Whats it like @ flybe?
Thread Starter
Whats it like @ flybe?
I have seen many diffrent posts here on pprune about the terms and conditions at flybe (lack of conditions on many of the posts)
I am currently flying ATR's and would like to move back to N.Ireland but I am unsure what the situation is like now at flybe.
Regarding 1: Recruitment
2: Time to command
3: Rough take home pay per month for new F/O
Any help would be great!
Thanks
SKY'S'4ME
I am currently flying ATR's and would like to move back to N.Ireland but I am unsure what the situation is like now at flybe.
Regarding 1: Recruitment
2: Time to command
3: Rough take home pay per month for new F/O
Any help would be great!
Thanks
SKY'S'4ME
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 849
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi there,
Flybe currently recruiting, and BHD one of the bases with vacancies, especially for new starters.
Not sure on current time to command, but given the number of leavers over the last 12 months, the seniority lists must have taken a tremendous beating and anyone with hours in the bag could probably move across inside 2 years.
Starting pay for newbies is a shade over £26K, so around £1600 take home. No money required for training costs, just a 3 year bond, although you do need to sign up to a training agreement with Barclays who will hound you to the grave if you leave.
Plenty of worse places to be.
Flybe currently recruiting, and BHD one of the bases with vacancies, especially for new starters.
Not sure on current time to command, but given the number of leavers over the last 12 months, the seniority lists must have taken a tremendous beating and anyone with hours in the bag could probably move across inside 2 years.
Starting pay for newbies is a shade over £26K, so around £1600 take home. No money required for training costs, just a 3 year bond, although you do need to sign up to a training agreement with Barclays who will hound you to the grave if you leave.
Plenty of worse places to be.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Leeds
Posts: 85
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm not sure what Flybe is like now but 6 months ago it was awful.
The management now have agreed that it is probably the worst airline to work for.
Just look at the indicators.
1) Ops director forced to retire.
2) 1/3 of the pilot workforce replaced this year alone.
3) Worst pay in the industry.
4) Dr Helen Muir employed on a 3 month contract to conduct a study into why pilots are leaving in their droves.
5) Worst Airline flying in UK airspace for Altitude busts. (4 in as many days last week)
6) Worst Airline WORLDWIDE for engine failures.
7) Average age of Crewing / Ops - 18 years! (chaos everyday)
8) 4 crews per aircraft. Not the recommended 4.65 industry standard.
9) 4 days leave taken away from pilots this year.
10) Lowest flight pay for a jet operator.
My advice is, only go to flybe as a last resort. Its a job and no more.
Good luck whatever you do.
The management now have agreed that it is probably the worst airline to work for.
Just look at the indicators.
1) Ops director forced to retire.
2) 1/3 of the pilot workforce replaced this year alone.
3) Worst pay in the industry.
4) Dr Helen Muir employed on a 3 month contract to conduct a study into why pilots are leaving in their droves.
5) Worst Airline flying in UK airspace for Altitude busts. (4 in as many days last week)
6) Worst Airline WORLDWIDE for engine failures.
7) Average age of Crewing / Ops - 18 years! (chaos everyday)
8) 4 crews per aircraft. Not the recommended 4.65 industry standard.
9) 4 days leave taken away from pilots this year.
10) Lowest flight pay for a jet operator.
My advice is, only go to flybe as a last resort. Its a job and no more.
Good luck whatever you do.
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Afghan caves
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Quote: The management now have agreed that it is probably the worst airline to work for.
I agree it does not sound too good. But then again there is BACX. Our management (bunch of suck heads) would never admit to the complete shambles that this company is in. I beleive that it could compete with Flybe for the 'Worst Airline' title. (If Flybe is as bad as you say). There is nothing worse than being bullied, and that is what I hate about this shower of S
T
I agree it does not sound too good. But then again there is BACX. Our management (bunch of suck heads) would never admit to the complete shambles that this company is in. I beleive that it could compete with Flybe for the 'Worst Airline' title. (If Flybe is as bad as you say). There is nothing worse than being bullied, and that is what I hate about this shower of S
T
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: uk
Posts: 361
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Flying Fiona
Why not add to your list
11) Colleagues who couldn't give a f**k about anyone else and will take far too many sickies each month just because they want a 'normal' social life
If you\'re a low-hour guy/gal fresh out of flying school, FlyBE is a reasonably good place to start and will allow you to get lots of flying hours rather quickly.
