Happy at work? Airlines with good working morale
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Happy at work? Airlines with good working morale
Gentlemen
Often the loudest people on these message boards are the most bored and pessimistic. But there must be someone out there happy at work.
Id like to ask you if you know of an airline company that has a generally good morale amongst its crews, especially pilots in this case.
Do you know of any - and if so - what are they (both staff and management) doing right?
Cheers
Often the loudest people on these message boards are the most bored and pessimistic. But there must be someone out there happy at work.
Id like to ask you if you know of an airline company that has a generally good morale amongst its crews, especially pilots in this case.
Do you know of any - and if so - what are they (both staff and management) doing right?
Cheers
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Who objects to being called a Gentleman? What do you prefer, Chavs , You Rabble????
Or are we trying to raise a gender issue here? (in which case it is unlikely to involve a "high proportion")
Or are we trying to raise a gender issue here? (in which case it is unlikely to involve a "high proportion")
Gentlemen and gentle women 
I've always found the degree of happiness at work varies due to a multitude of factors outside the immediate control of the company.
Like many guys, I'm a bit of a techie and like playing with machines and electronic toys and enjoy the 'Atari game' aspect of flying the 'plane. Link that to a penchant for travel, water sports (no, Smithers, not THAT sort!), skiing, pubbing and partying and aircrew (in the RAF sense meaning everyone on the aircraft) becomes a happy choice of career.
Happy all the time? No, of course not, but enough.
Happy bits:
Being the captain.
Decent layover at agreeable port with agreeable crew.
Airline keeps interference to a minimum but keeps aeroplanes fixed.
Supportive chief pilot.
Flt Ops which understands the problem.
Real trainers.
Oh yes, loadsa dosh (in your dreams, Basil).
Unhappy bits:
Being the FO with macho captain, boy captain etc etc.
Cabin chief who pisses off the crew.
Airline with interfering, 'blame culture' ethos.
Airline which doesn't like fixing aircraft.
Underconfident chief pilot.
'Is my face bovvered?' Flt Ops (Thankfully infrequent)
Checkers and choppers (although they DO concentrate the mind).
Assessment of airlines?
I'd hesitate to make any specific adverse comment in public although I can safely say that the two best companies I have worked for were IBM (not as pilot) and BA which I left eleven years ago.
Other airlines were Gulf Air, Caledonian (as the BA charter subsidiary previously BEA Tours Sp? and British Airtours - regrettably not B Cal which I understand was an excellent employer), Cathay, and EAAC.
Some, not necessarily those mentioned, had an unfortunate attitude to employees or a company and training ethos which left a little to be desired, others were a bit unwilling to spend money on spares.
One could go on and on but sorry for being unable to provide a preference list - could be a bit actionable
I've always found the degree of happiness at work varies due to a multitude of factors outside the immediate control of the company.
Like many guys, I'm a bit of a techie and like playing with machines and electronic toys and enjoy the 'Atari game' aspect of flying the 'plane. Link that to a penchant for travel, water sports (no, Smithers, not THAT sort!), skiing, pubbing and partying and aircrew (in the RAF sense meaning everyone on the aircraft) becomes a happy choice of career.
Happy all the time? No, of course not, but enough.
Happy bits:
Being the captain.
Decent layover at agreeable port with agreeable crew.
Airline keeps interference to a minimum but keeps aeroplanes fixed.
Supportive chief pilot.
Flt Ops which understands the problem.
Real trainers.
Oh yes, loadsa dosh (in your dreams, Basil).
Unhappy bits:
Being the FO with macho captain, boy captain etc etc.
Cabin chief who pisses off the crew.
Airline with interfering, 'blame culture' ethos.
Airline which doesn't like fixing aircraft.
Underconfident chief pilot.
'Is my face bovvered?' Flt Ops (Thankfully infrequent)
Checkers and choppers (although they DO concentrate the mind).
Assessment of airlines?
I'd hesitate to make any specific adverse comment in public although I can safely say that the two best companies I have worked for were IBM (not as pilot) and BA which I left eleven years ago.
