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Filming in commercial flightdecks

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Filming in commercial flightdecks

Old 18th Jun 2018, 23:11
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Filming in commercial flightdecks

What are people’s opinions on professional pilots filming themselves flying a take off or landing and putting it on social media?

The bit that makes me think “mmmmmm, not sure about this”, is that they’ve probably attached a GoPro mount somewhere to capture this, and it’s not going to be an approved mod.

I recently saw a Go Pro mount fixed to the wing and landing gear of a PA28, but that’s another story all together.
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 02:19
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Most companies now have a "social media" policy that bans the placement of cockpit video. Those that can still post appear to be in the minority. To add weight to the argument, there was a notorious prosecution in Australia of a helicopter pilot based on his passenger's video placed on social media. The travesty was the abysmal interpretation of the "evidence" by the authorities where the supposed expert evidence was entirely lacking any expertise.
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 06:53
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Filming by anyone (cabin crew or pilot) from the Flight Deck below FL200 is a “no no” where I am..except if it is done by one of a group of company approved pilots...(who are supposed to have presented a safety case prior to approval.

It’s a relatively new and controversial policy, and TBH looking at the content of some of the approved stuff going out onto social media I’m not sure some of it does us any favours..
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 10:32
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I've filmed a couple of interesting / scenic approaches for my family to watch but wouldn't have dreamed have putting them on YouTube etc. GoPro mount suckered to the side window of an A320. I did email GoPro first to ask how their mount responded to pressure changes, and they admitted they'd not tried it inside an Airbus, they did say that they'd stuck one on the outside without a problem...

If someone is filming themselves instead of the view I'd be raising my eyebrows.

Thought it was quite beneficial because in one of my videos you could see my hand furiously stirring the sidestick, which stopped pretty much straight away once I'd seen it!
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 12:50
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Well, it's like getting J. Lawrence laid and not having a pic, then it didn't happen. They have to show what they used their money for...
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 14:40
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At my old airline, it was a no-no, unless you were one of the chosen few...

But, to be honest, some of the chosen few leave a lot to be desired.
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 16:37
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There are two sides to this.

Is using a go-pro in the FD on a suction mount a legal problem? Most likely not. And as long as you don't use wifi remote to trigger it, Airbus have no issues.

As for putting it on social media, well maybe as we age and look down despairingly over our reading glasses as the spiky haired tech attached youth, we need to acknowledge that there is a generation gap.

I have many hours of GoPro footage from landings in some interesting parts on the planet, that are on a locked private Vimeo account. Access is family only - or others on request (which has included Airbus!) .
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 18:15
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you might want to read this -

A bored RAF pilot flying nearly 200 service personnel to Afghanistan sent his passenger jet into a nosedive when a camera he had been playing with jammed the flight controls


A Royal Air Force pilot has been cleared of perjury – but will be sentenced at court martial today after admitting he allowed his digital camera to jam his military airliner’s controls, sending it into a 4,000ft plummet.

Flight Lieutenant Andrew Townshend was taking photos while flying an Airbus A330 Voyager from RAF Brize Norton to Afghanistan in 2014. The court martial heard he put his Nikon DSLR down between the armrest of his captain’s chair and the airliner’s main control stick, mounted on the side of the cockpit.

https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/0...irbus_plummet/

It's on PPRuNe somewhere. I'm sure it can be found easily enough. Injuries and I suspect quite a broken aeroplane but I can't recall about the latter.

Inquiry
https://www.gov.uk/government/public...-february-2014

Voyager Plummets (Merged)

Last edited by jimjim1; 19th Jun 2018 at 18:39.
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 23:10
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I’m not sure of the relevance of a DSLR not in use to the argument about a GoPro mounted out of the way?
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Old 19th Jun 2018, 23:28
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Without having a dog in either fight - I would say that if pilots are happy to introduce their own cameras into the cockpit, it is going to weaken their argument (if any) against the airlines or regulators introducing cameras into the cockpit.
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Old 20th Jun 2018, 04:06
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Well it's one thing to put it on a suction cup, a whole different one placing anything by the sidestick...

I'll admit to having taped myself taking off or landing at unusual places, but never I have posted them online (not since I'm at a large carrier anyway, did posted a few when flying the DHC-6 some years ago though).

