Engine Run Ups
While I personally would rather not put an extra cycle on an engine by starting, going out to the run up bay then returning and shutting down prior to boarding, there are often valid reasons for this practice. For example, if the aeroplane has to be relocated from hangar or tie down to the terminal, the cycle may as well be used for the run up. Or the runup bay may be in an inconvenient location, or subject to waiting times at peak hours.
As someone points out, there could be a difference between what is required on first flight of day and subsequent short turnarounds. That policy is up to the operator to establish with the regulator. And often will have to reflect what the flight manual stipulates.
Another argument: Just because it works now has no bearing on how it will work in five minutes time (e.g. testing landing lights achieves nothing except to shorten the life, as like so many devices, they usually have a finite number of cycles between failure).
If a piston engine is running smoothly and makes power during the intial take off roll, there is no reason to suspect problems.
Some operators may also call for a mag check and fire test prior to the last shutdown.
As someone points out, there could be a difference between what is required on first flight of day and subsequent short turnarounds. That policy is up to the operator to establish with the regulator. And often will have to reflect what the flight manual stipulates.
Another argument: Just because it works now has no bearing on how it will work in five minutes time (e.g. testing landing lights achieves nothing except to shorten the life, as like so many devices, they usually have a finite number of cycles between failure).
If a piston engine is running smoothly and makes power during the intial take off roll, there is no reason to suspect problems.
Some operators may also call for a mag check and fire test prior to the last shutdown.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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I'm gonna stick my neck out here;
on piston aircraft, oil temps often take time to reach before take off. Most piston aircraft do not have air conditioning on the ground. So, doing a pre, first take off of the day run-up, to get oil temps up, check mechanical integrity, (to give time for a possible repair, or aircraft swap), and just make sure everything is up to snuff, isn't a bad idea. Engine start cycles are not tracked on piston aircraft, (as far as I know) so thats not an issue.
A few years ago, when I was a DC-6 Engineer, we would often go out early when it was cold, and get the engines warmed up, and to try and stave off an unpredictable delay. there are a lot of things that can go wrong on a big piston to cause a delay; but when things have worked and are warm, they will most likely keep working. Nothing in the mechanical world is certain, but we have learned through experience, what works and what is less likely to.
On jet aircraft, doing a pre-first taxi run-up on a really cold day, or if the plane has just come out of a maintenance check, or if the plane has been sitting for an extended period of time, is a good idea.
As far as the "checklist comment, and who might have written it", that has no bearing on the matter. There is an incredible amount of idiots who have kissed their way into management positions, that have no business making checklists or making any kind of procedurally based decisions. Anyone who has been in this business longer than 5 years have seen checklists changed in one direction, and then 3 months later changed back, because it was a really stupid change.
on piston aircraft, oil temps often take time to reach before take off. Most piston aircraft do not have air conditioning on the ground. So, doing a pre, first take off of the day run-up, to get oil temps up, check mechanical integrity, (to give time for a possible repair, or aircraft swap), and just make sure everything is up to snuff, isn't a bad idea. Engine start cycles are not tracked on piston aircraft, (as far as I know) so thats not an issue.
A few years ago, when I was a DC-6 Engineer, we would often go out early when it was cold, and get the engines warmed up, and to try and stave off an unpredictable delay. there are a lot of things that can go wrong on a big piston to cause a delay; but when things have worked and are warm, they will most likely keep working. Nothing in the mechanical world is certain, but we have learned through experience, what works and what is less likely to.
On jet aircraft, doing a pre-first taxi run-up on a really cold day, or if the plane has just come out of a maintenance check, or if the plane has been sitting for an extended period of time, is a good idea.
As far as the "checklist comment, and who might have written it", that has no bearing on the matter. There is an incredible amount of idiots who have kissed their way into management positions, that have no business making checklists or making any kind of procedurally based decisions. Anyone who has been in this business longer than 5 years have seen checklists changed in one direction, and then 3 months later changed back, because it was a really stupid change.
when working for my previous operator flying a light twin piston we routinely did a full power check upon leaving the hangar in the morning, then shut down to collect our pax. This was so that the aircraft could be assessed as servicable keeping inconvenience to a minimum if otherwise. After that the checks would be reduced to engine checks with only a full runup being done every two to three sectors but a mag check always prior to departure. This was considered acceptable for a few reasons. Firstly our turn around times were short, rarely more than ten minutes shut down so the engines remained warm. More importantly the engineering standards on the aircraft were fantastic. At takeoff power there was never much out of sync on the engines and the engines always ran up at the same speed. It would easily be recognised if there was a power problem very early in the take off roll. As a point of reference the accumulated fleet hours are probably around 100,000 by now and have only ever had to carry out three inflight shutdowns.
Run ups are done to ensure everything is working okay when you are about to depend on it the most, and they take all of 30 seconds to do! Coming on here and questioning that is pretty bloody stupid. You're checking for mags, t's and p's and no carb-icing. All pretty crucial in a SEP just before you firewall the throttle and put your life in the hands of that engine.
Flying is risky enough at the best of times, so anyone who doesn't try to minimise that risk deserves everything they get, in my view.
All I know is I'm glad I'll never be flying with you
Flying is risky enough at the best of times, so anyone who doesn't try to minimise that risk deserves everything they get, in my view.
All I know is I'm glad I'll never be flying with you
You sir have not idea what is appropriate for the commercial operation of piston engine aircraft. I can say as a professional pilot that the pretty much universal practice is to do a full runup at the beginning of the day and then only do a runup if there is cause for concern . The logic is that pretty much everything that the runup will tell you will be observable while flying on the previous leg and therefore normal operation on the run in obviates the need to do a runup. To imply that every pilot is acting unprofessional for not doing a runup before every flight speaks more to your lack of knowledge than anything else...........
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Big Pistons, I'm commenting from the perspective of a low hour ppl, flying the simplest of SEPs, as the OP may have been. I freely admit to a lack of knowledge of commercial ops but in private ops I would question the wisdom of a low hour ppl such as myself omitting run ups which take no time at all. Or would you advise otherwise?!
Last edited by taxistaxing; 24th Nov 2012 at 18:59.
