No Alternate IFR fuel
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lederhosen
A319 Final Res aprox 990KG
A319 15 min extra = 50% of the above.
So Min landing fuel if you use your cont fuel would be aprox 1500Kg and if cont was 200-300 then you would expect to land with 1800Kg
As I said this done on a daily basis within EZY with no problems.
Its those who don't understand the rules SOP's, inflight replanning rules and actions and those with little common sense that cause the problems!
If it was my jet I would fill the wings and put the trip in the centre, but as our company is fighting for survival then I am happy to do whatever I can to help the situation.
A319 Final Res aprox 990KG
A319 15 min extra = 50% of the above.
So Min landing fuel if you use your cont fuel would be aprox 1500Kg and if cont was 200-300 then you would expect to land with 1800Kg
As I said this done on a daily basis within EZY with no problems.
Its those who don't understand the rules SOP's, inflight replanning rules and actions and those with little common sense that cause the problems!
If it was my jet I would fill the wings and put the trip in the centre, but as our company is fighting for survival then I am happy to do whatever I can to help the situation.
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The pilots union for US Airways made a big stink here yesterday about this issue, saying the airline is pressuring pilots to reduce fuel reserves below what they claim is safe. They even took out a full-page advert in USA Today (a national paper) trying to scare passengers, I guess. Sounds more like politics and bargaining strategy, though, than a real safety issue.
The Associated Press: US Airways pilots: We're pressured to cut fuel
The Associated Press: US Airways pilots: We're pressured to cut fuel
Thanks for the reply crewcostundercontrol, I am impressed that the minibus is so economical.
Sky Wave I have tried to find a way of linking our letter from the LBA received at the end of 2007 and posted on our intranet. But my IT skills are not up to it. The key paragraph says:
Entscheidet sich der Kommandant in Ausnahmefällen aus Gründen der Flugsicherheit dennoch für eine Landung am Bestimmungsflugplatz, ohne dass die unter Punkten 4. bzw.5 genannten Voraussetzungen vorliegen, so hat er hierüber den Luftfahrtunternehmen zur Weitergabe an die Aufsichtsbehörde ausführlich zu berichten.
In summary if you eat into alternate fuel continuing to an airfield with only one runway, such as Berlin SXF then you must report it to your company who must report it to the LBA.
It is pretty clear. As easy has a pretty big operation in SXF I am surprised this has not been flagged. I would be careful unless you want to experience german bureaucracy first hand!
Sky Wave I have tried to find a way of linking our letter from the LBA received at the end of 2007 and posted on our intranet. But my IT skills are not up to it. The key paragraph says:
Entscheidet sich der Kommandant in Ausnahmefällen aus Gründen der Flugsicherheit dennoch für eine Landung am Bestimmungsflugplatz, ohne dass die unter Punkten 4. bzw.5 genannten Voraussetzungen vorliegen, so hat er hierüber den Luftfahrtunternehmen zur Weitergabe an die Aufsichtsbehörde ausführlich zu berichten.
In summary if you eat into alternate fuel continuing to an airfield with only one runway, such as Berlin SXF then you must report it to your company who must report it to the LBA.
It is pretty clear. As easy has a pretty big operation in SXF I am surprised this has not been flagged. I would be careful unless you want to experience german bureaucracy first hand!
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Sky Wave I cannot answer that question. But I think it unlikely that the LBA would be happy if it knew. Why don't you ask your management to find out? Tell them to ask for Referatsleiter Flugbetrieb 004953123550 in Braunschweig.
Summarising what others have posted, Westjet use 5000 pounds minimum divided by 2.2 is 2272 kg for the 737, just under one hour. 42south says they carry 60 minutes fuel in New Zealand. In Germany my company does not allow planning without an alternate and we are required to arrive with alternate plus final reserve unless the conditions I listed earlier are met, absolute minimum 1800kg.
Easy and possibly others seem to be planning with less, which is a significant competitive advantage if it is allowed.
