Fly Runwway Track
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: usa
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fly Runwway Track
Departing OMSJ recently tower cleared us for takeoff and amended our clearance to "fly runway track" or something along those lines. Did they actually mean the track of the runway course or is this another way to say fly runway heading?
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: hyderabad
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
fly ground track
In some countries like Australia, u are expected to fly a ground track. Possibly cause of the fmc usage. Just as an input , during a G/A the AP maintains the last ground track, so you got to have ure hdg on course on the app. any comments?
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,843
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Fly Runway Track" means exactly that, you are required to follow the Track of the extended Runway centre-line. As noted earlier, this particularly applies in Australia, but is by no means limited to that country.
Similarly, "Fly Runway Heading" means exactly that, you are required to follow the Heading of the Runway direction.
If you do not have the equipment to enable you to fly Track, your response to ATC should be "Unable to comply", their separation standards are based upon it.
Regards,
Old Smokey
Similarly, "Fly Runway Heading" means exactly that, you are required to follow the Heading of the Runway direction.
If you do not have the equipment to enable you to fly Track, your response to ATC should be "Unable to comply", their separation standards are based upon it.
Regards,
Old Smokey
This might be a generational thing! I can still remember by first instructor 40 years ago pointing how amateurish my take-off looked as I didn't apply crab for the wind. I was still figuring out why rudder wouldn't fix it.
It still looks, to me, very untidy to lift-off and drift downwind, not matter what the ATC instruction is.
GF
It still looks, to me, very untidy to lift-off and drift downwind, not matter what the ATC instruction is.
GF
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Scotland
Posts: 391
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The BAe 146 RJ has a function called 'TKOF TRK'. Passing 80kts the aircraft will use the direction in which the nose in pointing and apply that as runway track. So providing your going straight down the rwy at 80kts you'll climb out on runway track if you follow the flight directors. Very convenient on those windy days.
Any other aircraft with similar functions? (I've only flown the RJ to date)
Any other aircraft with similar functions? (I've only flown the RJ to date)
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Around the world.
Age: 42
Posts: 606
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
DB-757, On the Airbus 320 and I assume 330/340 if you twiddle the heading knob before you roll, once you're airborne you will be in runway track mode. You would then need to select (pull on the knob) heading mode if that is what you want (you can preselect the heading before you roll if required).
Cheers.
Cheers.
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Seattle
Posts: 3,195
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In the UK, the term 'Climb straight ahead' is also used by ATC.
This means that you must follow the runway centreline and adjust for wind.
This means that you must follow the runway centreline and adjust for wind.
Most of us know how to "fly runway heading" and "fly runway track." What is the official CAA definition of "climb straight ahead"? If there is none, it should not be used, unless ATC doesn't care one way or the other...
PANSOPS requires you to maintain runway track (ie drift corrected) if "Runway Track" or "Runway Heading" is asked for. TERPS requires the non drift corrected heading to be flown.
TERPS airfields are North, Central and South America, Japan, Taiwan and Korea (except ICN and GMP). PANSOPS are everyone else, including OMSJ.
As mentioned, some aircraft will maintain runway track, such as the Airbus FBW types where the FMA is actually RWY TRK. The 744's I used to fly knew where you where and applied the relavant procedure.
This has been done to death before - try a search.
TERPS airfields are North, Central and South America, Japan, Taiwan and Korea (except ICN and GMP). PANSOPS are everyone else, including OMSJ.
As mentioned, some aircraft will maintain runway track, such as the Airbus FBW types where the FMA is actually RWY TRK. The 744's I used to fly knew where you where and applied the relavant procedure.
This has been done to death before - try a search.
The BAe 146 RJ has a function called 'TKOF TRK'. Passing 80kts the aircraft will use the direction in which the nose in pointing and apply that as runway track. So providing your going straight down the rwy at 80kts you'll climb out on runway track if you follow the flight directors. Very convenient on those windy days.
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Between a rock and a hard place
Posts: 1,267
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
PANSOPS requires you to maintain runway track (ie drift corrected) if "Runway Track" or "Runway Heading" is asked for. TERPS requires the non drift corrected heading to be flown.
Correct for known or estimated wind except when:
- being radar vectored
- cleared "runway heading"
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Up North UK
Posts: 95
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Many years ago as we backtracked the runway at a downtown airport in Northern Ireland, we were told "After departure climb straight ahead on the runway heading". I asked if he meant straight ahead or maintain the runway heading ... the response: "Yes, yes, climb straight ahead. On the runway heading."
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Berkshire, UK
Age: 79
Posts: 8,268
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Track" and "heading" are quite different and should be understood by both controllers and pilots.
I always specified a definite heading because I and the pilot knew exactly what was meant and I could take wind into account to ensure that the aeroplane went where I wanted it to go. E.g "Cleared for take-off, fly heading 250 degrees".
I always specified a definite heading because I and the pilot knew exactly what was meant and I could take wind into account to ensure that the aeroplane went where I wanted it to go. E.g "Cleared for take-off, fly heading 250 degrees".
