Airbus Procedures
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Airbus Procedures
Gentlemen
I have a few questions for the airbus guys. Hope you can shed some light. All questions are for the A330 or A 340
1. During the ramp check should the engine fire test button be pressed and held until you cancel the CRC 4 times (A340 or twice for the A330).If you here the fire bell once is it good enough. Do all fire detection systems on all engines get tested if you get all indications and hear the bell only once?
2. When inserting winds into the cruise page on the MCDU FCOM 4 states only insert winds if the change is greater than 30kts or 30 deg or temp 5 deg change. However there is a ambiguity where if you are cruising at e.g. FL 350 winds for that level need not be entered since the FMGC calculates actual winds 200 nm ahead to update the estimates. You should enter winds for levels above and below FL350?
3. Why is it not correct to enter the cruise temp in the fuel prediction page or the cruise level on the progress page in (ATL CRZ mode ) on the MCDU? Normally you see four dash lines where the temp is auto up dated.
Any help is welcome and if anyone can give any airbus references it would be better.
Thanks,
Sing 330
I have a few questions for the airbus guys. Hope you can shed some light. All questions are for the A330 or A 340
1. During the ramp check should the engine fire test button be pressed and held until you cancel the CRC 4 times (A340 or twice for the A330).If you here the fire bell once is it good enough. Do all fire detection systems on all engines get tested if you get all indications and hear the bell only once?
2. When inserting winds into the cruise page on the MCDU FCOM 4 states only insert winds if the change is greater than 30kts or 30 deg or temp 5 deg change. However there is a ambiguity where if you are cruising at e.g. FL 350 winds for that level need not be entered since the FMGC calculates actual winds 200 nm ahead to update the estimates. You should enter winds for levels above and below FL350?
3. Why is it not correct to enter the cruise temp in the fuel prediction page or the cruise level on the progress page in (ATL CRZ mode ) on the MCDU? Normally you see four dash lines where the temp is auto up dated.
Any help is welcome and if anyone can give any airbus references it would be better.
Thanks,
Sing 330
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I am sure I am not the best person to reply but I'll have a go.
1)
On the A330
Engine fire Test pb
This pb permits the crew to test simultaneously the operation of the fire detection and extinguishing system for both engines.
When it is pressed;
a continuous repetitive chime sounds
the master warn lights flash
eng fire warning appears on ECAM
On the fire panel
the eng fir epb comes on red
the squib lights come on white if discharge supplies are available
the discharge lights come on amber
on the the eng panel ( pedestal)
the fire lights come on red
Simply push and hold the button for as long as it takes to satisfy yourself that all the above criteria are met.
2)
I don't think the MCDU calculates actual winds 200 nm ahead. Put winds in at significant points from your forecast at various levels. Put enough in horizontally and vertically to give an accurate wind field. If you are transatlantic you need them every waypoint . The machine will use the actual wind at present position and use the forecast wind at next waypoint for predictions.
3) The prog page should always accept a cruise FL.
Hope I haven't misled you too much - it is all much clearer in practice.
1)
On the A330
Engine fire Test pb
This pb permits the crew to test simultaneously the operation of the fire detection and extinguishing system for both engines.
When it is pressed;
a continuous repetitive chime sounds
the master warn lights flash
eng fire warning appears on ECAM
On the fire panel
the eng fir epb comes on red
the squib lights come on white if discharge supplies are available
the discharge lights come on amber
on the the eng panel ( pedestal)
the fire lights come on red
Simply push and hold the button for as long as it takes to satisfy yourself that all the above criteria are met.
2)
I don't think the MCDU calculates actual winds 200 nm ahead. Put winds in at significant points from your forecast at various levels. Put enough in horizontally and vertically to give an accurate wind field. If you are transatlantic you need them every waypoint . The machine will use the actual wind at present position and use the forecast wind at next waypoint for predictions.
3) The prog page should always accept a cruise FL.
Hope I haven't misled you too much - it is all much clearer in practice.
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Here's my take Sing330
1. As backofthedrag submitted, once the items he describes are present during the test, the test is complete. The CRC is only cancelled once and the discreet engine fire warnings confirm their individual fire detection circuits.