I think it's okay since you don't post the videos (publicly) and don't fiddle with the thing in critical phases. Turn it on and off well in advance...
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Old 20th Jun 2018, 06:52
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Originally Posted by compressor stall View Post
I’m not sure of the relevance of a DSLR not in use to the argument about a GoPro mounted out of the way?

FWIW it does become of relevance if the company decides to introduce a filming policy and then uses said incident as a reason for restricting it to select individuals only/safety case.

I also think PIF makes a valid point=>..”at the subsequent board of inquiry GoPro footage showed”.....”
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Old 20th Jun 2018, 13:42
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I have no problems with movies or pictures being taken, but like some other “movies” and portraiture taken by individuals, they should be for private consumption. Publishing them on the web opens you, your colleagues and your company to all sorts of unnecessary scrunity that you will be better off without.

PM
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Old 20th Jun 2018, 14:20
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You mean the ubiquitous 737/A320 pilots that post take-offs/landings on social media platforms like Instagram...................they also happen to fly for LCC's who have less stringent cockpit rules or at least more ambiguous ones. Don't get me wrong I think it's perfectly fine if you're filming when you're flying recreational but to do it on the job, there's just something narcissistic about it, but that's just my opinion.
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Old 20th Jun 2018, 17:52
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With the surge of the Snowflakes generation, I would be very careful about posting videos/photos online. They are always some butthurts or annoying people who will criticize and claim how unprofessional you are. The company I work for has no written restrictions. I sometimes make videos/photos when flying with friends but I will think twice before considering posting them online as it can always be against you nowadays.

As mentionned above, be careful about loose items in the cockpit.
if you have a look at Airbus Safety First magazine #19, there was a case that the captain left his camera in between the armrest and the sidestick during flight and when he moved his seat forward, it pushed the camera forward and then the sidestick. The aircraft abruptly pitch down for roughly 20 seconds and reached 15 000 feet/min descent rate...
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Old 20th Jun 2018, 18:42
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Originally Posted by pineteam View Post
if you have a look at Airbus Safety First magazine #19, there was a case that the captain left his camera in between the armrest and the sidestick during flight and when he moved his seat forward, it pushed the camera forward and then the sidestick. The aircraft abruptly pitch down for roughly 20 seconds and reached 15 000 feet/min descent rate...
I rather suspect that is the near accident jimjim1 referred to earlier in the thread (post #9).


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Old 20th Jun 2018, 18:48
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Oopsy Daisy! Sorry, I missed that. Indeed, that’s the same case.
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Old 20th Jun 2018, 19:25
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Several years ago, we were doing a remote flight test at an operator (the configuration we wanted to make a change to was no longer in production so we had to use a customer's 767 to test it).
Part of the required flight test profile was to do an in-flight shutdown/windmill relight. We do this all the time in Boeing flight test and don't really think much about it, but the operator's line pilots that were riding along were aghast - intentionally shutdown one engine on a twin in-flight? As soon as we shut down the test engine, they both pulled out their phones and started filming EICAS...
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Old 21st Jun 2018, 17:58
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On purpose, I avoid the topic of publishing the footage altogether.

In the flight deck, it's what you do with it as opposed to how modern the device is. The DLSR camera case makes a strong point in that direction. The industry already has operationally approved dual-suction mounts holding 2kgs EFB sets, and they are verified for de-compression. No issue with GoPro cup technically.

A reasonable approach would be to assess the phenomena, highlight the risks and provide guidance - where necessary in the form of restrictions. Not to ban it, not ignore it either.

And my issue is the distraction. Attention-wise, the mental one. I've done a lot of EFB implementation work some time ago and was the geek guy for years. The passion for technology is still there, yet these days I seriously contemplate the idea of turning my personal phone completely off check-in to check-out. For clarity of mind when aviating.

FD (Not an owner of a GoPro, but already experienced unhappy thoughts seeing colleagues fool around with them. As well as calling some others the day before to make sure they'd bring it. Life is pretty.)

BTW: thanks for the comment on opening the doors to a filmed flight deck.
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Old 21st Jun 2018, 21:29
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As I understand it, if you are involved in an incident/accident then any personal GoPro footage is not covered by the hard-won regulations regarding FDM/CVR privacy and non-disclosure outside of safety-related investigations. This means that such footage can be used directly by police/prosecutors in a court of law.

I have thought about it (as an owner of a GoPro used for other things such as sailing, cycling etc) for 'interesting' approaches such as into FNC but I have not, and will not.
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