Aer Lingus Pilots to Strike
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
From: 30 West
Dear Headinclouds,
What a suitable name!!
Enough said.
Perhaps if we all defended ourselves more in the past we wouldn't constantly find ourselves defending our careers against others, in a constant erosion of working conditions as benchmarked against each other.
No-one is going to stand up for you if you don't stand up for yourself!!
Bring it on!
Things are changing, This not a semi-state anymore, all decisions need to be in the interest of shareholders........It would appear EI Pilots are paid well above market rate.......what do you expect from an ever evolving industry, where the emphasis is on reduciing costs and increasing productivity....?
The Good days are over.........for EI pilots.....
The Good days are over.........for EI pilots.....
Enough said.Perhaps if we all defended ourselves more in the past we wouldn't constantly find ourselves defending our careers against others, in a constant erosion of working conditions as benchmarked against each other.
No-one is going to stand up for you if you don't stand up for yourself!!
Bring it on!
Rebel PPRuNer
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,839
Likes: 4
From: Toronto, Canada (formerly EICK)
EI management have severely mishandled this. By underestimating the will of their employees, they will probably lose as much in turnover and future customer goodwill as they would have saved in pilot remuneration. Michael O'Leary's EGM call re:Shannon would have probably prompted a management threat to walk but with this looming the other shareholders might tell them "there's the door".
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 143
Likes: 0
From: ireland
asfkap, the pilots have an agreement called scope which covers who can fly our aircraft and from where. We have given up many things over the years in its defense because we felt it was the jewel in our ir crown. Now the management of Aer Lingus have decided to take all we gave up and circumvent scope with these new hire pilots. The engineers and cabin crew union chose to peruse a different course consequently the new base does not conflict with any of their collective agreements. This is why we are up in arms and the others are not.
Headincloads, I assume you are out to rattle the cage but you do bring up a point thats worth getting straight. Aer Lingus pilots work as hard as any in Europe typically 850 flight hours a year, most will during the course of the year be required to stand down to avoid exceeding state legal limits. Our package is commensurate with this level of productivity and if MOL is to believed in his interview on newstalk106 below FR.
Headincloads, I assume you are out to rattle the cage but you do bring up a point thats worth getting straight. Aer Lingus pilots work as hard as any in Europe typically 850 flight hours a year, most will during the course of the year be required to stand down to avoid exceeding state legal limits. Our package is commensurate with this level of productivity and if MOL is to believed in his interview on newstalk106 below FR.
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
From: ireland
I'm in full support of the pilots strike action, but when the rest of us in EI are getting dumped on by the managment no one sticks together. It should be a full company strike in support of our friends and colleagues in Shannon, some of us seem to be forgetting about them in my view.
One more point the Enigneers in EI work dame hard and consently goes unnoticed.
I'll finish by saying one more time 'we all need to stick together, Pilots, Engineers, Cabin Crew, Groundstaff etc'
One more point the Enigneers in EI work dame hard and consently goes unnoticed.
I'll finish by saying one more time 'we all need to stick together, Pilots, Engineers, Cabin Crew, Groundstaff etc'
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 186
Likes: 0
From: Over there.
I could be wrong, but didnt the shamrock pilots already sell out to management allowing newjoiners to start on different T&c's?
One company, one seniority list, one contract.......the way it is, and the way it should stay.
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 34
Likes: 0
From: Cloud 10
'Management tried to enforce new T&C`s on the recently hired guys, but IALPA successfully managed to change this.
One company, one seniority list, one contract.......the way it is, and the way it should stay'
INLAK: I think you may find by comparing an old and new Contract that these ARE Different.......
One company, one seniority list, one contract.......the way it is, and the way it should stay'
INLAK: I think you may find by comparing an old and new Contract that these ARE Different.......
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by ASKAP
I have to say Mannion certainly came out fighting and probably won the hearts and minds of Joe Public, it also didn't hurt him that he got to speak after the Landers who then didn't have the opportunity to come back and refute or counter any of his claims.
Mr.Landers came over calm and collected, and politely laid out his points, which were quite illuminating re Aer Lingus' misinformation agenda.
Then Mr.Mannion came on - and he sounded like a man on the verge of losing it. He barked at the interviewer, shouted over her attempts to extract answers, and generally sounded as if he was about to have a minor coronary.
Not professional, not convincing.
Lets face it though - the poor man is Public Enemy Number One at the moment. The strain is clearly taking its toll.
What fascinates me is that he's either an actor of DeNiro's abilities, or he truly didn't realise the impact (ooeerrr) his latest bumblings would bring down on his head. In which case, the company is being run by a nincompoop.
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 278
Likes: 0
From: Euroland
Eejits
This union lark sickens me.
It's simple. If you like the deal AL offer, fly for them. If you're under paid, that must mean someone is willing to offer YOU more. So move to the company who is willing to offer more. If this company doesn't exist, sit down, shut up and stop acting like left wing civil service monkeys.
Unions are gone, as is flying being a top end job. Do finance if you want money...
