Flyglobespan: Time To Make A Stand
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First of all, weiss5, many of us would be proud to have a second language spoken and written as well as you obviously can. You have reason to be proud. Don't rise to the derogatory comments of others. We are supposed to be professional people and this kind of comment and backbiting is not required in this thread. Is it not surprising that it is so difficult to organise proper representation when you cannot seem to join as a coherent and popular front?
Might I suggest that we keep to the subject and useful input.
Might I suggest that we keep to the subject and useful input.
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weiss5 I apologise that you take offence. You joined as a non english pilot, if you dont like things here you can leave but pilots in globespan arent all up in arms. Like us they dont like 4 sectors and positioning in taxis,maybe different where you are but here were happy.
pocahostie how paranoid are you? wing commander g is the manager, now me ? If Ive not made any posts maybe nothing interested me, this thread interests me because it relates to people I work with,including you. Everytime you come into the crew room we shudder, hows that for CRM.
pocahostie how paranoid are you? wing commander g is the manager, now me ? If Ive not made any posts maybe nothing interested me, this thread interests me because it relates to people I work with,including you. Everytime you come into the crew room we shudder, hows that for CRM.
Great news everyone
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'The Evil Empire'
I have been waiting and hoping for some recognition from the 4th floor that the only experienced long haul manager they have has something to offer.I have been disapointed. He is sent off to far flung places in order that they can perform their evil deeds without hindrance. He was not consulted prior to the introduction of the CPT min rest. Despite his representation to the hierarchy after he experienced the ordeal first hand it continues. The commercial dept runs this airline without any constraint from the Flt Ops Dept
The union recognition thing is vital, but will take time.Congratulations on the progress so far.The T&G are indeed very powerful, but will not be interested in representing the pilot body if previous experience is anything to go by.From the numbers published BALPA is the obvious choice despite my personal abhorance for the organisation.
In the short term a withdrawl of good will might achieve some results.Unfortunately I think that there are still enough people who will do anything rendering that course of action less than ideal. Having said that, a refusal to undertake unreasonably long duties does not seem to meet with any hassle.If all of you who feel strongly enough say 'NO' to climbing in the back they will run out of 'yes men'. At the same time a crossing of the T's and dotting of the I's with a very blunt pencil on the CPT planning will definately hurt.What is the hotel in PMI?
Chirp is an extremely powerful organ and it really gets their attention when the ministry comes to call. The time scale is frighteningly fast when 'flight safety' is mentioned. In the min rest CPT this is clearly an issue.
At the same, time an ASR sent directly to the CAA seems to have the same effect. We no longer have a Flight Safety Officer as I understand it so the only way to retain annonymity is to go direct.
There are issues with escape routes over Tehran and Diverion fields in Africa which are just being swept under the carpet.
No one wants to harm the company's long term viability. Every time we go to work we are expected to perjure ourselves by signing a voyage report showing fictitious rest in a non existant crew rest area. If this is the only way the company can afford do the job is there any long term viability? With NG joining the India contract and the introduction of assorted leased AC and crews are they just running 'a virtual airline?
Finally, it doesn't do what it said on the tin shown to me not so long ago and that is very sad.It looks like the company is finally running out of the 6's it has been throwing since it started the long haul ops.Lets hope it doesn't come down to earth with too much of a bump!!
The union recognition thing is vital, but will take time.Congratulations on the progress so far.The T&G are indeed very powerful, but will not be interested in representing the pilot body if previous experience is anything to go by.From the numbers published BALPA is the obvious choice despite my personal abhorance for the organisation.
In the short term a withdrawl of good will might achieve some results.Unfortunately I think that there are still enough people who will do anything rendering that course of action less than ideal. Having said that, a refusal to undertake unreasonably long duties does not seem to meet with any hassle.If all of you who feel strongly enough say 'NO' to climbing in the back they will run out of 'yes men'. At the same time a crossing of the T's and dotting of the I's with a very blunt pencil on the CPT planning will definately hurt.What is the hotel in PMI?
Chirp is an extremely powerful organ and it really gets their attention when the ministry comes to call. The time scale is frighteningly fast when 'flight safety' is mentioned. In the min rest CPT this is clearly an issue.
At the same, time an ASR sent directly to the CAA seems to have the same effect. We no longer have a Flight Safety Officer as I understand it so the only way to retain annonymity is to go direct.
There are issues with escape routes over Tehran and Diverion fields in Africa which are just being swept under the carpet.