2. Airbus recommends inserting different winds and temps when they differ more than 30kts, 30 degrees or 5 degrees C. But you can do as many as you like and it will only improve the accuracy of the fuel and time predictions. I personally use 10 kts since a 20 or 30kt error over many hours can make quite a difference in the predictions. It's your choice but don't do less than your company specifies in their SOP's.
The MCDU will propogate any wind entered forward until another wind is entered for the same altitude or the top of descent, whichever is first. It will also extrapolate wind entered in the highest altitude in the MCDU to a higher altitude if you are cruising higher. (IE. entered winds are at 330 and 350, but you are cruising at 370...it will calculate the winds at 370 based on the 330 and 350 winds.)
The MCDU will also interpolate winds between entered values. If the entered winds are at 310 and 350, but you are cruising at 330 the MCDU wil calculate the winds at 330 (interpolated) based on the 310 and 350 winds entered.
Regardless of entered winds in the MCDU, it will use the current wind out to 200nm and then the forcast winds thereafter in calculating its predictions. The reason for this is obvious, actual conditions are always more accurate than forecast conditions.
3. You can enter cruise level and cruise temperature anywhere you like, but normally during preflight it's done on the INIT "A" page because that's where it falls in the preflight setup flow. The temperature can be modified in the FUEL PRED page once the engines are started because the INIT pages are no longer available. The cruise level can be selected in the PROG page by either typing it in or selecting it on the FCU. A higher altitude selected on the FCU will be automatically transferred to the PROG page but a lower altitude will not. The PROG page will also not accept a typed in cruise altitude lower than what is selected on the FCU. The autoflight will not enter CRZ ALT unless the PROG page altitude is the same as aircraft altitude.
Hope this helps
1. As backofthedrag submitted, once the items he describes are present during the test, the test is complete. The CRC is only cancelled once and the discreet engine fire warnings confirm their individual fire detection circuits.
2. Airbus recommends inserting different winds and temps when they differ more than 30kts, 30 degrees or 5 degrees C. But you can do as many as you like and it will only improve the accuracy of the fuel and time predictions. I personally use 10 kts since a 20 or 30kt error over many hours can make quite a difference in the predictions. It's your choice but don't do less than your company specifies in their SOP's.
The MCDU will propogate any wind entered forward until another wind is entered for the same altitude or the top of descent, whichever is first. It will also extrapolate wind entered in the highest altitude in the MCDU to a higher altitude if you are cruising higher. (IE. entered winds are at 330 and 350, but you are cruising at 370...it will calculate the winds at 370 based on the 330 and 350 winds.)
The MCDU will also interpolate winds between entered values. If the entered winds are at 310 and 350, but you are cruising at 330 the MCDU wil calculate the winds at 330 (interpolated) based on the 310 and 350 winds entered.
Regardless of entered winds in the MCDU, it will use the current wind out to 200nm and then the forcast winds thereafter in calculating its predictions. The reason for this is obvious, actual conditions are always more accurate than forecast conditions.
3. You can enter cruise level and cruise temperature anywhere you like, but normally during preflight it's done on the INIT "A" page because that's where it falls in the preflight setup flow. The temperature can be modified in the FUEL PRED page once the engines are started because the INIT pages are no longer available. The cruise level can be selected in the PROG page by either typing it in or selecting it on the FCU. A higher altitude selected on the FCU will be automatically transferred to the PROG page but a lower altitude will not. The PROG page will also not accept a typed in cruise altitude lower than what is selected on the FCU. The autoflight will not enter CRZ ALT unless the PROG page altitude is the same as aircraft altitude.
Hope this helps
Fireleft's answers look OK, only thing that looks out of place is the MCDU wind interpolation.....it will only interpolate between the levels that winds are entered for ie Winds at F330 and F350 entered, cruise at F370 ...it will use 0/0 at F370 for calculations, also the figure on PROG page for OPT alt will be wrong...
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Just For The Record
So let me see if I got this correct.
1. You do not need to cancel the master warning 4 times and hear the fire bell 4 times. The argument here is that the systems as you explained all gets tested when you hear the bell just once and cancel the master warning but the fire bell it self will only get tested for each engine if you hear the bell 4 times. Is this correct. I don’t know where this is written.
2. So if I climb to FL 330 initially and then plan on cruising at FL 350 for 4 hrs on a 10 hr flight is it correct not to insert wind for 350 and if I only insert winds for 330 and 370. The FMGS will interpolate the winds for FL 350.