You have no support from the Irish public.
VT
It's simple. If you like the deal AL offer, fly for them. If you're under paid, that must mean someone is willing to offer YOU more. So move to the company who is willing to offer more. If this company doesn't exist, sit down, shut up and stop acting like left wing civil service monkeys.
Unions are gone, as is flying being a top end job. Do finance if you want money...
You have no support from the Irish public.
VT
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 300
Likes: 0
From: Lost
"It would appear EI Pilots are paid well above market rate."
Er... I don't think so, the Basic is way short if the above post, #21, by Top Jock is anything to go by, certainly not by UK standards anyway. Just take a look at the other UK operators on PPJN and I think you will find that EI fall way short of the mark on basic salary once you do a Euro/Sterling conversion. Unless the figures quoted are NOT what you guys are really getting? If this is the case, then, could some one from EI post the actual figures?
What are the proposed Salaries / T's & C's for the BFS Pilots?
Thanks.
BR.
Er... I don't think so, the Basic is way short if the above post, #21, by Top Jock is anything to go by, certainly not by UK standards anyway. Just take a look at the other UK operators on PPJN and I think you will find that EI fall way short of the mark on basic salary once you do a Euro/Sterling conversion. Unless the figures quoted are NOT what you guys are really getting? If this is the case, then, could some one from EI post the actual figures?
What are the proposed Salaries / T's & C's for the BFS Pilots?
Thanks.
BR.
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 31
Likes: 0
From: in my happy place
What are the proposed Salaries / T's & C's for the BFS Pilots?
Yes that would be most helpful in this thread. Come up with some numbers from both Dublin based newbies and Belfast Newbies. Please from somebody who actually knows from within!
Dutch MP
Yes that would be most helpful in this thread. Come up with some numbers from both Dublin based newbies and Belfast Newbies. Please from somebody who actually knows from within!
Dutch MP
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 8
Likes: 0
From: europe
IFALPA Recruitment Ban
i see IFALPA have joined the row.....http://www.ifalpa.org/jobs/recruitme...0(Ireland).pdf
does any one know what this means to wannabee green bus drivers???
does any one know what this means to wannabee green bus drivers???
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: London
You have always to think one step ahead of the other side in this game.
If they can establish a cheap base then the next step will be to have crews doing trips like bfs-man-dub-fra-dub-european nightstop-dub-fra-dub-man-bfs.
You either have an agreement and enforce it or get ready for the broom handle and just hope you don't get the broom head as well.
If they can establish a cheap base then the next step will be to have crews doing trips like bfs-man-dub-fra-dub-european nightstop-dub-fra-dub-man-bfs.
You either have an agreement and enforce it or get ready for the broom handle and just hope you don't get the broom head as well.
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
From: In the Farm
Belfast is not cheap these days either.
Average house prices for:
Northern Ireland £240,302
England £221,370
Scotland £165,363
Wales £165,119
not sure how the Republic stands
Guest
Posts: n/a
'Fraid not ASKAP.
Read it and weep.
Average price in ROI = €304,166 = 206,465 GBP
Average price in NI = 240,302 GBP
The average ROI house is 33,837 GBP ( 49,864.13 euro) cheaper than NI.
Or to put it another way, the NI house is 16.5% more expensive.
Read it and weep.
The average price paid for a house nationally (ROI) in May 2007 was €304,166.
Source: FinFacts.ie
Source: FinFacts.ie
Average price in ROI = €304,166 = 206,465 GBP
Average price in NI = 240,302 GBP
The average ROI house is 33,837 GBP ( 49,864.13 euro) cheaper than NI.
Or to put it another way, the NI house is 16.5% more expensive.
Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 70
Likes: 0
From: Dublin, Ireland
Clever move by MOL today. All eyes will be on the Govt appointed Directors to see how they vote. The Govt cannot sit on the fence on this one. One things has me scratching my head though. If the Board wasn't informed prior to EI announcing the BFS/SNN moves...then why is the Minister for Transport asking Dermot Mannion and John Sharman (Chairman) to visit business leaders in the West and explain their decision. If the Board weren't consulted...what's the point of the John Sharman tagging along.
On a matter of Good Corporate Governance...I would love to know the answer to this question. Has the Board delegated authority for strategic investment decisions to the Executive Management Team. Strategy defined simply is...Where is the business trying to get to in the long-term (direction). This is something that the Board should be interested in and consulted about. If the Board isn't doing this then it should be sacked. However if the Executive Management Team decided themselves without consulting the Board...well you would have to call into question the Executive Management Team's actions.
On a matter of Good Corporate Governance...I would love to know the answer to this question. Has the Board delegated authority for strategic investment decisions to the Executive Management Team. Strategy defined simply is...Where is the business trying to get to in the long-term (direction). This is something that the Board should be interested in and consulted about. If the Board isn't doing this then it should be sacked. However if the Executive Management Team decided themselves without consulting the Board...well you would have to call into question the Executive Management Team's actions.