No one wants to harm the company's long term viability. Every time we go to work we are expected to perjure ourselves by signing a voyage report showing fictitious rest in a non existant crew rest area. If this is the only way the company can afford do the job is there any long term viability? With NG joining the India contract and the introduction of assorted leased AC and crews are they just running 'a virtual airline?
Finally, it doesn't do what it said on the tin shown to me not so long ago and that is very sad.It looks like the company is finally running out of the 6's it has been throwing since it started the long haul ops.Lets hope it doesn't come down to earth with too much of a bump!!
CHIRP continues to be an effective tool at MON to bring the authorities focus to bear on questionable rostering endeavors.
I would suggest that you GSM boys and girls use this system as it was designed for this very reason.
I would suggest that you GSM boys and girls use this system as it was designed for this very reason.
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asset use
Dont forget the down time in SFB is over 24 hrs, and that was happening twice a week.Alltogether over three days down time per week. What does it cost to lease one of these beasts? The crews all do bullets and the hotac and allowances are less so thats all right then!!
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Disappointed but not surprised by the less than proactive response from BALPA, I have been a member for many years and paid my subs. What are they doing?
Last edited by haggis hurler; 16th Feb 2007 at 15:28.
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Struggle to employ?
Are Globespan struggling to employ? I bet they will now after this thread is read. I was contemplating joining as a direct entry captain.
......dont think I will bother now.
Good luck guys.
......dont think I will bother now.
Good luck guys.
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...and other problems...
Are Globespan struggling to employ? I bet they will now after this thread is read. I was contemplating joining as a direct entry captain.
......dont think I will bother now.
Good luck guys.
......dont think I will bother now.
Good luck guys.
The same goes with expenses. I sent in mine (via snail mail),and they rejected it, but "forgot" to tell me.
Overall, they need to work hard to improve their communication efforts, as it seems to be a one way road right now.
cheers
LE
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"gsm flightdeck delayed the gsm711 10th feb causing an over night stay at man for the pax"
How were BALPA involved? What did they do?
Its nearly 3 weeks since the vote for recognition, has anyone heard from BALPA?
How were BALPA involved? What did they do?
Its nearly 3 weeks since the vote for recognition, has anyone heard from BALPA?
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Afternoon all. Just delivered the wife to her wrestling class (advanced) and found myself confined to barracks so decided to look up prune for old time sake and lo and behold what do I find myself reading but reams and reams on this outfit which is now calling itself "Globespan" and it occurred to me that perhaps some of you now working for it or, worse still, some of you who might be thinking of "giving" your very hard earned or yet to be earned money for "training" to this or indeed to any outfit which has similar attitudes and abilities to this one and might not be aware of its recent history. So, set out hereunder are a few "pointers" which may or may not give you some insight into the "professionalism" of "Da Management" of the company which you are or may in the future have to deal with.
When myself and my colleagues worked for this outfit they called themselves Cougar Leasing Limited and were based at Stansted. Approximately two years after "Da Management" eventually managed to get the outfit up and running, the flight crews were informed by the head of flight operations that the company had "gone" and given the somewhat "erratic" management style not to mention the "abilities" of those who had become known, non too affectionately, as the "Cougar Cowboys", many of us employees were less than surprised that events had turned out as we had been informed they had by "Da Management". However, what we failed to comprehend was that when the head of flight operations told us that the company had "gone", that is exactly what he meant! The company had simply shut up shop in Stansted and "gone" up the road to Scotland where, with the benefit of a swift name change, they "morphed" themselves from Cougar into Globespan and opened up as "Scotland’s favourite airline"??!!!
Now, naturally, like any family moving house in "a bit of a hurry" a few "items" went "missing" and in the case of Cougar/Globespan it turned out to be the employees! Particularly, the flight crews who were "unfortunately mislaid" in the move along with their jobs, salaries, allowances and expenses, not to mention hopes and desires and of course the "trifling" matter of the thousands of pounds involved in the cost of a type rating and additional expenses incurred in gaining it and no salary for months on end for those who were "obliged" to pay for their rating!
However, dear reader, I'm delighted to tell you that the move wasn’t all bad news as "Da Management" to an individual and complete with their salaries, expenses and "management perks" managed to safely negotiate the perils of the A1 and arrived in Scotland without losing a single solitary manager in the process, which for this lot let me tell you, was quite a feat and "achieved", quite possibly, because for the first time in their lives they knew exactly what they were up to! Of course, once safely ensconced in Edinburgh it seemed "obvious" to "Da Management" that their hard working and much put upon flight crews "probably" would not really want their livelihoods back or their jobs back or their salaries or their expenses and it would be "easier" all round if "Da Management" simply went out and got a "bunch" of "new" pilots who would "naturally" have to pay for their own type ratings rather than the company having to go to all the "bother" of paying to type rate their existing pilots onto a new aircraft type and that is exactly what they did!! Of course the "exceptional" and "highly qualified" not to mention most secretive management pilots and their three pals were not subject either to the loss of their livelihoods or the pittance involved in type rating them onto the new aircraft type which was paid for by "Da Management". After all, the company "owed" these "individualists" much for the part they had played in this rather shabby little whizz. If ever there was a company and a job where that old adage of "you shouldn’t have joined if you can’t take a joke" rang true, this is the one.
