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Question for the pilots..

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Question for the pilots..

Old 4th Jul 2007, 19:43
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Essex, based at LTN
Posts: 32
Question for the pilots..

Hi Everyone!

I'm currently working for a UK airline and we are trying to implement a system for the flight crew to signal to the cabin crew when they need to be seated for TO/LDG.

Our current SOP is secure is passed when all crew seated although we are finding crew are spending a huge amount of time strapped in during holding, departure queues etc etc.

We want to get the facts together before we broach the idea with the big cheeses, so I'm wondering if anyone has a procedure with their airline that the Flt crew indicate to CC when they need to be seated (I have worked for airlines in the past with this sytem but unsure of flight crew technical details) and could clarify the following for me:

1. At what point of your checklist would you signal to the cabin crew to be seated for TO and LDG?
I.E: on approach to takeoff runway- is it the number of aircraft ahead or at a certain distance from runway etc/LDG- 10 minutes out/certain flight level??

2. How is this done (cycle of seatbelt signs/cycle of seatbelt signs followed by SCCM PA/ Interphone call to cabin/ Flight Crew PA)?

3. Is the cabin secure passed from SCCM when cabin ready or when all crew seated after your instruction? If the secure is passed already do you require second check from SCCM that all crew seated or is it trusted that crew will seat themselves on instruction?

Not a pilot so not up on all the technicalities so please forgive me if there are any really daft things in this post!! If you would prefer not to post on the public forum, please PM me!

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Many thanks!
BecauseCIDSsays_so! is offline  
Old 4th Jul 2007, 21:30
  #2 (permalink)  
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Essex, based at LTN
Posts: 32
Thanks Studi, unfortunately we are not on the lovely modern airbus (miss the technology on those- so helpful!) but your reply was very helpful thank you!

Anyone under a UK AOC with any ideas?

Happy Flying!
BecauseCIDSsays_so! is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2007, 11:14
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Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Essex
Posts: 104
The system at Ryanair works quite well. Crew are given seats over the PA before lining up. Belts are put on at 15000', '10 minutes to landing' given over p.a. at 10000' and seats for landing on final.
I Just Drive is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2007, 13:19
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Join Date: Nov 2006
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At Tfly belts are on at 10000 at the latest, this gives the crew enough time to prepare the cabin and a cabin secure message is passed via the TV screens. No other announcements are made. Granted this can occasionally mean that crew are sat for small periods during holding. Although on a run of the mill approach cabin secure is usually received between 2 and 4 mins before landing.

I reckon it works well, essentially all the flight crew has to do is flick on the belts and we get a secure 10 mins later. I can't personally see the benefit of the Ryanair way, making two seperate PA's at a fairly critical stage of flight. Im not Ryanair bashing, in fairness lots of airlines do it this way.

The problem that you have is that you want more time on our feet and get the pilots to tell you when to sit down. Your management will probably ask why, after several hours on your feet do you want another 3 minutes. From a flight crew point of view its nice to just let you get on with it and take responsibility for it.

Anyway good luck
DooblerChina is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2007, 13:22
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: In the real world
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sorry, I didnt really answer your question, the cabin secure check is done within 2-3 mins before landing in the landing checklist, or on departure almost immediately before lining up.

And the cabin secure message on the TV screen means that crews are seated as well as the pax etc..
DooblerChina is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2007, 13:25
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Essex, based at LTN
Posts: 32
Thank you!

That helps, just trying to get an idea of how other people do it so we can make suggestions!

We always need extra minutes, especially landing early morning we have so much to do, even if the extra minutes only mean we can seal carts and hand out last jackets etc it would help!

Thanks for your help, much appreciated!
BecauseCIDSsays_so! is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2007, 13:39
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Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Canada
Age: 45
Posts: 69
At our airline in Canada, our SOPs had us flash the seat belt signs twice through 10,000' then as a last warning, we hit the "chime" button twice when the landing gear is selected down (as if landing gear weren't a good enough indicator). As an added thing, you can get your pilots to give the estimated time to touchdown during their announcements.

For takeoff, the purser (or whatever they are called these days) will call up the flight deck and tell us that they are secure. As a final warning, I have done either double chime them or make an announcement, "flight attendants please be seated for takeoff" just before taxi onto the runway.

Hope that helps.
KingAir is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2007, 15:38
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Per Ardua ad Astraeus
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: UK
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Departure: Cabin secure when it is done. Sit down on 3 chimes when runway entrance clearance is received. PA (as per FR) is equally good.

10 minutes to landing normally gives enough on schedules, 15 on charters. If my gear goes down earlier than normal I try to call to let them know it is early to avoid panic. I start panicking at 1000' if I hear nothing.
BOAC is offline  
Old 5th Jul 2007, 16:23
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: S51 30 W060 10.
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for takeoff, at least 1 minute before initiating takeoff roll we say "Flight attendants be seated for takeoff" on the PA (the FO does that)...for landing, as part of the landing checklist, before lowering the gear we say "Flight attendants be seated for landing" (the PM does that) When they hear the gear extending they talk to the passengers (L & G in a few minutes we´ll be landing at XXXX, please keep your seatbelts fastened bla bla bla).

If something goes wrong we say "flight attendants stand by" that means they stop doing whatever they were doing and prepare for our next instruction, which could be an evac or "flt attendants normal op" meaning we were able to solve the problem and we´re not going to evac (tailpipe fires, engine fires, etc) That´s for Boeing 73CL

I think Scarebus says "cabin crew at your stations" in case something ´s not right.

Hope this helps.
sudden Winds is offline  

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