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Safety issues in UK locos

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Old 25th Feb 2008, 20:28
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Safety issues in UK locos

Met a couple of ex Easy and Ryan pilots now working in Asia...was curious why they had left as I have seen the salaries advertised. Seemed good money to me. They told me that there are lots of safety issues but declined to elaborate; maybe not to embarrass their 1st world compatriots to a 3rd world bloke. I find this interesting as I found 1st world blokes takes every chance to hit at 3rd world airlines and pilots; but now we have these fellas screaming to get into our poor 3rd world dowdy airlines!
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Old 25th Feb 2008, 21:39
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Correct me if I'm wrong but technically India is 1st World

In a nut Shell, along with USA, Australia, NZ, Singapore, France, Poland, Holland, (even Russia at the time) etc........ie anyone who was aligned with the "Allied Forces" during WW2.

2nd world was anyone allied with the "Axis Forces" during WW2 ie, Japan, Italy, etc.

All the rest were classed as 3rd World.

History lesson over!

BR.
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Old 25th Feb 2008, 22:02
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There are no "safety issues" at EZY. They are very, very cautious to deliver a "safe" product.
Otherwise the company could run downhill very fast!!!
What could be an issue, fatique! The job ainīt easy! Donīt feel it within 2-3 years, but after that time, lot guys are looking for part time.
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Old 25th Feb 2008, 22:39
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A.D.
Are you for real?

How many sectrors have been flown in day by FR and U2 together, how many HRS? How many pax?

Don't you think that if there were safety issues something would have happened?

Speevy
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Old 25th Feb 2008, 23:39
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Salaries good but taxes and living costs VERY high, hence money saving ability not good. Lots of short sectors and high hours in busy airspace, after fifth early in a row you will be very tired, getting up at 4.30am in the middle of winter not so great.

Low cost = low benefits. Crew meals, ID travel, insurance etc

Come to India, salary paid nett of tax, free luxury accommodation, low cost of living, ID travel, 10 weeks on 2 weeks off. Spend the off time on the beach in Thailand, South of France etc

Sounds great
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Old 26th Feb 2008, 00:00
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High hours, fatigue and poor dispatch support ARE SAFETY ISSUES, are they not?
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Old 26th Feb 2008, 10:25
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High hours, fatigue and poor dispatch support ARE SAFETY ISSUES, are they not?
High hours a safety risk? - NOPE!!
Poor dispatch a safety risk? - NOPE!!
Fatique a safety risk? - YES!! - So go to bed in due time when you have 5 days early.

I don't know aboyt RYR, but EZY is having a very safety minded culture, probably more than many airlines
 
Old 27th Feb 2008, 01:50
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Just a respectful reminder that Ryanair is not a UK operator! Those LoCos that do fall under the direct remit of the UK CAA will be some of the best regulated LoCo airlines that are around!
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Old 27th Feb 2008, 14:31
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Don't you think that if there were safety issues something would have happened?
I visit PPRuNe regularly in order to check if something has happened yet, although my focus isn't Easyjet or Ryanair, it's all flavours (not just low cost) of another shambles I'm very familiar with. The pressures of the low cost version must inevitably stack the odds higher, though.

Beats me why there aren't craters everywhere. There have been a few, for reasons never properly revealed, I think. They've come close on other occasions, but got away with it. Maybe it's like buses.....none for ages, then a whole bunch at once. It's certainly an ongoing mystery.

Of course, the CAA (or whatever) won't be doing anything about it. "No prangs, no problem" is the perfectly understandable easy option. Being proactive requires an incentive and the public sector doesn't work like that.
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Old 27th Feb 2008, 14:50
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Can't say much about FR but have worked with EZY and many, many other carriers over a lot of years.

You will look far and wide to find a better carrier than this in terms of their safety culture.
They have robust and challenging systmes. They do look to improve on the 'standard'. Was it not EZY that commissioned outside experts to look at pilot fatigue? Did they not change their crew rostering against the findings? Did the CAA not acknowledge the work done as thorough and competent?

I've never been employed by EZY but have worked along side their people. They have a lot of very good individuals but like all large employers, they have a few of plonkers as well. Same for BA, KLM, AF, TUI, AA, CO etc that I've experienced.