Other airlines were Gulf Air, Caledonian (as the BA charter subsidiary previously BEA Tours Sp? and British Airtours - regrettably not B Cal which I understand was an excellent employer), Cathay, and EAAC.
Some, not necessarily those mentioned, had an unfortunate attitude to employees or a company and training ethos which left a little to be desired, others were a bit unwilling to spend money on spares.
One could go on and on but sorry for being unable to provide a preference list - could be a bit actionable
Last edited by Basil; 14th Feb 2008 at 16:28. Reason: Flt Ops
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what is being said i that any missive starting 'gentleman' denotes a certain stridency,arrogance & patronising attitude,usually the sender is ex military & has not adjusted to civvie life even though they left 20 years ago (most ex mil do adjust some don't)
Econ & Saffie,
I'm ex mil and consider 'Gentlemen' or 'Ladies and gentlemen' a perfectly reasonable manner in which to commence an address.
I am also ex shipyards and Merchant Navy and could (and have), if pressed, address a group as 'You
' but that doesn't really fit in with one's age and status and I really prefer the former.
I'm ex mil and consider 'Gentlemen' or 'Ladies and gentlemen' a perfectly reasonable manner in which to commence an address.
I am also ex shipyards and Merchant Navy and could (and have), if pressed, address a group as 'You
' but that doesn't really fit in with one's age and status and I really prefer the former.
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Funnily enough, the "you " would at least acknowledge that there are women around. "Gentlemen"... well, I usually think "ex mil" and then read on.
Back to topic.
It's difficult to find the perfect job as we all know. Oh, just reread the topic, it's for airline pilots..
" would at least acknowledge that there are women around. "Gentlemen"... well, I usually think "ex mil" and then read on.Back to topic.
It's difficult to find the perfect job as we all know. Oh, just reread the topic, it's for airline pilots..
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Yup, sure is. In the top 10 size wise in Europe and if we combine our US and ME operation, the world's largest airline. 
As for happiness. I personally am pretty happy with my job. I have a great team of fleet managers looking out for us and the operational office does a pretty good job. Our colleagues are great too.
What do they do right? Well, they back you up with advice when required and will lean on the Schedulers when necessary too. Essentially, effective communication. Our engineers in City and Northolt are fantastic. The engineers we use in Luton and Southampton are excellent as well. Happy to explain stuff.
As for happiness. I personally am pretty happy with my job. I have a great team of fleet managers looking out for us and the operational office does a pretty good job. Our colleagues are great too.
What do they do right? Well, they back you up with advice when required and will lean on the Schedulers when necessary too. Essentially, effective communication. Our engineers in City and Northolt are fantastic. The engineers we use in Luton and Southampton are excellent as well. Happy to explain stuff.
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I'm not overly sure how this would apply to the airline industry in general, but I've just completed some research on motivation (read happiness) in construction professionals. It seems generally accepted that for professionals intrinsic factors, like a feeling of achievement, provide greater happiness than materialistic rewards like better wages etc.
But then having been trawling these forums for a while it seems that increasing their wages would be the best way to create happy pilots!
But then having been trawling these forums for a while it seems that increasing their wages would be the best way to create happy pilots!
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But then having been trawling these forums for a while it seems that increasing their wages would be the best way to create happy pilots!
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Dysag, I still stand by my assertion,that any letter beginning 'gentleman' is pompous,(having received many missives beginning this way) they usually go on to lecture,hector or admonish,I have never had a nice letter beginning that way.
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Dear Saffron. You entertain me with your brilliant detective work "the sender is ex military & has not adjusted to civvie life even though they left 20 years ago". Nothing could be farther from the truth. Never been near anything military, I have a big family and worked for a national flag carrier for years. Dont worry - Im not offended by your comments. Just amused how you come to your conclusions from that word most people relate to as positive. Gentle-men. So back to the subject.