3. I was told by inserting the temp in the fuel pred page you tell the FMGS that the tepm will remain constant for the rest of the flight. However if you had entered the temp along with the wind then its automatically calculated and that's why you find only dashed lines in the temp column in the fuel pred page during cruise?
Anyone agree?
1. You do not need to cancel the master warning 4 times and hear the fire bell 4 times. The argument here is that the systems as you explained all gets tested when you hear the bell just once and cancel the master warning but the fire bell it self will only get tested for each engine if you hear the bell 4 times. Is this correct. I don’t know where this is written.
2. So if I climb to FL 330 initially and then plan on cruising at FL 350 for 4 hrs on a 10 hr flight is it correct not to insert wind for 350 and if I only insert winds for 330 and 370. The FMGS will interpolate the winds for FL 350.
3. I was told by inserting the temp in the fuel pred page you tell the FMGS that the tepm will remain constant for the rest of the flight. However if you had entered the temp along with the wind then its automatically calculated and that's why you find only dashed lines in the temp column in the fuel pred page during cruise?
Anyone agree?
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145qrh:
Here is the reference for the wind question from the FMGC guide (4.04.20 p6) (sorry about the lousy formatting)
(greater than 30 kt or 30
If the predicted altitude at the waypoint matches an altitude defined in the CRZ WIND page, the
forecast wind is the corresponding entered or propagated wind displayed at that waypoint on the
If the predicted altitude lies between two altitudes entered on the CRZ WIND page, the wind
direction and velocity are linearly interpolated.
Here is the reference for the wind question from the FMGC guide (4.04.20 p6) (sorry about the lousy formatting)
The crew will modify the entered winds and temperatures in flight if a significant difference is expected
(greater than 30 kt or 30
° for the wind data and greater than 5° for the temperature).
The system propagates the pilot (or ACARS) wind and temperature entries downpath, until a waypoint
for which a different temperature or wind has been entered for the same flight level, or until the last
cruise waypoint.
The forecast winds at a waypoint is determined as follows :
–
cruise waypoint.
The forecast winds at a waypoint is determined as follows :
–
If the predicted altitude at the waypoint matches an altitude defined in the CRZ WIND page, the
forecast wind is the corresponding entered or propagated wind displayed at that waypoint on the
CRZ WIND page.
–
–
If the predicted altitude lies between two altitudes entered on the CRZ WIND page, the wind
direction and velocity are linearly interpolated.
–
If the predicted altitude is above or below the set of cruise altitudes, the forecast wind is a constant
value extrapolated from the entered or propagated wind at the highest (or lowest) altitude displayed
value extrapolated from the entered or propagated wind at the highest (or lowest) altitude displayed
on the CRZ WIND page for that point.
My own company SOP's have the crew only entering the wind for the first cruise level (ie 320) and entering the subsequent waypoint wind at the same altitude for the entire flight. Meaning as you progress downroute entering winds you read the winds for, say, 370, but you enter those winds at 320 because that wind will be extrapolated up. You are right in this case by saying the optimum altitude on the PROG page will be inaccurate. The FMGC looks at all the winds at every entered altitude in its optimum altitude calculations and we are denying it that information by entering the winds this way. The counter argument is that the CFP is more accurate anyway and we should fly the altitudes in the flight plan. I don't necessarily agree with that for a number of reasons but there you go.
Sing330
1. You have it right. Cancel the CRC once by pushing the Master Warning, and then check for the rest of the indications for each engine.
2. I wouldn't say it's correct or incorrect to not enter the winds at 350 in this case. Any information fed into the FMGC that is more accurate will increase the accuracy of the predictions...but you don' t have to enter the winds at 350. The system will interpolate them for you between the 330 and 370 winds you have already entered. In many cases your computerized flight plans don't give you the forecast winds at your cleared altitude and you will have to rely on interpolated (or extrapolated) winds calculated by the FMGC. No problem with that at all.
3. Any trip wind entered in the INIT page is disregarded as soon as a specific CLB, CRZ or DES wind is entered. I don't have a specific reference but it makes sense to me that the cruise temp entered in either the INIT pag or FUEL PRED page is treated the same way. Any waypoint specific temperature should null the trip cruise temp. But I could be wrong.