So my two pennies worth for those who might be thinking of spending substantial sums of their own, or worse still, their bank manager’s money with this or any company with similar type attitudes to this one is to consider your every move very, very carefully indeed as it is utterly unrealistic to expect that any company which is unwilling or unable to spend money on training employees to do their jobs will adopt a more conscientious attitude toward any other aspect of your employ which, put very simply, means that you and yours will be the losers and that loss may well be total, everything, jobs, salaries the lot, as your colleagues who went before you have had to endure.
Should you however happen to be a Captain "downsizing" from a large professional airline and looking for something a little "edgy" to do as you don’t play golf but fancy the idea of seeing how the "other half" live or should you be loaded and don’t mind wasting a few tens of thousands of pounds and a couple of years of your life not to mention be treated like a total moron, then my friend, you may have found your spiritual home either with this outfit or indeed with any of its low cost, low standards, allies. So, if it’s for you, please go right ahead, fill your boots, enjoy yourself and jolly good luck to you. If, on the other hand, you have a mortgage to pay, a family to feed and regard yourself to be a professional airline pilot and are looking to enhance your career prospects, then my friend, there is, in my opinion, absolutely nothing of interest for you here. Rather as "bantermanter" says "keep your money and buy yourself a flash car" or you might like to consider taking yourself and the money that you were going to "give" to this outfit for a type rating to the races at Cheltenham, find yourself an outsider, something with three legs, a cough, an attitude problem and who is double jobbing with a milk round and put your last penny on it! If it does come in, you're rich and you won’t ever need to consider such a risky venture as a career in flying. If it fails are you any the worse off? At least, you’ll be able to say you’ve enjoyed yourself which most certainly will not be the case if you "give" your money to this type of operation in the hope of obtaining through hard work and effort, long term job prospects! If you want a career in flying, join a company which "simply" bonds you. That way you'll have nothing to beat yourself up over if you should find that, through absolutely no fault of either yours or your colleagues but rather due to what might be called an "avant-garde" management "style" the entire edifice comes down around your ears. Then at least, you can console yourself with the thought that "all" will suffer the pain and loss equally!!!
Some contributors have written about this outfit’s "terms & conditions" and while I sincerely hope that they are somewhat different to those endured at Cougar, it would seem more likely however that as a Cougar never changes its spots when push comes to shove (and believe me it will!) and with the behaviour this outfit and its management saying far more and showing in the clearest possible terms how they "value" their employees than could ever be written here, the employees will find that the modus operandi of globespan is, like all aspects of this company, identical to those employed when they called themselves Cougar, which, put bluntly, means that T's & C's are something of a moveable feast as far as the "unconnected" PAYE employees are concerned. In one article, a contributor writes of receiving "no pay rise". With respect, I would suggest that if you can hold on to your original salary you’ll be doing bloody well!! As Cougar Leasing Limited, some aircrew who joined having paid for their own type rating, accommodation and all expenses while training and of course no salary until, for whatever reason the Flight Operations Manager thought of came to pass, the end of training, the end of line training, the end of the world?!! The reasoning tended to be, how can one put it... "fairly nebulous", found that within a few weeks of going "on salary" the flight operations manager decided that "at least" two First Officers would have their salaries cut in half, regretfully, this "plan" couldn’t be "implemented" as the Cougar Cowboys were always short crewed!! (can you guess why??) but that never stopped the Flight Operations Manager scuttling around as a Caudal. At various stages during the "Cougar success story" individual flight crew members had their salaries "adjusted"by "Da Management" in order that as PAYE workers they could "help out the company"! Needless to say "Da Management" never saw the same necessity for any adjustment to their own salaries or indeed any other aspect of their farcical and diabolical behaviour.
So, what are the chances of Globespan succeeding? I would most respectfully suggest that they are exactly the same as those of Excalibur? Or Gill Air? Or Cougar or any of the other assorted riff-raff outfits that "Da Management" have already "managed", straight into the nearest ditch!
