B737 Takeoff with VNAV and LNAV disarmed

[tae9141]

Hellow everyone, I am currently undergoing B737 and I got question to ask.

Let us say you were instructed to takeoff and fly runway heading soon after departure,
when you hit TOGA, does HDG SEL automatically selected and shows up on FMA or is it after departure ?

James

[gegemi]

yes. At least on the NG.

[FlyingStone]

It depends on the aircraft, as this is customer option.

It is either HDG SEL for takeoff, which means that as soon as you hit TOGA, you will get HDG SEL on the FMA, or it is wings level in which case the roll FMA will be blank.

[Banana Joe]

Customer options. Ours engage HDG SEL, but there is an airframe or two in the fleet that don't.

[Bergerie1]

As a very old fossil, why don't you just fly the aeroplane?

[733driver]

Originally Posted by Bergerie1

As a very old fossil, why don't you just fly the aeroplane?

One can do that and at the same time want to understand how the automation behaves i.e. what to expect from it.

[ImbracableCrunk]

Originally Posted by Small cog

If one is doing a course on the 737, why not ask your instructor?

1. Why have this forum if not to ask questions?
2. There are also instructors here.

[Aoyb]

As mentioned it depends. Certainly on the classics and on some NGs the HDG SEL will become active on the FMA at 400’

Until then the roll mode will be blank and FD bars will command wings level

[Jumbo744]

Originally Posted by Bergerie1

As a very old fossil, why don't you just fly the aeroplane?

Take it easy hero. It has nothing to do with flying the plane. The guy is asking a question about how the automation works on takeoff.

[Derfred]

Originally Posted by Bergerie1

As a very old fossil, why don't you just fly the aeroplane?

I have a lot of respect for a pilot who is capable of “just flying the aeroplane” when required.

But I have no respect for a pilot who chooses to “just fly the aeroplane” because he actually doesn’t know or understand his aeroplane.

Chuck Yeager apparently would never fly an aircraft until he knew the flight manual by heart and could find every switch blindfolded.

We’d all be wise to fully understand our aircraft systems before we get airborne and be forced to exercise our superior handling skills in an attempt to cover for our lack of study and knowledge.

[Sig229]

At my company all aircraft will stay in TOGA until a lateral/vertical mode is selected. For vector departures we set the heading and call for Heading Select at 400AGL or the charted turn altitude if higher.

[Tomaski]

Wait.... what?? You can actually takeoff with the LNAV and VNAV disarmed?!

Next thing you'll be telling me is that we can fly this thing without Flight Directors!

[Centaurus]

Flight Director addiction, like tobacco addiction, is a real health hazard.

I say that, having operated with one simulator instructor who screams at his students to "follow the bloody flight director" even though the aircraft is in a gross unusual attitude 30 degrees nose down in a spiral dive.

[anson harris]

Originally Posted by Bergerie1

As a very old fossil, why don't you just fly the aeroplane?

Bingo! What do I win?

[jmmoric]

Originally Posted by Bergerie1

As a very old fossil, why don't you just fly the aeroplane?

Old fossils are overrepresented in stall or spin during departure/landings

I've read e few reports where they don't use the ASI, but go by their "instincts" getting older.

[misd-agin]

Originally Posted by ImbracableCrunk

1. Why have this forum if not to ask questions?
2. There are also instructors here.

The instructors at his company will know what options their fleet has. As others have stated "it depends upon which options your company has for their aircraft."

[misd-agin]

Originally Posted by Derfred

I have a lot of respect for a pilot who is capable of “just flying the aeroplane” when required.

But I have no respect for a pilot who chooses to “just fly the aeroplane” because he actually doesn’t know or understand his aeroplane.

Chuck Yeager apparently would never fly an aircraft until he knew the flight manual by heart and could find every switch blindfolded.

We’d all be wise to fully understand our aircraft systems before we get airborne and be forced to exercise our superior handling skills in an attempt to cover for our lack of study and knowledge.

He'd never get airborne in a modern airliner. The manuals are much longer than the manuals of earlier eras. The P-51 flight manual was 78 pages. Switches? In a modern airliner? He can't reach about 1/4 of them.

[Tomaski]

Originally Posted by jmmoric

Old fossils are overrepresented in stall or spin during departure/landings

I've read e few reports where they don't use the ASI, but go by their "instincts" getting older.

Speaking as an old fossil, relying on the airspeed indicator without reference to the attitude and power settings is simply asking for trouble. I can think of quite a few accidents that resulted from chasing airspeed as opposed to setting appropriate pitch and power.

In my "old school" instrument training parlance, attitude and power are "control" instruments. Airspeed, altitude, heading, etc are "performance" instrument. You set the "control" instruments to the desired positions and then cross-check the "performance" instruments to see if you are getting the desired response. If something is out of whack, then you would first cross-check your attitude and power indicators and, if deemed reliable, continue to fly them and then determine if something is wrong with one of your performance indicators. This is a lesson that is easily forgotten in the age of modern airliners. Sadly, there are many pilots who don't get much beyond following the flight director commands, a method that probably works 98% of the time. It's that other 2% that will get you in trouble.......

[Centaurus]

The P-51 flight manual was 78 pages.

You were spoilt. The Pilots Notes Mustang RAAF Publication Mo. 780 dated September 1950 issued to this scribe, only had 50 pages. RAF Dakota Pilots Notes only had 45 pages, while RAF Pilots Notes for the Lincoln (four Rolls Royce Merlins) in 1950 had 54 pages

[reverserunlocked]

My understanding is the RYR don’t use VNAV for departure, cleaning up they flaps first before selecting it.