Summarising what others have posted, Westjet use 5000 pounds minimum divided by 2.2 is 2272 kg for the 737, just under one hour. 42south says they carry 60 minutes fuel in New Zealand. In Germany my company does not allow planning without an alternate and we are required to arrive with alternate plus final reserve unless the conditions I listed earlier are met, absolute minimum 1800kg.
Easy and possibly others seem to be planning with less, which is a significant competitive advantage if it is allowed.
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Punk...
That is why you carry 15min extra fuel. The idea is you commit to destination before you leave! so at destination you should have just under an hours fuel, penty to sort any problem out and land at a big airport with 6 runways!! not a big deal it's just mindset. If you like you are diverting to your destination..........
The what ifs are dealt with before you leave like weather and airport equipment. And if you are not sure or don't fancy it then it's simple you carry Alt fuel.
As I said our company is fighting for survival and if knowing how to operate well helps reduce costs then it's fine by me.
That is why you carry 15min extra fuel. The idea is you commit to destination before you leave! so at destination you should have just under an hours fuel, penty to sort any problem out and land at a big airport with 6 runways!! not a big deal it's just mindset. If you like you are diverting to your destination..........
The what ifs are dealt with before you leave like weather and airport equipment. And if you are not sure or don't fancy it then it's simple you carry Alt fuel.
As I said our company is fighting for survival and if knowing how to operate well helps reduce costs then it's fine by me.
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Same here, commitment to stay is not allowed in the planning stage at all so we allways have to carry alternate fuel except for the isolated aerodrome case (in which case 2 hours of final reserve fuel is needed). German JAR rules as well, and yes JAR is not the same in each country, there are quite a few differences until EASA takes over.
We can use commitment however if enroute under certain conditions (2 separate runways with separate instrument approaches, suitable weather, current and forecast), however that is only a tool if yo drop below alternate fuel enroute with good enough weather and you have 2 separate runways at the destination. It is not allowed to use during the planning stage.
We can use commitment however if enroute under certain conditions (2 separate runways with separate instrument approaches, suitable weather, current and forecast), however that is only a tool if yo drop below alternate fuel enroute with good enough weather and you have 2 separate runways at the destination. It is not allowed to use during the planning stage.
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Divert to any enroute alternate where i can still be within the requirements. If that is not possible i have to declare a PAN PAN for low fuel and act accordingly.
Never had that except in the simulator so far, quite the contrary we usually land with around 500 to 1000gk above planned remaining due to shortcuts enroute. We use for planning longest departure and arrival including any relevant transition procedures so our flown route is usually shorter than the planned one, domestic by up to 100NM.
Never had that except in the simulator so far, quite the contrary we usually land with around 500 to 1000gk above planned remaining due to shortcuts enroute. We use for planning longest departure and arrival including any relevant transition procedures so our flown route is usually shorter than the planned one, domestic by up to 100NM.
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Punkalouver,
then I guess I better stop flying because there are a whole world of "what if's" that can happen. No Alternate is safe. It's up to you to decide whether or not the flight plan can be carried out under No Alt. There was a small period of time when our SOP's did not require the min fuel of 5000lbs and so theoretically Dispatch could min us to 3200lbs. I remember watching a Captain here get all tied up in a knot because the DXP had given him 5000lbs and No Alt. The DX'er said, "O.K., I'll give you an Alternate" and provided him one that only required 4800LBS. Hmmmm.....
As professional pilots, we have a responsibility towards Safety. That is first and foremost. We also have a responsibility towards the economic operation of our companies that cannot be ignored.
then I guess I better stop flying because there are a whole world of "what if's" that can happen. No Alternate is safe. It's up to you to decide whether or not the flight plan can be carried out under No Alt. There was a small period of time when our SOP's did not require the min fuel of 5000lbs and so theoretically Dispatch could min us to 3200lbs. I remember watching a Captain here get all tied up in a knot because the DXP had given him 5000lbs and No Alt. The DX'er said, "O.K., I'll give you an Alternate" and provided him one that only required 4800LBS. Hmmmm.....
As professional pilots, we have a responsibility towards Safety. That is first and foremost. We also have a responsibility towards the economic operation of our companies that cannot be ignored.
