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KLM lands in typhoon in Hong Kong

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KLM lands in typhoon in Hong Kong

Old 23rd Aug 2017, 05:34
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KLM lands in typhoon in Hong Kong

KLM lands at HKG at 1030 local in the middle of Typhoon Hato, the centre of which was just 50km south at the time.

The only arrival for three hours!

Heroes or Zeros??

SPECI VHHH 230222Z 07043G61KT 1700 1300W R07R/0650D R25L/0500D R07L/0800D R25R/0650D +SHRA FEW012 SCT025 27/25 Q0984 TEMPO 1500 +SHRA FEW008 SCT015CB
METAR VHHH 230230Z 07045G60KT 2200 R07R/0900U R25L/0600U R07L/1100U R25R/0650U +SHRA FEW012 SCT025 27/25 Q0984 TEMPO 1500 +SHRA FEW008 SCT015CB
METAR VHHH 230300Z 09055G72KT 2200 R07R/0700D R25L/0400N R07L/0750D R25R/0400D +SHRA FEW012 SCT022 27/25 Q0983 TEMPO 1500 +SHRA FEW008 SCT015CB
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 05:38
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Might have landed in a lull.
I landed in HKG in a typhoon once, 55kts straight down the strip, and smooth.
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 06:50
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Wind down the runway by the looks of it. On the 21st of January 1993 I landed a 146 at Glasgow in 260/80. The roof came off the Terminal building that night! Michael Fish, the TV weatherman, said "not to worry, there's no hurricane on the way" in answer to a viewers question
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 06:51
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what is the maximum wind speed for door operation? So how are you going to disembark? Or evacuate if necessary? Do the slides still work at 70 kts?
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 07:19
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Its KLM...they are the masters of their art, just ask one of them, the door limit if I'm not mistaken is 60kts (744/777)...which also corresponds to the windspeed every airline Ive worked for considers the airfield closed. I'm thinking the Skipper mustve had ozzie parents.
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 07:46
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Originally Posted by Nightstop View Post
Wind down the runway by the looks of it. On the 21st of January 1993 I landed a 146 at Glasgow in 260/80. The roof came off the Terminal building that night! Michael Fish, the TV weatherman, said "not to worry, there's no hurricane on the way" in answer to a viewers question ��
Nightstop if that was the same hurricane it must have been a real doozy ... because he said that in 1987!
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 07:49
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Errm - Mr Fish's no hurricane announcement was in October 1987 wasn't it ?
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 07:58
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1993 was the 'Braer Storm'....

Lifted from Wiki;
The Braer Storm of January 1993 was the most intense extratropical cyclone ever recorded over the northern Atlantic Ocean. Developing as a weak frontal wave on 8 January 1993, the system moved rapidly northeast. The combination of the absorption of a second low-pressure area to its southeast, a stronger than normal sea surface temperature differential along its path, and the presence of a strong jet stream aloft led to a rapid strengthening of the storm, with its central pressure falling to an estimated 914 hPa (914 mb; 27.0 inHg) on 10 January. Its strength was well predicted by forecasters in the United Kingdom, and warnings were issued before the low initially developed.
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 07:59
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the door limit if I'm not mistaken is 60kts
Aerobridge?
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 08:03
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Yep, Mr Fish made that call in '87. Wonder how many times you've told this story and got away with it?
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 08:09
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Whoops! OK, OK. It was windy though
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 08:12
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Originally Posted by Capn Bloggs View Post
Aerobridge?
Perhaps....but no bags id be guessing....
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 08:17
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we had a second hurricane/storm after 1987 in UK - it was in the January like the above posters state and i think Mr Fish did say dont worry its not another hurricane coming or something like that lol
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 08:25
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but no bags id be guessing....
Oh yea, forgot about that!

Still, for those who carry all their stuff as carry-on, no worries!
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 09:11
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The door limit on a 747 40kts for operation and 65 kts when opened. When in an aerobridge that should not be a problem, unless the bridge itself has a limit lower then that.
Cargo doors might be a thing, but personally I would like to be at my destination without my immediate luggage instead of somewhere else with my bags.

Regarding slides, I am not aware of a hard limit on those, however there are cases in which wind caused a problem with speeds as low as 28kts.
https://flightsafety.org/ccs/ccs_may-june05.pdf
Boeing states modern slides must be able to deploy (and presumably used) in a 25kts wind from any direction.
Aviation Safety: Evolution of Airplane Interiors
It probably comes down to crew opinions of what is an acceptable risk regarding evacuation and slides.
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 09:58
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The problem I found with a 64kt wind was not the landing or take off (within crosswind limits) but the walk around check in-between.
I had to get a very heavy ground crewman to help support and stop me being blown away.
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 10:25
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Originally Posted by Maisk Rotum View Post
Heroes or Zeros??
Neither, I would say just professionals. As falconeasydriver says, KLM are masters of their art (except for that fool at Tenerife in 1977) and I'd trust them to get down safely if they could, and to divert if they couldn't.

I'd like to see a video of that landing though!

This report says at least one other crew tried it (Ethiopian) but diverted.
Only one plane lands in Hong Kong International Airport as Typhoon Hato wreaks havoc with flight schedules
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 11:17
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Originally Posted by OldLurker View Post
Neither, I would say just professionals. As falconeasydriver says, KLM are masters of their art (except for that fool at Tenerife in 1977) and I'd trust them to get down safely if they could, and to divert if they couldn't.
Just out of interest OL, would/could they have done this landing at Kai Tak ?? or was that a whole new ball game back then?
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 11:34
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I expect there are pros here who can answer that – I'm only a humble PPL and SLF, though I've been on the jump seat of a 737 for approach and landing at Kai Tak, and I've sat out a typhoon in HK (on the ground, thankfully). I'd have thought that even if the wind was straight down the runway at Kai Tak (as it seems to have been for this landing at Chek Lap Kok), the wind reflections off the mountains and the buildings would have made it very dangerous either to approach runway 13, or to go around from an approach to 31.
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Old 23rd Aug 2017, 11:45
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Where were Cathay, Dragon Air and other local operators?

If the locals have pulled the pin, there's often a good reason why !!
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