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Europe
Age: 65
Posts: 136
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In Perth, WA, the term "maintain runway track" was introduced to allow the departures controller to cancel and aircraft's SID on the ground and fly the runway track.
This was necessary as a number of the SIDs are designed to take aircraft around the Pearce restricted areas and have multiple VNAV and a number of heading changes. When the RAAF are not there we needed to be able to track shorten and let aircraft do what they needed to on departure.
ATC may not radar vector an aircraft below the MVA, if the aircraft cannot do its own terrain clearance e.g. by night or poor vis/low cloud. So a little creative thinking, all the radar SIDs are based on firstly maintain runway track (PH2 e.g.) using the obs clearance and tracks in the radar SIDs, we were able to introduce "cancel SID, maintain runway track.." for the 03 deps north and the 21 deps west.
Also this allows us to comply with noise abatement procedures and transition the aircraft from runway track to either direct tracking to the next waypoint or onto a heading.
This was necessary as a number of the SIDs are designed to take aircraft around the Pearce restricted areas and have multiple VNAV and a number of heading changes. When the RAAF are not there we needed to be able to track shorten and let aircraft do what they needed to on departure.
ATC may not radar vector an aircraft below the MVA, if the aircraft cannot do its own terrain clearance e.g. by night or poor vis/low cloud. So a little creative thinking, all the radar SIDs are based on firstly maintain runway track (PH2 e.g.) using the obs clearance and tracks in the radar SIDs, we were able to introduce "cancel SID, maintain runway track.." for the 03 deps north and the 21 deps west.
Also this allows us to comply with noise abatement procedures and transition the aircraft from runway track to either direct tracking to the next waypoint or onto a heading.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Uh... Where was I?
Posts: 1,338
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Unambiguous. That is how all instructions should be.
To me, heading is heading and track is track. End of story.
The FMS departure procedures, when flown in LNAV, contain both track and heading legs, as in the published ones. In the first, track is maintained. In the latter, heading is maintained regardless of wind.
Doing one way or the other may seem quite irrelevant most of the times, but in a strong crosswind day with paralel runways or a nearby airport or some noise sensitive area it is relevant to do it in the correct manner.
To me, heading is heading and track is track. End of story.
The FMS departure procedures, when flown in LNAV, contain both track and heading legs, as in the published ones. In the first, track is maintained. In the latter, heading is maintained regardless of wind.
Doing one way or the other may seem quite irrelevant most of the times, but in a strong crosswind day with paralel runways or a nearby airport or some noise sensitive area it is relevant to do it in the correct manner.
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 683
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Let's get back to the original question.
As always, the phraseology used is critical. Unfortunately, if you can't accurately quote the clearance given in your question, how on earth can we discuss what was actually meant? Having said that, I really cannot understand why it has prompted all this discussion.
I have to say that, in over 40 years of flying, I've never had a problem with this. As always, if there is any ambiguity in a clearance, you should clarify exactly what is meant before you accept it.
JD
- Fly Runway Heading after take-off, means fly the QFU (magnetic alignment) of the runway as a heading after take-off (i.e. do not correct for drift),
- Fly Runway Track, or Maintain Runway Centreline after take-off both mean exactly that, i.e. fly a heading which causes you to track the runway extended centreline (i.e. do correct for drift).
I have to say that, in over 40 years of flying, I've never had a problem with this. As always, if there is any ambiguity in a clearance, you should clarify exactly what is meant before you accept it.
JD
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Europe
Posts: 716
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
PANSOPS requires you to maintain runway track (ie drift corrected) if "Runway Track" or "Runway Heading" is asked for.
Correct for known or estimated wind except when:
- being radar vectored
- cleared "runway heading"
- being radar vectored
- cleared "runway heading"
Wrt track straight ahead after an ILS approach;
You could, although not completely by the book, use the localiser back beam, or fly the same heading as you had on the approach, as the wind is likely to be similar on the missed approach as on the final approach. Also, at least in Norway, since all IFR aircraft are required to have RNAV over FL95, you would indeed have a track readout in most aircraft, or the ability to create a phantom point as an extension of the runway, to give you (although somewhat crude) track guidance. You are allowed to do it as long as PRNAV is not required, too...
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Smogsville
Posts: 1,424
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Our company manual has the following:
If a SID or Departure Clearance specifies ‘Maintain Runway Heading’ it is implied that a drift correction will be applied in order to maintain the runway track.
Exceptions − USA, Canada and Australia require that Runway Heading be maintained without drift correction.
So in a Boeing deselect LNAV and depart with TOGA to maintain runway track.
or in the USA, CAN, AUS select HDG SEL on the ground or @ 400' AGL to fly HDG.
If a SID or Departure Clearance specifies ‘Maintain Runway Heading’ it is implied that a drift correction will be applied in order to maintain the runway track.
Exceptions − USA, Canada and Australia require that Runway Heading be maintained without drift correction.
So in a Boeing deselect LNAV and depart with TOGA to maintain runway track.
or in the USA, CAN, AUS select HDG SEL on the ground or @ 400' AGL to fly HDG.