The crews are great (with the odd exception), and yes, the management suck, but if you really need a job, it\'s not all that bad. Pay is pretty poor, any loyalty you show to the company won\'t be rewarded, but you can guarantee a quick climb up the seniority list if the attrition rate stays like it has been!
Flying is good - when the a/c aren\'t tech, and you\'re allowed to hand fly as much as you want really.
Expect long days, starting on earlies and finishing on lates, silly 25min turn-rounds, not enough time to eat your dinner, crew food that is yuck and plenty of roster changes.
BUT - as much as I complained whilst I was there, and still chuckle at how messed up things are, I wouldn\'t swap the time I had there. Made some excellent friends, had a good laugh, and gained experience that you just can\'t get on a bus.
Why not add to your list
11) Colleagues who couldn't give a f**k about anyone else and will take far too many sickies each month just because they want a 'normal' social life
If you\'re a low-hour guy/gal fresh out of flying school, FlyBE is a reasonably good place to start and will allow you to get lots of flying hours rather quickly.
The crews are great (with the odd exception), and yes, the management suck, but if you really need a job, it\'s not all that bad. Pay is pretty poor, any loyalty you show to the company won\'t be rewarded, but you can guarantee a quick climb up the seniority list if the attrition rate stays like it has been!
Flying is good - when the a/c aren\'t tech, and you\'re allowed to hand fly as much as you want really.
Expect long days, starting on earlies and finishing on lates, silly 25min turn-rounds, not enough time to eat your dinner, crew food that is yuck and plenty of roster changes.
BUT - as much as I complained whilst I was there, and still chuckle at how messed up things are, I wouldn\'t swap the time I had there. Made some excellent friends, had a good laugh, and gained experience that you just can\'t get on a bus.
Join Date: May 2005
Location: u.k.
Posts: 88
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
FF i think that is a tad unfair representation of Flybe,yes of course thier are lots of issues that most definately need to be addressed,but we are not market leaders of the industry and never will be,i've been around and you can do a lot worse believe me....
If you want to work with a great bunch of people,its a great place to be,but leave your ego for career opportunities,shiny jets and £££s behind !!
If you want to work with a great bunch of people,its a great place to be,but leave your ego for career opportunities,shiny jets and £££s behind !!
Thread Starter
Thanks Guys+Girls,
As I have seen before there still seem to be a number if issues at flybe. However is it confident to say that this will bring natural change to the Airline in the comming year for the best?
The pay is slightly lower than I am on now but you can't have everything.
Keep the info comming (keep positive if you can)
Cheers
SK'S'4ME
As I have seen before there still seem to be a number if issues at flybe. However is it confident to say that this will bring natural change to the Airline in the comming year for the best?
The pay is slightly lower than I am on now but you can't have everything.
Keep the info comming (keep positive if you can)
Cheers
SK'S'4ME
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: United States
Posts: 1,051
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
FF
Just wondered if you had any verifiable data to support your claims of Most ALT Busts and Most Engine Failures ?
Not saying you are wrong ,in fact based on what i saw when i was there , you are probably correct . Wouldnt mind some more data though .
NF
Just wondered if you had any verifiable data to support your claims of Most ALT Busts and Most Engine Failures ?
Not saying you are wrong ,in fact based on what i saw when i was there , you are probably correct . Wouldnt mind some more data though .
NF
Join Date: May 2005
Location: u.k.
Posts: 88
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Rosters are returning to 6on2off after a bit of a debarcle with doil's,generally on the q400 you dont attain high hours like 146 fleet(100hrs/month/summer)but a lot of multi-sectors,nightstopping averages 5-6/month depending on where you are based and resignation rate!!
Really great team of crew always,and changes are being worked on to improve things,however,slowly!!
Really great team of crew always,and changes are being worked on to improve things,however,slowly!!
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 530
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Contrary to what Lucy states, hour building is determined more by base than fleet. For example - turboprop (SD360/F27/DHC8) pilots based in BHD are, and have been for many years, the biggest accumulators of hours in the Company.
As far as 6 on 2 off is concerned, this was a big factor in why so many have moved on in the last 18 months or so, but Uncle Mike refused to acknowledge this, choosing to blame the other airlines for recruiting so heavily. However, weekly duty periods are now based on a rolling roster, so 6 on 2 off is not really sustainable despite MW's previous misinformation, but if the Company does find a way to continue with it then they can only expect to lose more people - Dr Muir please take note. Who the hell is she by the way? I've not seen sight nor sound of her since this 'research' started.
er82 - FF doesn't work at Flybe these days, but is not far wide of the mark in some of the things he describes.