One final point... do not rely on the Authority, the Legislator or the British Airways Pilots Association coming to your aid. When this company was called Cougar and it decided to "emigrate" up the road to Scotland, it was not "hampered" in the slightest by rules or legislation.
Run far and run fast my friend. Chalk it up to experience. You will not make the same mistake again!
Humans have the dexterity to think and consider and to put a value on themselves and their efforts. What a shame to waste such abilities.
When myself and my colleagues worked for this outfit they called themselves Cougar Leasing Limited and were based at Stansted. Approximately two years after "Da Management" eventually managed to get the outfit up and running, the flight crews were informed by the head of flight operations that the company had "gone" and given the somewhat "erratic" management style not to mention the "abilities" of those who had become known, non too affectionately, as the "Cougar Cowboys", many of us employees were less than surprised that events had turned out as we had been informed they had by "Da Management". However, what we failed to comprehend was that when the head of flight operations told us that the company had "gone", that is exactly what he meant! The company had simply shut up shop in Stansted and "gone" up the road to Scotland where, with the benefit of a swift name change, they "morphed" themselves from Cougar into Globespan and opened up as "Scotland’s favourite airline"??!!!
Now, naturally, like any family moving house in "a bit of a hurry" a few "items" went "missing" and in the case of Cougar/Globespan it turned out to be the employees! Particularly, the flight crews who were "unfortunately mislaid" in the move along with their jobs, salaries, allowances and expenses, not to mention hopes and desires and of course the "trifling" matter of the thousands of pounds involved in the cost of a type rating and additional expenses incurred in gaining it and no salary for months on end for those who were "obliged" to pay for their rating!
However, dear reader, I'm delighted to tell you that the move wasn’t all bad news as "Da Management" to an individual and complete with their salaries, expenses and "management perks" managed to safely negotiate the perils of the A1 and arrived in Scotland without losing a single solitary manager in the process, which for this lot let me tell you, was quite a feat and "achieved", quite possibly, because for the first time in their lives they knew exactly what they were up to! Of course, once safely ensconced in Edinburgh it seemed "obvious" to "Da Management" that their hard working and much put upon flight crews "probably" would not really want their livelihoods back or their jobs back or their salaries or their expenses and it would be "easier" all round if "Da Management" simply went out and got a "bunch" of "new" pilots who would "naturally" have to pay for their own type ratings rather than the company having to go to all the "bother" of paying to type rate their existing pilots onto a new aircraft type and that is exactly what they did!! Of course the "exceptional" and "highly qualified" not to mention most secretive management pilots and their three pals were not subject either to the loss of their livelihoods or the pittance involved in type rating them onto the new aircraft type which was paid for by "Da Management". After all, the company "owed" these "individualists" much for the part they had played in this rather shabby little whizz. If ever there was a company and a job where that old adage of "you shouldn’t have joined if you can’t take a joke" rang true, this is the one.
So my two pennies worth for those who might be thinking of spending substantial sums of their own, or worse still, their bank manager’s money with this or any company with similar type attitudes to this one is to consider your every move very, very carefully indeed as it is utterly unrealistic to expect that any company which is unwilling or unable to spend money on training employees to do their jobs will adopt a more conscientious attitude toward any other aspect of your employ which, put very simply, means that you and yours will be the losers and that loss may well be total, everything, jobs, salaries the lot, as your colleagues who went before you have had to endure.
Should you however happen to be a Captain "downsizing" from a large professional airline and looking for something a little "edgy" to do as you don’t play golf but fancy the idea of seeing how the "other half" live or should you be loaded and don’t mind wasting a few tens of thousands of pounds and a couple of years of your life not to mention be treated like a total moron, then my friend, you may have found your spiritual home either with this outfit or indeed with any of its low cost, low standards, allies. So, if it’s for you, please go right ahead, fill your boots, enjoy yourself and jolly good luck to you. If, on the other hand, you have a mortgage to pay, a family to feed and regard yourself to be a professional airline pilot and are looking to enhance your career prospects, then my friend, there is, in my opinion, absolutely nothing of interest for you here. Rather as "bantermanter" says "keep your money and buy yourself a flash car" or you might like to consider taking yourself and the money that you were going to "give" to this outfit for a type rating to the races at Cheltenham, find yourself an outsider, something with three legs, a cough, an attitude problem and who is double jobbing with a milk round and put your last penny on it! If it does come in, you're rich and you won’t ever need to consider such a risky venture as a career in flying. If it fails are you any the worse off? At least, you’ll be able to say you’ve enjoyed yourself which most certainly will not be the case if you "give" your money to this type of operation in the hope of obtaining through hard work and effort, long term job prospects! If you want a career in flying, join a company which "simply" bonds you. That way you'll have nothing to beat yourself up over if you should find that, through absolutely no fault of either yours or your colleagues but rather due to what might be called an "avant-garde" management "style" the entire edifice comes down around your ears. Then at least, you can console yourself with the thought that "all" will suffer the pain and loss equally!!!
