Bird strike before 80kt on Boeing plane
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Bird strike before 80kt on Boeing plane
FCTM and company POM only mention ops procedure after 80kt &before V1.
What is your two cents and best practice before 80kt when you hit bird on takeoff roll?
What is your two cents and best practice before 80kt when you hit bird on takeoff roll?
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1. What did you do?
or, if this is a hypothetical
2. What do you think that you should do?
or, if this is a hypothetical
2. What do you think that you should do?
https://skybrary.aero/sites/default/...shelf/1150.pdf
In
https://skybrary.aero/articles/faa-t...y-training-aid
'The need to be GO minded in the high speed portion of the takeoff'; each manufacturer, aircraft type, operator, should publish the demarcation speed as being 'high speed'.
Less than this speed - stop.
Some might justly argue that a bird strike at high speed warrants a stop - but that's a judgement call.
Is the industry now so engrained with SOPs that if a situation is not associated with a procedure then pilots may not act; I hope not.
There is still a lot of common sense out there; don't inhibit it.
In
https://skybrary.aero/articles/faa-t...y-training-aid
'The need to be GO minded in the high speed portion of the takeoff'; each manufacturer, aircraft type, operator, should publish the demarcation speed as being 'high speed'.
Less than this speed - stop.
Some might justly argue that a bird strike at high speed warrants a stop - but that's a judgement call.
Is the industry now so engrained with SOPs that if a situation is not associated with a procedure then pilots may not act; I hope not.
There is still a lot of common sense out there; don't inhibit it.
Very strange for your company, as the RTO maneuver is clearly explained in the QRH under the maneuvers.
In general: cautions (amber) & warnings (red) warrant a stop before 80kts. Between 80Kts and V1 only warnings dictate a stop. But for more specific details, refer to QRH.
Bird strike is not a high speed RTO unless there is a clear "warning" associated with it (ie resulting in fire or fire warning, engine failure or airplance considered unsafe to fly).
In general: cautions (amber) & warnings (red) warrant a stop before 80kts. Between 80Kts and V1 only warnings dictate a stop. But for more specific details, refer to QRH.
Bird strike is not a high speed RTO unless there is a clear "warning" associated with it (ie resulting in fire or fire warning, engine failure or airplance considered unsafe to fly).
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Being go minded is to avoid complications high speed reject due to improper execution or brakes conditions, false fire warning etc but a shade beyond 80kts long way to V1 so reject is safer option. A330 unreliable speed incident the speed check in A330 is at 100kts which is where high speed regime also starts so they continued got airborne and made a meal of the procedure. They were better of rejecting a shade beyond 100kts which much less complicated then UAS procedure.
Hindsight, uncertainty, assumptions
One aspect of the industry's safety plans is that pilots will act as they perceive the situation; thus 'improper use' (brakes) should not be considered in a safety argument. (SOP stop is STOP)
'False fire-warning, etc, can only be determined after the event; during takeoff any warning or alert must be acted on as true. Similarly unreliable speed; all that might be determined at the time is a difference - thus procedure, guidance.
'A shade beyond …' this is also unknowable at the time of the event, because the speed is 'unreliable'; a shade nearer to V1.
Recognise, accept, that there is uncertainty in all operations, outmanoeuvre this where possible - SOPs, but do not attempt to apply certainty before the event (assumptions in this discussion) as this might bias judgement in 'real' events.
'False fire-warning, etc, can only be determined after the event; during takeoff any warning or alert must be acted on as true. Similarly unreliable speed; all that might be determined at the time is a difference - thus procedure, guidance.
'A shade beyond …' this is also unknowable at the time of the event, because the speed is 'unreliable'; a shade nearer to V1.
Recognise, accept, that there is uncertainty in all operations, outmanoeuvre this where possible - SOPs, but do not attempt to apply certainty before the event (assumptions in this discussion) as this might bias judgement in 'real' events.
We categorized any abort prior to 80 knots as a 'low speed abort'. A low speed abort was considered pretty much a nothing event - I don't think the safety people even tracked low speed aborts.
It's only above 80 knots that things really start to get interesting - before 80 knots, it's considered OK to abort if you even suspect something is not right.
I used to see regular reports of low speed aborts due to 'uneven' engine acceleration - it was rare that anything was actually wrong - most of the time it was something as simple as not having both/all throttles at idle prior to pushing for takeoff. The engine(s) not at idle got a bit of a head start and would accel more rapidly - resulting in the abort.
It's only above 80 knots that things really start to get interesting - before 80 knots, it's considered OK to abort if you even suspect something is not right.
I used to see regular reports of low speed aborts due to 'uneven' engine acceleration - it was rare that anything was actually wrong - most of the time it was something as simple as not having both/all throttles at idle prior to pushing for takeoff. The engine(s) not at idle got a bit of a head start and would accel more rapidly - resulting in the abort.
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May depend on the airport...
Birdstrike before 80 kts: there's a good chance you saw the approximate location of the impact. if there are no indications of damage, and you are at a remote airport with no mx, perhaps keep going. You have some time to monitor before making a firm decision. No abnormal indications, I'd continue the TO. If there are some abnormal indications, deal with them then.
If you are departing a mx base, perhaps stop and get it dealt with there, especially if you are flying to a remote apt without mx.
Your airline should clarify what they would want you to do in a case like that. The airline i flew with wanted us to deal with the issue there, at a mx base, rather than take it down route to anywhere else. Ask them directly to clarify.
If you are departing a mx base, perhaps stop and get it dealt with there, especially if you are flying to a remote apt without mx.
Your airline should clarify what they would want you to do in a case like that. The airline i flew with wanted us to deal with the issue there, at a mx base, rather than take it down route to anywhere else. Ask them directly to clarify.
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I had a birdstrike right at 100 knots on an empty 747-200 once, in Dhaka, Bangladesh:
Out of the left corner of my eyes I saw a huge bird, the size of a Piper Cherokee, at low speed and low altitude trying to cross the runway in front of the plane, he went under the nose of the plane and I thought we missed him, or her. Then wham, bang and the airplane shook.
We aborted without needing max brakes or max reverse, nice and calm like a walk in the park: Light weight, low speeds, dry and long runway.
We turned off at the next exit, told ATC and asked to hold on the taxiway, then shut down 3 and 4 and sent the inflight mechanic down on the ground to take a look. The bird had impacted the #3 fan and bent several blades out of shape.
Long story short, we spent a day or two at a local hotel, then did a 3-engine ferry flight to Jeddah where new fan blades were waiting for us.
(At this airline every crew was qualified and current for 3 engine ferry, no need to send in the experts)
Probably 1996 as I was a fresh faced and very junior Captain, which is why I was flying a Saudi Hadj to Dhaka in the first place.
Out of the left corner of my eyes I saw a huge bird, the size of a Piper Cherokee, at low speed and low altitude trying to cross the runway in front of the plane, he went under the nose of the plane and I thought we missed him, or her. Then wham, bang and the airplane shook.
We aborted without needing max brakes or max reverse, nice and calm like a walk in the park: Light weight, low speeds, dry and long runway.
We turned off at the next exit, told ATC and asked to hold on the taxiway, then shut down 3 and 4 and sent the inflight mechanic down on the ground to take a look. The bird had impacted the #3 fan and bent several blades out of shape.
Long story short, we spent a day or two at a local hotel, then did a 3-engine ferry flight to Jeddah where new fan blades were waiting for us.
(At this airline every crew was qualified and current for 3 engine ferry, no need to send in the experts)
Probably 1996 as I was a fresh faced and very junior Captain, which is why I was flying a Saudi Hadj to Dhaka in the first place.