As far as the alt busts are concerned, the 400 is not the problem, it's finger trouble by inexperienced crews.
SKY's4ME - Everybody in the Company tries to stay positive everyday, but the Company beats it out of you everyday. The Employee Share Scheme, and the arrival of the new Embraers next year should be factors that appeal to all and help retention, but the Share Scheme was very badly administered, and you could confidently bet your last £ on the fact that selection and bonding for the Embraer will be equally shambolic. Having said that, it might not be the shambles it might have been if MW had stayed.
In summary, one should ONLY consider Flybe as a last resort.
As an aside, I wonder if MW has given up his entitlement to his shares now that he's gone, (as is the rule) - errrrrrr, not bloody likely! That's how mismanaged Flybe is.
As far as 6 on 2 off is concerned, this was a big factor in why so many have moved on in the last 18 months or so, but Uncle Mike refused to acknowledge this, choosing to blame the other airlines for recruiting so heavily. However, weekly duty periods are now based on a rolling roster, so 6 on 2 off is not really sustainable despite MW's previous misinformation, but if the Company does find a way to continue with it then they can only expect to lose more people - Dr Muir please take note. Who the hell is she by the way? I've not seen sight nor sound of her since this 'research' started.
er82 - FF doesn't work at Flybe these days, but is not far wide of the mark in some of the things he describes.
As far as the alt busts are concerned, the 400 is not the problem, it's finger trouble by inexperienced crews.
SKY's4ME - Everybody in the Company tries to stay positive everyday, but the Company beats it out of you everyday. The Employee Share Scheme, and the arrival of the new Embraers next year should be factors that appeal to all and help retention, but the Share Scheme was very badly administered, and you could confidently bet your last £ on the fact that selection and bonding for the Embraer will be equally shambolic. Having said that, it might not be the shambles it might have been if MW had stayed.
In summary, one should ONLY consider Flybe as a last resort.
As an aside, I wonder if MW has given up his entitlement to his shares now that he's gone, (as is the rule) - errrrrrr, not bloody likely! That's how mismanaged Flybe is.
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Well, this is cheaper than a Personal Title!
Posts: 135
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
SKY's4ME,
This post has the disturbing whiff of a management fishing trip about it
However, on the off chance that you really want to know:
Life at Flybe is pretty good. There are a lot of good people and you can usually have an enjoyable day's flying. True, there are issues to be addressed; in particular, roster stability, pay and career path (ie progression onto the jet fleet).
There appears to most of us to be no credible reason (other than simple economy) to pay crews on the Q400 fleet so much less than the jet heroes. Indeed, it is easily argued that from a professional point of view - in terms of its complexity and demands - the Q400 is simply an Airbus with propellors. It also generates far more revenue for the company. In fact SAS already has a single pay scale for pilots in recognition of this.
From a management point of view, the company is making the awkward transition from cottage industry to serious player. It is also, we are told, being prepared for sale/ flotation. That's a change that is never going to be made easily or without pain. It may also be that some different faces in key posts may be better-suited to manage the process. It will certainly mean some short- to medium-term upheaval for everyone. However, it also presents an opportunity to reshape our T's & C's for the future if we all approach the problem constructively.
As far as I am aware, the northern bases (BHD, EDI & GLA) are the ones where there is a continuing need to recruit, although with 10 more Q400's coming next year it's not going to be a static situation. Those aircraft have to go somewhere and they'll need to be crewed. Norwich is planned to be quite a large base, quite quickly (from Spring '06). As to promotion - very much a moveable feast: minimum time (off the top of my head) is 2500 TT with 500 on type/ in the company. Exceptionally, 2000 TT but the number in each base at this level is limited by regulation.
As for Flying Fiona's attempts at 'help'; disregard them entirely. He has obvious issues of resentment and bitterness for reasons unknown. He certainly doesn't work for us and most of what he says appears to be founded on malicious fabrication:
- If the FOD was 'forced to resign', it was by personal circumstance, not the company.
- '.. average age of ops/ crewing ...' pure make believe. TOSH! Yes they may have improvements to make, so let them get on with it.
- '... one third of the pilot workforce replaced...' - complete rubbish. That would be 112 people!! Balls!
- Dr Helen Muir conducting a study.... A professional in her field form Cranfield Uni. Err... that's a good thing, isn't it?
- '... worst pay in the industry ...', No it ain't. wrong again. '... lowest flight pay ...' , Don't know. If it is, argue constructively for an improvement or leave if the last 50p is that important to you.