Some contributors have written about this outfit’s "terms & conditions" and while I sincerely hope that they are somewhat different to those endured at Cougar, it would seem more likely however that as a Cougar never changes its spots when push comes to shove (and believe me it will!) and with the behaviour this outfit and its management saying far more and showing in the clearest possible terms how they "value" their employees than could ever be written here, the employees will find that the modus operandi of globespan is, like all aspects of this company, identical to those employed when they called themselves Cougar, which, put bluntly, means that T's & C's are something of a moveable feast as far as the "unconnected" PAYE employees are concerned. In one article, a contributor writes of receiving "no pay rise". With respect, I would suggest that if you can hold on to your original salary you’ll be doing bloody well!! As Cougar Leasing Limited, some aircrew who joined having paid for their own type rating, accommodation and all expenses while training and of course no salary until, for whatever reason the Flight Operations Manager thought of came to pass, the end of training, the end of line training, the end of the world?!! The reasoning tended to be, how can one put it... "fairly nebulous", found that within a few weeks of going "on salary" the flight operations manager decided that "at least" two First Officers would have their salaries cut in half, regretfully, this "plan" couldn’t be "implemented" as the Cougar Cowboys were always short crewed!! (can you guess why??) but that never stopped the Flight Operations Manager scuttling around as a Caudal. At various stages during the "Cougar success story" individual flight crew members had their salaries "adjusted"by "Da Management" in order that as PAYE workers they could "help out the company"! Needless to say "Da Management" never saw the same necessity for any adjustment to their own salaries or indeed any other aspect of their farcical and diabolical behaviour.
So, what are the chances of Globespan succeeding? I would most respectfully suggest that they are exactly the same as those of Excalibur? Or Gill Air? Or Cougar or any of the other assorted riff-raff outfits that "Da Management" have already "managed", straight into the nearest ditch!
One final point... do not rely on the Authority, the Legislator or the British Airways Pilots Association coming to your aid. When this company was called Cougar and it decided to "emigrate" up the road to Scotland, it was not "hampered" in the slightest by rules or legislation.
Run far and run fast my friend. Chalk it up to experience. You will not make the same mistake again!
Humans have the dexterity to think and consider and to put a value on themselves and their efforts. What a shame to waste such abilities.
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sad sad sad
TomCat111 no need to pick any brains. this airline is the worst airline i have worked for. i will soon leave when my next job starts (may..if i can wait that long)
I have tried to put up and hope all would change. I give up! so many things are wrong here and nobody seems to care
the yes men are slowly winning
i am only talking of 767 operation but i am sure the 737 would be the same.
Lots of jobs about look elseware.. because we all are. going to work now is a sad event
I have tried to put up and hope all would change. I give up! so many things are wrong here and nobody seems to care the yes men are slowly winning i am only talking of 767 operation but i am sure the 737 would be the same. Lots of jobs about look elseware.. because we all are. going to work now is a sad event
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Walter D.Ned,
Made for good reading, VERY interesting stuff, certainly made me think twice about submitting a CV.
Just wish the pilot fraternity would get a backbone and say "NO" to all these airlines which are now DEMANDING you have to pay for your type rating-If there were to be some kind of pilot revolt, the airlines would be forced to pay for training as in the past...
Most of us would be happy to be bonded, which in its self is a form of paying, but all these schemes at the moment are all aimed at getting as much money out of you as poossible-Someone somewhere is getting rich on the back of it, including the training organisations!
JUST SAY NO!!!!! (Wasn't that Zammo Maguire in Grange Hill back in the 80's?)
Made for good reading, VERY interesting stuff, certainly made me think twice about submitting a CV.
Just wish the pilot fraternity would get a backbone and say "NO" to all these airlines which are now DEMANDING you have to pay for your type rating-If there were to be some kind of pilot revolt, the airlines would be forced to pay for training as in the past...
Most of us would be happy to be bonded, which in its self is a form of paying, but all these schemes at the moment are all aimed at getting as much money out of you as poossible-Someone somewhere is getting rich on the back of it, including the training organisations!
JUST SAY NO!!!!! (Wasn't that Zammo Maguire in Grange Hill back in the 80's?)
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roster!!!
anyone know the legal requirment for issue of roster!! again no roster = no plan for next month = family problems again. why can this company get away mit this