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Inertial Navigation Old Timers/Experts

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Inertial Navigation Old Timers/Experts

Old 30th Sep 2008, 15:03
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,575
One day, for one reason or another, Uncle Sam may have to turn GPS off. And he probably won't want to issue a NOTAM until after he's done it...
A oft repeated scenario, and totally without merit.
It wasn't turned off after the events of 11Sept01, so it absolutely will not happen.
Most Europeans have a mental hangup about this, so perhaps the US DoD should start charging our European friends for the use of the US system.
A user fee for the non-believers...which didn't pay for the installation and continued operation of the system in the first place....
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Old 30th Sep 2008, 15:12
  #42 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 1999
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so perhaps the US DoD should start charging our European friends for the use of the US system.
Why, we have our own.


Galileo (satellite navigation) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 30th Sep 2008, 21:17
  #43 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
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Hey 411A,

You're right about 2001-09-11: I was also flying that day. It's not a case of being ungrateful; more of not wishing to take America’s generosity for granted.

Presumably there was no reason for turning GPS off after the Twin Towers, but one can think of plenty of scenarios that might make it essential: so many dodgy people are using it these days. And taking it for granted.

Quote from Wikipedia:
Following the September 11, 2001 attacks, the United States Government wrote to the European Union opposing the [Galileo] project, arguing that it would end the ability of the United States to shut down GPS in times of military operations.
[Unquote]

No doubt we are developing a European system, forget, but is it available now, and how many of us (will) have the necessary equipment?
Quote from Wikipedia:
On November 30th, 2007, the 27 EU transportation ministers involved reached an agreement that it [Galileo] should be operational by 2013.
[Unquote]

Bearing in mind that even the current triple-mix IRS positions seem to drift by up to about 1 knot (1 nm per hour of flight), it would seem politic to keep those DME stations running worldwide for the time being, not to mention the VORs and ILSs. [And Droitwich ].
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Old 9th Jun 2019, 15:48
  #44 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Somewhere Up Country, old prune...
Age: 75
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Thumbs up Been there, done that.

Originally Posted by 411A View Post
Except for SaudiArabian aircraft.
These aircraft were fitted with three Litton ISS units (not capable of stand alone navigation), which in turn provided data to two Hamilton Sundstrand FMS units (far more useful than their Smiths cousins), and this whole kit and caboodle also included a 12 inch diagonal (CRT) moving map, all in one neat package.
The first and finest available, anywhere, circa 1976.
Aircraft type?
Lockheed TriStar.
I flew the TriStar with Saudia for several years, (1985 - 1989) and it was the most sophisticated system we had. When I “upgraded” to the 747 I thought I’d been sent back to the Stone Age.
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Old 9th Jun 2019, 16:57
  #45 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
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Originally Posted by CaptainJurassic View Post


I flew the TriStar with Saudia for several years, (1985 - 1989) and it was the most sophisticated system we had. When I “upgraded” to the 747 I thought I’d been sent back to the Stone Age.

Have I been in some sort of time warp?
Why do these 11 year old threads resurrect themselves?
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Old 9th Jun 2019, 22:29
  #46 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: dublin
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Originally Posted by galaxy flyer View Post
Not so fast, the LaserRef V in the Challenger 605, among others, can be aligned in-flight. Haven't tried it and is supposed to take awhile.

GF
are you saying that they can be realigned with exact position? Don’t think so. Aligned with heading and horizon, yes. Ie can be used as ADI and compass.
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Old 10th Jun 2019, 03:54
  #47 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow
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On A320, it’s impossible to realign IRS in flight. Only position update if no GPS primary. The newest Airbuses only use GPS for position update in flight. You can’t even do a manual position update unless both GPS are desactivated or failed. The alignment is also automatically done while resetting the ADIRS knob with the GPS coordinates. No pilot input required. And you don’t need to deselect any rad nav. As long as it’s GPS primary it will never use VOR/DME for position update.

Last edited by pineteam; 11th Jun 2019 at 01:34. Reason: Typo
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Old 11th Jun 2019, 00:38
  #48 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: england
Posts: 656
Incidentally, following on from a previous poster referring to the 777,I recently experienced loss of GPS signal and no position updating due to jamming around certain parts of the Mediterranean, with “inertial” showing on the ND. It is certainly worth a look at the manuals to have a good understanding of INS/IRS modes fitted on your a/c type.
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Old 11th Jun 2019, 03:12
  #49 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Originally Posted by Chris Scott View Post
No doubt we are developing a European system, forget, but is it available now, and how many of us (will) have the necessary equipment?
I looked this up a few months ago and consumer GNSS equipment was all moving to support ALL of the major systems available. GPS, Glonass, Galileo, others.

Here is an article about something else - Dual Frequency GNSS - which lists the capabilities of various GNSS systems in mobile phones. Glonass and Galileo is widely.

https://www.xda-developers.com/dual-...bably-missing/
which also points to
https://developer.android.com/guide/...ported-devices
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