Summer only Commands!
Whatever happens,.. happens!
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: 19' N, 82' W
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Looker;
I agree with your comment re the RHS check in the SIM not being adequate prep for full time right seat work, result; the Captain in the RHS is working his/her backside off to stay with the program.
that being said, I am convinced it is still a safer combination (when the going gets tough) to have two captains working together compared to working with a brand new F/O.
fluf
I agree with your comment re the RHS check in the SIM not being adequate prep for full time right seat work, result; the Captain in the RHS is working his/her backside off to stay with the program.
that being said, I am convinced it is still a safer combination (when the going gets tough) to have two captains working together compared to working with a brand new F/O.
fluf
Join Date: Feb 1999
Location: UK
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You must be referring to Jet2, who are planning this. Other things they are planning are summer only F/Os (who will still have to pay for their TRs). In this way, no more contract captains will be needed. What are the odds on forced unpaid leave in winter 2009?
This is the airline where it is OK for us to be charged to phone into the silly check-in line so they can run roughshod over FTLs?
This is what it means to have no Union representation. Now in the downturn, we might as well drop our pants and hand the soap over...
This is the airline where it is OK for us to be charged to phone into the silly check-in line so they can run roughshod over FTLs?
This is what it means to have no Union representation. Now in the downturn, we might as well drop our pants and hand the soap over...
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: AEP
Age: 80
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What's the matter with you pilots...?
Are you too "superior" with 4 stripes to sit in the RHS, provided you qualified to occupy the RHS...?
Most of the F/Os I fly with, are fully qualified/current captains.
Which seat we occupy is never an issue.
We have the courtesy of "flipping the coin" to decide who is LHS going out, and RHS coming back.
In a 747 Classic... I even qualified myself as F/E and have flown as such. I am current all 3 seats.
Yes... three captains on some flights, with total of 50,000 hrs experience on the flight deck.
The issue is qualifications/currency, and your paycheck is a contract or union problem.
For me, the PF occupies the LHS, the PNF occupies the RHS.
And I ask sometimes to hand fly an approach and land from the RHS...
Never had an incident involving "who is in what seat".
Don't you have seasonal reductions of crews, either...?
Seems you give yourselves a lot of headaches.
xxx
Happy contrails
Most of the F/Os I fly with, are fully qualified/current captains.
Which seat we occupy is never an issue.
We have the courtesy of "flipping the coin" to decide who is LHS going out, and RHS coming back.
In a 747 Classic... I even qualified myself as F/E and have flown as such. I am current all 3 seats.
Yes... three captains on some flights, with total of 50,000 hrs experience on the flight deck.
The issue is qualifications/currency, and your paycheck is a contract or union problem.
For me, the PF occupies the LHS, the PNF occupies the RHS.
And I ask sometimes to hand fly an approach and land from the RHS...
Never had an incident involving "who is in what seat".
Don't you have seasonal reductions of crews, either...?
Seems you give yourselves a lot of headaches.
xxx
Happy contrails
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: AEP
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PIC...
It is not only JAR, and EU-OPS requiring only one commander.
All airlines and aviation administrations have that one requirement.
It is just a matter to fill in the papers before departure, on flight documents.
Spells PIC on paperwork. He/she is in command. Simple as that.
xxx
Happy contrails
All airlines and aviation administrations have that one requirement.
It is just a matter to fill in the papers before departure, on flight documents.
Spells PIC on paperwork. He/she is in command. Simple as that.
xxx
Happy contrails
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: here and everywhere
Age: 50
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I'm not saying there will be 2 PIC's!
Come on, this is obvious, all I'm saying that being a commander, decicion making mechanism works like second nature!
Having two decicion makers in the cockpit creates potential clushes in case something goes wrong!
It's easy to wear the hat of the PIC when seating on LHS and the PNF hat when on the RHS in a normal flght but when the sXXt hits the fan I'm really not sure how somebody would react!
I personally have my doubts about this!
Again I admit the necessity of this arrangement in certain occasions but not the implementation of such a practice to address seasonality issues!
Come on, this is obvious, all I'm saying that being a commander, decicion making mechanism works like second nature!
Having two decicion makers in the cockpit creates potential clushes in case something goes wrong!
It's easy to wear the hat of the PIC when seating on LHS and the PNF hat when on the RHS in a normal flght but when the sXXt hits the fan I'm really not sure how somebody would react!
I personally have my doubts about this!
Again I admit the necessity of this arrangement in certain occasions but not the implementation of such a practice to address seasonality issues!
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: London
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What on earth is all the fuss about? - it's not as if it's a new idea. I believe many airlines in the UK have used it in the past - and in what way would the CAA object - one pilot is nominated as PIC, signs all the paperwork, the other is SIC and carries out the appropriate duties.
I would say go for it especially if it avoids having contract Captains for the summer - as for the "CRM" aspects, you are meant to be professional pilots for chrissake - perhaps being in the LHS for a summer will make you an even better co-pilot for the winter.
What's the difference between this and being taken over and being bumped down to the RHS as was the case with BA taking over BCAL or even within BA having turboprop Captains bidding into the RHS of the 744's. It meant frequently flying with a crew of 3 or even 4 Captains and I cannot recall ever having any "problems" on the Flight Deck. I can only think of one man who disliked not being a Captain that at the first opportunity bidded for turboprops in Scotland
Like I said before - go for it - any time in the LHS is better than none.
I would say go for it especially if it avoids having contract Captains for the summer - as for the "CRM" aspects, you are meant to be professional pilots for chrissake - perhaps being in the LHS for a summer will make you an even better co-pilot for the winter.
What's the difference between this and being taken over and being bumped down to the RHS as was the case with BA taking over BCAL or even within BA having turboprop Captains bidding into the RHS of the 744's. It meant frequently flying with a crew of 3 or even 4 Captains and I cannot recall ever having any "problems" on the Flight Deck. I can only think of one man who disliked not being a Captain that at the first opportunity bidded for turboprops in Scotland
Like I said before - go for it - any time in the LHS is better than none.
Join Date: Aug 2008
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So will any of those guys being offered summer commands be turning them down ? Thought not ... and as we all know life at this low cost operator is a veritable feast of changing opportunities. So the chances of the Summer command being permanent next winter ? probably pretty high given how much "other" flying has been sold for this winter.
So grab the command and then watch the picture and the shape of things to come, its not perfect on the face of it this option. However if it means no more expensive contractors limited to 75hours and perm captains rostered 90 hours sounds good, if it means some of the F/O's who are ready for command get their grubby mitts on the LHS it sounds good, if it means that we save a "boat load" of cash by not paying placemnt agency fees again sounds good. We all know those summer contracts will end up permanent in good time.. my advice grab with both hands and run with the ball.....just dont kick the ball into your own goal its never a good look !!!!!
So grab the command and then watch the picture and the shape of things to come, its not perfect on the face of it this option. However if it means no more expensive contractors limited to 75hours and perm captains rostered 90 hours sounds good, if it means some of the F/O's who are ready for command get their grubby mitts on the LHS it sounds good, if it means that we save a "boat load" of cash by not paying placemnt agency fees again sounds good. We all know those summer contracts will end up permanent in good time.. my advice grab with both hands and run with the ball.....just dont kick the ball into your own goal its never a good look !!!!!
