Air-reports as a part of position reports
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From: UK
Air-reports as a part of position reports
Could someone proficient in ICAO regs. clarify the following:
Annex 3, 5.3.2 states: (when "routine air reports observations" shall be made): a) at which the applicable ATS procedures require routine position reports; and b) which are those separated by distances corresponding most closely to intervals of one hour of flying time.
Does this indeed implies that these observations (meteo air-reports - temp, wind dir/vel, turb, icing, humidity - as per appendix 4, 1.3) should be reported once an hour together with usual position reports?
Annex 3, 5.3.2 states: (when "routine air reports observations" shall be made): a) at which the applicable ATS procedures require routine position reports; and b) which are those separated by distances corresponding most closely to intervals of one hour of flying time.
Does this indeed implies that these observations (meteo air-reports - temp, wind dir/vel, turb, icing, humidity - as per appendix 4, 1.3) should be reported once an hour together with usual position reports?
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From: Between a rock and a hard place
Here is copy & paste from the NAT MNPS Operations Manual
6.5 METEOROLOGICAL REPORTS
6.5.1 Some aircraft flying in the NAT are required to report MET observations of wind speed and direction plus outside air temperature. Any turbulence encountered should be included in these reports. From among the aircraft intending to operate on the organised track system, OACs designate those which will be required to report routine meteorological observations at, and midway between, each prescribed reporting point. The designation is made by the OAC when issuing the Oceanic Clearance using the phrase “SEND MET REPORTS“, and is normally made so as to designate one aircraft per track at approximately hourly intervals. Pilots flying routes which are partly or wholly off the OTS should include routine MET observations with every prescribed report. The midpoint observation should be recorded then transmitted at the next designated reporting point. The format to be used for the reporting of such additional observations must be by reference to the latitude (degrees and minutes) and longitude (degrees only) for the intermediate mid-point. It should be recognised that the use of the term “MID” is insufficient for direct input into MET computers.
6.5.1 Some aircraft flying in the NAT are required to report MET observations of wind speed and direction plus outside air temperature. Any turbulence encountered should be included in these reports. From among the aircraft intending to operate on the organised track system, OACs designate those which will be required to report routine meteorological observations at, and midway between, each prescribed reporting point. The designation is made by the OAC when issuing the Oceanic Clearance using the phrase “SEND MET REPORTS“, and is normally made so as to designate one aircraft per track at approximately hourly intervals. Pilots flying routes which are partly or wholly off the OTS should include routine MET observations with every prescribed report. The midpoint observation should be recorded then transmitted at the next designated reporting point. The format to be used for the reporting of such additional observations must be by reference to the latitude (degrees and minutes) and longitude (degrees only) for the intermediate mid-point. It should be recognised that the use of the term “MID” is insufficient for direct input into MET computers.
Joined: Jun 2001
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From: UK
There are also some airway reporting points which are designated "M" which means you should send an AirRep (usually just spot wind and OAT).
EG Entry/Exit points at Morrocan airspace (High Level) - have a look at the charts.
That said not many seem to bother but personally I always give the Report and they seem to appreciate it - I guess it's a lack of data in these areas is why they want the info and one day you might benefit from the information passed by another a/c?
EG Entry/Exit points at Morrocan airspace (High Level) - have a look at the charts.
That said not many seem to bother but personally I always give the Report and they seem to appreciate it - I guess it's a lack of data in these areas is why they want the info and one day you might benefit from the information passed by another a/c?
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From: Dubai
In fact, most modern aircraft do the weather reporting automatically via ADS-B.
Our operations manual specifically states that aircraft taking part in ADS reporting are exempt from all routine met reports.
Our operations manual specifically states that aircraft taking part in ADS reporting are exempt from all routine met reports.
Thread Starter
Joined: May 2008
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From: UK
Thanx for replies everyone, but question remains open:
Indeed, there are specific designated waypoints (as per AIP), over which AIREP reports shall be reported ("fireflybob" refered to them). But Annex 3 does not refer to these points, from the wording it uses, it is clear that AIREP shall be made once an hour together with position reports (if they are used), if acft is not ADS-capable.
Can anyone clarify this?
Indeed, there are specific designated waypoints (as per AIP), over which AIREP reports shall be reported ("fireflybob" refered to them). But Annex 3 does not refer to these points, from the wording it uses, it is clear that AIREP shall be made once an hour together with position reports (if they are used), if acft is not ADS-capable.
Can anyone clarify this?
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AIREPs (weather reports) are no longer required with voice position reports in the NAT area (Amendment 75 to Annex 3, Oct 2010). The met services get all the data they need (and some more probably) from flights giving position reports via datalink(FMC, ADS, CPDLC etc.). The only time an AIREP is required is if a weather condition exists (e.g. turbulence) which might warrant the issue of a SIGMET.
