BA Shorthaul Lifestyle

[Gulpers]

Hi
I'm looking for as much info as I can get on the lifestyle, conditions, rosters etc for BA shorthaul (B737 or A320 fleets) and would really appreciate anybody in the know sharing their experience.
I'm not interested in longhaul - neither the job nor the lifestyle appeal. I figure that a wife should be someone you actually WANT to spend time with!!
I've checked the BA website, PPJN and will look at BALPA, so have soaked up info there, but horse's mouth is always best..... I've also used 'search' option on PPRUNE and garnered as much info as I can there (I think!)
I'm rated on both B737 and 'bus, so I'd be going for DEP, if I apply.

Many thanks in advance,

G

[pilotatlast]

If you want to spend time with your wife then shorthaul out of LHR will be no good! Longhaul will give you a better lifestyle and you'll get to see your wife more. Shorthaul out of LGW is a different matter as they use a different rostering system meaning you can be home more as a junior.

[Gulpers]

Pilotlatlast
Info appreciated, but could you expand on the whys and wherefors of your last post, please?

I have looked into longhaul (and BA especially) but it really doesn't suit / appeal, which is why I'm interested in the shorthaul element.

Any info would be much appreciated.

Thanks

G

[5150]

You'll more than likely end up doing 900 hours a year - so you're there with the LoCo's.

You'll come home every night (to your lovely wife!) with a LoCo job.

[ETOPS]

Gulpers

The point that pilotatlast was trying to make was that you have the wrong preconceived ideas about time off as a junior F/O in BA. In shorthaul the work patterns will have you away from home most weekends - does your (presumably ) lovely wife work during the week? If so, you may go weeks without seeing her! At least on longhaul you will get MBTR of two or three days guaranteed off between trips. Remember, seniority in BA means everything and you will be junior for years as there are 3300 others ahead of you and the retirement bulge ends soon............

[Da Dog]

I spend 15 days a month at home on longhaul, managed 11 on shorthaul, and most of that was spend nackered, washing and ironing.

[Gulpers]

ETPOS / 5150

Thanks for the info. Maybe I did get the wrong end of Pilotlast's stick, but that's what I'm trying to find out Longhaul doesn't appeal because of the flying type and lifestyle, but I don't know enough about shorthaul to compare.... I'm trying not to have any preconceived anything right now!

What are the work and roster patterns like on BA shorthaul? Is the roster stability as good as I've heard? I understand that seniority is king in BA, but how long (as far as can be said) is it until a new shorthaul F/O is senior enough to bid and get what he wants (at least enough to not work every weekend)? Time away is one thing - nowadays it seems often to be part of the job - and I get that; but how much time away? Where? Doing what? What are the benefits that (hopefully) balance up this?

Once again, thanks for the info - it's appreciated. Just after as much as I can get in order to make a decision with as many facts as I can.

Cheers

G

PS ETOPS, presumably = undoubtedly!

[Gulpers]

Da Dog
May I ask what type you were flying shorthaul? What rotations did you work? Is there a difference between the 73' fleet and the 'bus fleet? LHR and LGW work environment?

Cheers
G

[Dozza2k]

hi,

I am a very junior airbus f/o. I manage about 12 clear days off a month. roughly 3/4 days off at beginning and end of each month, working 5/6 day blocks during the month. These are all 2/3/4 day tours, usually earlies. The sixth day is a shocker! I have one day trip this month, one next month.
hope this helps.
d2k

edited to add:
weekends? No. I have one clear weekend off in this/next month (which i actually bid for - couldn't believe it) Mostly its not a full weekend away, but a tour ending on sat, or starting sunday etc.

[Da Dog]

737 at LGW, in the summer you will work your nuts of , lots of tours and 4 sector day trips. The days either start really early or finish really late .11 days off is a contractual minimum, except for Feb and its factored when you have leave. In the winter the pressure slackens................ but only a little and 12 days free of duty can be achived. At LGW they use CARMAN rostering which for junior trash means you do stand some chance of weekends off.

[Jelly Doughnut]

I'm on the 737 at LGW, 15 months with BA now, and Da Dog is right. Manage on average 2 weekends off every month. Unless you forget to bid (like me in February )

Tours vary from 2-6 days and I like the variety they offer, also you earn more £££ doing tours.

[Finger Bob]

I used to work at Gatwick and keep in touch with those that do. Here are some details:

Flying Hours: Max 800hrs April to March (but may rise soon!)

Leave: 4 weeks per year rising to 6 weeks after approx 18 months.

Days Off: 11 days per month in blocks of 1, 2, 3, 4 or even 5. There is no set pattern.

Rostering: Preference system called “Carmen”. You express a preference for the type of flying you would like to do. The more senior you are the more likely you are to get the work you ask for: but still no guarantee! The rosters for say April are issued in the middle of March. Roster stability is very good.

The type of work on offer:

1. Tours of 2 to 6 days away. Typically 3 or 4 sectors a day. Some include a day free of duty in the middle so you get to explore your destination. Mostly you will have minimum rest on a night stop (ie. 12 hours).
2. Day Trips: 2 or 4 sectors. The short two sector days generally have horrendous start times of 4 or 5am eg. Amsterdam and back. Some of the 4 sector days are very long eg. Pristina and back then Manchester and back. Some are very inefficient ie. you spend 12 hours at work and only do 5 hours flying.
3. Night Flights. Eg. Bucharest: landing at 6am back at Gatwick.
4. Reserve: A block of up to 6 days which could be anything from Airport Standby to a 5 day tour. You find out the night before.

So, you may bid for day trips and weekends off but get given 5 day tours and Tuesday and Wednesday off. The more junior you are the more likely your preference will be ignored.

In summary, if you get day trips you will work similar hours to the low cost operators but with no fixed roster pattern. The difference is that you can express a preference to do tours instead. The other benefit is that you join the BA Seniority list with the option to go Long Haul and, shortly before you retire, get a command!

[Ropey Pilot]

Am also interested in s'haul lifestyle (but specifically the 'bus at LHR).

Could anyone there post something alsong the lines of Finger Bob's informative LGW post?)

(BTW our company has a fantastic duty of 12+ hours positioning and waiting for a single 35mins sector! So I wouldn't worry too much about BA inefficiency in flying 5 hours in the same time )

[Gulpers]

To All

Thanks for all the excellent info... I feel much more able to make an informed decision now.

Very much appreciated, and will keep looking if anyone wishes to add further!

G