If you want to fly a smart, efficient piece of kit from a local base with pretty well no night stops, Flybe could serve you alot worse. Thankfully, it still also retains some of the family atmosphere from a few years ago, too. Strangely enough, and I can see why FF would have a problem here, if you treat people right they tend to reciprocate. Those with an axe to grind usually form the most vocal minority, but I and many others will not be looking elsewhere. The grass is most certainly no greener.
Good luck.
This post has the disturbing whiff of a management fishing trip about it
However, on the off chance that you really want to know:
Life at Flybe is pretty good. There are a lot of good people and you can usually have an enjoyable day's flying. True, there are issues to be addressed; in particular, roster stability, pay and career path (ie progression onto the jet fleet).
There appears to most of us to be no credible reason (other than simple economy) to pay crews on the Q400 fleet so much less than the jet heroes. Indeed, it is easily argued that from a professional point of view - in terms of its complexity and demands - the Q400 is simply an Airbus with propellors. It also generates far more revenue for the company. In fact SAS already has a single pay scale for pilots in recognition of this.
From a management point of view, the company is making the awkward transition from cottage industry to serious player. It is also, we are told, being prepared for sale/ flotation. That's a change that is never going to be made easily or without pain. It may also be that some different faces in key posts may be better-suited to manage the process. It will certainly mean some short- to medium-term upheaval for everyone. However, it also presents an opportunity to reshape our T's & C's for the future if we all approach the problem constructively.
As far as I am aware, the northern bases (BHD, EDI & GLA) are the ones where there is a continuing need to recruit, although with 10 more Q400's coming next year it's not going to be a static situation. Those aircraft have to go somewhere and they'll need to be crewed. Norwich is planned to be quite a large base, quite quickly (from Spring '06). As to promotion - very much a moveable feast: minimum time (off the top of my head) is 2500 TT with 500 on type/ in the company. Exceptionally, 2000 TT but the number in each base at this level is limited by regulation.
As for Flying Fiona's attempts at 'help'; disregard them entirely. He has obvious issues of resentment and bitterness for reasons unknown. He certainly doesn't work for us and most of what he says appears to be founded on malicious fabrication:
- If the FOD was 'forced to resign', it was by personal circumstance, not the company.
- '.. average age of ops/ crewing ...' pure make believe. TOSH! Yes they may have improvements to make, so let them get on with it.
- '... one third of the pilot workforce replaced...' - complete rubbish. That would be 112 people!! Balls!
- Dr Helen Muir conducting a study.... A professional in her field form Cranfield Uni. Err... that's a good thing, isn't it?
- '... worst pay in the industry ...', No it ain't. wrong again. '... lowest flight pay ...' , Don't know. If it is, argue constructively for an improvement or leave if the last 50p is that important to you.
If you want to fly a smart, efficient piece of kit from a local base with pretty well no night stops, Flybe could serve you alot worse. Thankfully, it still also retains some of the family atmosphere from a few years ago, too. Strangely enough, and I can see why FF would have a problem here, if you treat people right they tend to reciprocate. Those with an axe to grind usually form the most vocal minority, but I and many others will not be looking elsewhere. The grass is most certainly no greener.
Good luck.
Thread Starter
Thanks Guys I am sorry to say fokker I am not fishing for anything else but info to help me make a decision. The problem is would it be a good decision to move? Thanks to your posts I am now getting a clearer picture.
I would like to move and have decided that spring time next year would be good for me depending on the recruitment situation at this time of year which might be slow.
Flying sounds as enjoyable as what I am doing now but I reckon the most important reason for me is being based out of BHD.
Also how many hours will an F/O accumulate out of BHD
Thanks so far
SKY\'S\'4ME
I would like to move and have decided that spring time next year would be good for me depending on the recruitment situation at this time of year which might be slow.
Flying sounds as enjoyable as what I am doing now but I reckon the most important reason for me is being based out of BHD.
Also how many hours will an F/O accumulate out of BHD
Thanks so far
SKY\'S\'4ME
Last edited by SKY's4ME; 9th Nov 2005 at 10:10.
Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Well, this is cheaper than a Personal Title!
Posts: 135
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If being Belfast based is your most important criterion (and FWIW I think you're very sensible to put home life first) surely there's no decision to make? BHD is also the happiest 'family-est' base that I've experienced on the network, as it happens. A good bunch, IMHO. There are some lovely parts of NI and property is cheaper than the mainland. Don't take your GB registered car, though if you're staying - you'll never get an MOT!! (honest).
