20 Degree AoB: A Shallow Or Medium Turn?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
20 Degree AoB: A Shallow Or Medium Turn?
According to the FAA Flying Handbook, a 20 degree angle of bank qualifies as both a Shallow and Medium turn (0-20 & 20-45 respectively), yet Shallow turns require continuous aileron inputs and Medium turns require neutral aileron.
Which designation is correct (or most correct) - Shallow or Medium?
Which designation is correct (or most correct) - Shallow or Medium?
Doesn't really matter much, but personally I'd count it as shallow, medium around 30-45, and steep at 45+
Use of aileron is largely type specific, not bank angle specific. Don't read much into that - it's an attempt to standardise something that probably shouldn't be standardised.
G
Use of aileron is largely type specific, not bank angle specific. Don't read much into that - it's an attempt to standardise something that probably shouldn't be standardised.
G
But a bald statement that "Medium turns require neutral aileron" is nonsense, or a misunderstood over-simplification. 🫤
Last edited by Abbey Road; 27th Jun 2023 at 12:22.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Las Vegas, NV
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: north of Harlow and south of Cambridge
Posts: 108
Likes: 0
Received 3 Likes
on
3 Posts
Still..
Aidan, Abbey Road's statement still stands.
perhaps you are relatively new to "the game"?
The FAA Handbook is a good starting point, and necessary for the written exams, and their test questions but nothing is that cut and dry in the actual execution of aviation.
perhaps you are relatively new to "the game"?
The FAA Handbook is a good starting point, and necessary for the written exams, and their test questions but nothing is that cut and dry in the actual execution of aviation.
Avoid imitations
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 14,576
Received 425 Likes
on
224 Posts
In the Royal Air Force, instructing at the ab-intio level on the Bulldog T1 aircraft, 30° angle of bank was considered 'medium', or perhaps the lower end of medium. I would certainly consider 20° AoB as shallow.
In all the aircraft I have flown the ailerons are a roll rate controller not a bank angle controller. Why would a descriptor of magnitude of bank angle be associated with aileron deflection? Is this an attempt to describe overbanking tendency?
Who even thinks about this except to answer silly test questions? Just apply the control pressures that are required to make the aicraft do what you want it to do.
Who even thinks about this except to answer silly test questions? Just apply the control pressures that are required to make the aicraft do what you want it to do.
Avoid imitations
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 14,576
Received 425 Likes
on
224 Posts
An aircraft that is very stable may still need a little aileron to hold it into a turn.
A search of the "Airplane Flying Handbook" for "overbanking" supports the notion that, for the purposes of this handbook, FAA considers steady state aileron deflection to be what defines the "steepness" of a turn.
A shallow bank turn is one that requires continuous aileron into turn
A medium bank turn is one that requires zero aileron deflection
and a steep turn is one that requires aileron out of turn.
The bank angle ranges associated with these definitions seem somewhat arbitrary.
A search for ""medium bank" finds several references that qualify "medium-bank" as "approximately 20 degrees" so that would seem to answer the OP's question.
Personally, I think shallow, medium, and steep depend on the aircraft, pilot experience and, perhaps most importantly, the comfort level of any passengers.
A shallow bank turn is one that requires continuous aileron into turn
A medium bank turn is one that requires zero aileron deflection
and a steep turn is one that requires aileron out of turn.
The bank angle ranges associated with these definitions seem somewhat arbitrary.
A search for ""medium bank" finds several references that qualify "medium-bank" as "approximately 20 degrees" so that would seem to answer the OP's question.
Personally, I think shallow, medium, and steep depend on the aircraft, pilot experience and, perhaps most importantly, the comfort level of any passengers.
Last edited by EXDAC; 28th Jun 2023 at 20:17.