Anyway - thanks Basil for your input to the original question. I think I agree with you in many ways. Salary is of course important (as in any profession), and yes good maintenance of A/C. In my work Ive found that good and supportive communication between management and crews does so much good. From what I understand, that is what Southwest is all about too. I will try to find some literature on that.
My company is good in most ways and we take pride in our work. However, I guess there is always room for improvement so therefore its nice to hear from people with experience in the field.
Thanks ..........Gentlemen and ladies.
Anyway - thanks Basil for your input to the original question. I think I agree with you in many ways. Salary is of course important (as in any profession), and yes good maintenance of A/C. In my work Ive found that good and supportive communication between management and crews does so much good. From what I understand, that is what Southwest is all about too. I will try to find some literature on that.
My company is good in most ways and we take pride in our work. However, I guess there is always room for improvement so therefore its nice to hear from people with experience in the field.
Thanks ..........Gentlemen and ladies.
Was very happy in a regional turboprop out of Sydney (EAA) just had aspirations for something bigger and to be able to pay off a mortgage
From some management studies I did a while ago I recall money not being a great motivator (long term) but lack of it could be a great demotivator.
Very happy with my current employer and fellow flightcrew (BA), just the operating base (LHR) and commuting (ok my choice, not their fault) are drawbacks.
From some management studies I did a while ago I recall money not being a great motivator (long term) but lack of it could be a great demotivator.
Very happy with my current employer and fellow flightcrew (BA), just the operating base (LHR) and commuting (ok my choice, not their fault) are drawbacks.
Ladies and gentlemen:
Just stumbled across this hijacked thread.
Why do some of you react so negatively to 'Military' ?
Would you prefer any tinpot dictator with a few billion dollarsworth of arms to come and take your land?
The foregoing is not a Basil original idea but has been lifted and modified:
Most of the people in our society are sheep. They are kind, gentle, productive creatures who can only hurt one another by accident.
Then there are the wolves, and the wolves feed on the sheep without mercy. There are evil men in this world and they are capable of evil deeds. Criminals within your own society or enemy dictators in foreign lands. There is no safety in denial.
Then there are sheepdogs which live to protect the flock and confront the wolf.
Clearly these are not black and white distinctions. Many of us are sometimes sheep and sometimes sheepdogs. I've spent most of my life as the former but part as the latter.
You've guessed already, haven't you? The police and military are the sheepdogs. Perfect? Nope! . . but the best we have.
Just stumbled across this hijacked thread.
Why do some of you react so negatively to 'Military' ?
Would you prefer any tinpot dictator with a few billion dollarsworth of arms to come and take your land?
The foregoing is not a Basil original idea but has been lifted and modified:
Most of the people in our society are sheep. They are kind, gentle, productive creatures who can only hurt one another by accident.
Then there are the wolves, and the wolves feed on the sheep without mercy. There are evil men in this world and they are capable of evil deeds. Criminals within your own society or enemy dictators in foreign lands. There is no safety in denial.
Then there are sheepdogs which live to protect the flock and confront the wolf.
Clearly these are not black and white distinctions. Many of us are sometimes sheep and sometimes sheepdogs. I've spent most of my life as the former but part as the latter.
You've guessed already, haven't you? The police and military are the sheepdogs. Perfect? Nope! . . but the best we have.
Last edited by Basil; 17th Aug 2008 at 08:12.
ray cosmic,
Yup! Seniority or rotating seniority based bidline.
Those who haven't experienced it would be surprised at how many junior people get a line they've bid for simply because not everyone wants the same trips.
Priorities vary between: money, lifestyle, night flying, destination, triplength, people on the trip, max days off, working midweek or weekends, etc, etc.
Yup! Seniority or rotating seniority based bidline.
Those who haven't experienced it would be surprised at how many junior people get a line they've bid for simply because not everyone wants the same trips.
Priorities vary between: money, lifestyle, night flying, destination, triplength, people on the trip, max days off, working midweek or weekends, etc, etc.
Last edited by Basil; 17th Aug 2008 at 08:11.