Don't hang around,though: the recruiting boom can't last forever and, with 3 months' notice, it'll be spring before you can say "Whoops, crewing have shafted me again!".
Do it.
Don't hang around,though: the recruiting boom can't last forever and, with 3 months' notice, it'll be spring before you can say "Whoops, crewing have shafted me again!".
Do it.
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Down a Tin mine......
Posts: 438
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Once again Flying Fiona - you are talking complete and utter B******* let me correct on a few of your as usual INCORRECT statment's.
1 - the flt op's director WAS NOT forced to leave - he has taken early retirement due to his wife being extreamly ill and he want's to spend as much time with her as he can !!
2 - The average in Op's and Crewing is NOT as you state 18 - it is closer to 25-30 with some older than that - and you can not ask for a finer bunch of people to work with than them - especially when complete and utter Asses like you think i cant be bothered to go into work today as thewy cant cope with the job they do.
Remember it is them that have to sort out the mess as a consequence of YOUR actions in order to get all of our passenger's flown to where they want to be.
To anyone considering Joining Flybe - i reccomend totally ignoring anything Flying Fiona writes as this person writes total and utter tosh.
Yes you will work hard if you join Flybe - but that is the nature of the lo-cost airline industry, you will find the same if you were to join easy,ryanair,jet2 or thompsonfly.
I have worked for the company for the last 6 years (5 1/2 of them in Op's - so i know what go's on in there FF !! ) the last 6 month's i have transferred to the flying side flying the Dash8 and have enjoyed every minute of it - but as i said it is hard work !!
ER82 or should i say Miss Whiplash - how's it going ?? how's the 320 ??
brgds
W.G
1 - the flt op's director WAS NOT forced to leave - he has taken early retirement due to his wife being extreamly ill and he want's to spend as much time with her as he can !!
2 - The average in Op's and Crewing is NOT as you state 18 - it is closer to 25-30 with some older than that - and you can not ask for a finer bunch of people to work with than them - especially when complete and utter Asses like you think i cant be bothered to go into work today as thewy cant cope with the job they do.
Remember it is them that have to sort out the mess as a consequence of YOUR actions in order to get all of our passenger's flown to where they want to be.
To anyone considering Joining Flybe - i reccomend totally ignoring anything Flying Fiona writes as this person writes total and utter tosh.
Yes you will work hard if you join Flybe - but that is the nature of the lo-cost airline industry, you will find the same if you were to join easy,ryanair,jet2 or thompsonfly.
I have worked for the company for the last 6 years (5 1/2 of them in Op's - so i know what go's on in there FF !! ) the last 6 month's i have transferred to the flying side flying the Dash8 and have enjoyed every minute of it - but as i said it is hard work !!
ER82 or should i say Miss Whiplash - how's it going ?? how's the 320 ??
brgds
W.G
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: The Land Downunder
Posts: 765
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I worked at flybe for a little over two years and would like to add my comments to those of ER82. I worked hard the whole time that I was at Flybe and suffered a lot of disruption on a weekly basis. BUT I enjoyed every moment of it, built loads of hours and met some very cool people. I don't regret a second of it, it was great experience on a very nice aircraft and enabled me to move up the food chain quickly. If you have the chance to work there straight out of flight school or after instructing then you could do a lot worse.
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: DEVON
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dear all,
Despite what Flying fiona and others say Flybe is OK to work for. Yes they are having problems at the moment (like all low cost airlines) but I am sure they will overcome them with time.
The problem with this site is that people who used to work for flybe and now left or been asked to leave (FF how's the RHS at Monarch?) have nothing better to do than to slag off what is actually a fairly nice company to work for. Salaries and conditions are not by any means top of the scale, but the flying and more importantly the lifestyle is better than most other operators.
If anyone's got any specific questions on Flybe then please send me a private message. I will reply as soon as I get the appropriate answers.
Despite what Flying fiona and others say Flybe is OK to work for. Yes they are having problems at the moment (like all low cost airlines) but I am sure they will overcome them with time.
The problem with this site is that people who used to work for flybe and now left or been asked to leave (FF how's the RHS at Monarch?) have nothing better to do than to slag off what is actually a fairly nice company to work for. Salaries and conditions are not by any means top of the scale, but the flying and more importantly the lifestyle is better than most other operators.
If anyone's got any specific questions on Flybe then please send me a private message. I will reply as soon as I get the appropriate answers.