10 times what I used to earn for a much ****tier job, in Europe. Not bad for an FO, according to my standards. You won't find any contract like that in my country, not even as a Cpt.
Sometimes I wonder why I even try to help someone answering his question, only to have to deal with subjective ladies like you.
The cpt I flew with today did a bid for 3 Bangkok's last month, received 3, and spent about 16 days home, in Europe!
Enough spit , thx for discouraging me to visit this website again.
@Sevenfive: don't let those posts put you off, my advice, go find out for yourself. Humans will always complain anyways.
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I have the same impression... Rumour says there has been talks about commuting contracts in QR - but nothing came out of it. Is it a dead horse or should we just be patient?
There is no doubt pilots would be flooding to the sandpit if this came true...
@Ninja Chauffeur: Keep em coming and dont give up when little noise pops up.. There are readers appreciating you inputs
There is no doubt pilots would be flooding to the sandpit if this came true...
@Ninja Chauffeur: Keep em coming and dont give up when little noise pops up.. There are readers appreciating you inputs
Last edited by sevenfive; 26th Oct 2011 at 10:33.