Statistics say that, sooner or later, one of these carriers will suffer a mishap. Hopefully not for a long, long time. No Doubt when it does happen the press will crucify them due to being low cost. I often wonder when the legacy people and press will understand that loco does not mean cheap; just efficient use of resources.
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Old 27th Feb 2008, 18:40
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May be they where the safety issue.....
 
Old 27th Feb 2008, 22:21
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but now we have these fellas screaming to get into our poor 3rd world dowdy airlines!
Nope, not really

You will look far and wide to find a better carrier than this in terms of their safety culture.
Indeed, very true (this is about easyJet by the way)

There are no "safety issues" at EZY. They are very, very cautious to deliver a "safe" product.
No need to say more.
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Old 28th Feb 2008, 00:15
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Just to add to the already long list of sensible answer to foolish comments - there are no safety issues at EZY. I have worked for 5 airlines and the safety culture here is as strong as it gets. We also employ pilots from such outstanding companies as Cathay and BA, to name only a couple - they too will say the same.

Regarding the idea that "we have these fellas screaming to get into our poor 3rd world dowdy airlines" , this is somewhat innaccurate. You may be referring to the voluntary secondment of some pilots from easyJet to Indigo for the Winter season. EasyJet trawled the company for volunteers to go but could hardly get anyone to sign up - in the end 8 FOs and not a single Captain took the bait. Not exactly "screaming to get in", but there again there is nothing as boring as the truth.
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Old 28th Feb 2008, 14:21
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acbus1
Beats me why there aren't craters everywhere. There have been a few, for reasons never properly revealed, I think.
So you choose the tabloid view; never let the truth get in the way of some sensationalist scaremongering.

Being proactive requires an incentive and the public sector doesn't work like that
Low cost airlines are not public sector. Everyone working for a low cost airline has a stake in a continued accident-free operation. There is big investment in people and equipment to this end despite what the tabloid media would have you think.
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Old 28th Feb 2008, 17:22
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At the risk of tempting fate, wasn't it a rather high profile legacy carrier that had an aircraft sitting in a small crater at LHR recently!
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Old 29th Feb 2008, 11:11
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Here we go, yet again, for the umpteenth time.
Akali Dal strikes me as yet another cheapo, too lazy to investigate, 4th estate type fishing for dirt to splurge on his red-top. Why do you dignify him with a reply, I wonder?
I hear that many Indian airlines ignore safety issues.
I hear that many Arabian Gulf airlines cut corners.
I hear many African airlines ignore safety issues.
I hear that many Asian airlines, particularly the LOCOs, cut corners.
All my statements are just as puerile and fantastic as his original post.
When will all this digging at LOCOs ever stop? As long as we reply to this rubbish, we just perpetuate the myths.
Ignore him and he might just go away, with any luck.
In the meantime Dal, try searching this forum for all the answers to your journo instincts.
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Old 29th Feb 2008, 21:51
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Keep on denying and hope it will go away......have it that way if it suits you.
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Old 29th Feb 2008, 22:48
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Akali Dal - There is no issue. They are all governed by the same safety standards and if they fall short they will be grounded - end of story.
Whoever your disaffected ex-EZY/RYR friends are they are probably the same sort of person that you see all too often in this industry. People who profess to have inside knowledge of dark practices, poor procedures etc etc etc but who in reality couldn't cut it and got overlooked for promotions so resort to tall stories over a beer or 9 to impress their new and impressionable friends..like yourself!
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Old 29th Feb 2008, 23:10
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Her here TT.....Akali Dal, you need to wake up and smell reality
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Old 1st Mar 2008, 09:58
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Well said, TT. You have it spot on there. ์Naysayers and doom-mongers crop up with monotonous regularity in bars all around the world. Posters begin threads on here without any research or reading of past posts on the issue. The likes of Akali Dall smell an opportunity to stir the sludge and see what rises to the top. Try reading the interminable posts on this subject stored in the archive and you will see that the issue is a non-issue, in spite of how much you would wish it to be otherwise.
AD, I still think you're a journo trying to dig up some salacious quotes from so-called, 'industry sources'.
Go back under your log and do some real research.
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