View Poll Results: should british companies be looking to employ more british pilots
YES
64
40.51%
NO
39
24.68%
DON\\\'T CARE
55
34.81%
Voters: 158. This poll is closed
Foreign Pilots, etc.,
Join Date: Sep 1999
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I think we all should be greatfull we have a job at the moment, rather then which nationality has the right to the job.
I'm not saying there may well be extenuating circumstances, such as dual nationality, right of residency, rights by way of marriage, what-have-you.
But when the CAA is actually making it easier for airlines to employ non-EU nationals instead of currently unemployed Brit nationals, many of whom have excellent skills, records and experience, it comes a little hard to be told to be "greatfull" [sic].
Join Date: May 2000
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The CAA had nothing to do with me being employed by a British company(apart from the normal exams etc).
My visa giving me "leave to remain in the UK for an indefinite period" was signed on behalf of the Secretary of State for the Home Office!!!
My visa giving me "leave to remain in the UK for an indefinite period" was signed on behalf of the Secretary of State for the Home Office!!!
Join Date: May 2002
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Deadleg, I am sure the CAA had nothing to do with your case. They have, however, in the past authorised changes to a company's FTL scheme so that those foreign nationals who need to leave the country after a period of 14 days for tax reasons, can do so easily and without disrupting the company's business.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
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TDKmk2 - why I have to be VERY careful how I respond to your question I have no idea, I suppose a very simplistic, broad definition might be along the lines of "pilots living in britain" as opposed to the economic opportunists who breeze in when the going is good.
Captain Stable's point about foreign pilots being allowed to have favourable FTL's to allow them to make a mockery of our tax system is just as bad as flagging out whilst we have guys on the dole here.
P.S. Is there such a thing as an experienced sciolist??
Captain Stable's point about foreign pilots being allowed to have favourable FTL's to allow them to make a mockery of our tax system is just as bad as flagging out whilst we have guys on the dole here.
P.S. Is there such a thing as an experienced sciolist??
Join Date: Apr 2001
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Some thing that strikes me about equality of employees in the EU is that wherever you want to work you need the dreaded NATIONAL license !
so much about equality ... especially in the light of at least 3 postponements of JAR-FCL coming into effect in Germany, Austria, etc.
Regards
MB
so much about equality ... especially in the light of at least 3 postponements of JAR-FCL coming into effect in Germany, Austria, etc.
Regards
MB
pipistrelle:
Surely you must have met several people in the aviation world who speak with "fancied knowledge and little wisdom"? I have met quite a few who have practiced the art of sciolism for years and years and yet still seem to manage to have a long career in aviation going from company to company whilst leaving a trail of devastation behind them!
Surely you must have met several people in the aviation world who speak with "fancied knowledge and little wisdom"? I have met quite a few who have practiced the art of sciolism for years and years and yet still seem to manage to have a long career in aviation going from company to company whilst leaving a trail of devastation behind them!
Join Date: Apr 1999
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This thread is becoming bitter and twisted. To those who have posted from Oz, SA, Canada or USA this isn't a shot at you. But in your home countries there are strict laws governing who is allowed to come in and take up jobs. In most cases they would make it difficult or impossible for a UK citizen to apply for a job as a pilot. What is so wrong about asking for the same kind of rule here??
To those who feel the present situation is unfair, don't bother posting here. You are unlikely to change anyone's point of view. Make the effort to write to your MP or MEP instead.
(House of Commons, London, SW1A 0AA)
To those who feel the present situation is unfair, don't bother posting here. You are unlikely to change anyone's point of view. Make the effort to write to your MP or MEP instead.
(House of Commons, London, SW1A 0AA)
Join Date: Apr 2000
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I agree - NOT a shot at the expats, many of whom have perfectly valid reasons for being in the UK.
If I were to marry a septic, I would qualify to work in the USA. I would then have as valid a reason to be able to work over there. Until then, I suspect that the US Government would not assist me in avoiding work permit or visa requirements.
Time for a level playing field. I have faxed my MP, MEP and Tony Bleagh.
If I were to marry a septic, I would qualify to work in the USA. I would then have as valid a reason to be able to work over there. Until then, I suspect that the US Government would not assist me in avoiding work permit or visa requirements.
Time for a level playing field. I have faxed my MP, MEP and Tony Bleagh.
PPRuNe Handmaiden
Shot one,
Most of the Aussies, Kiwis, Canadians working in the UK are in fact British citizens. If they are not, then they have the right of abode. Other wise, I would hate to think what the immigration is to enter the UK.
If a Brit had the same thing, then they can wander into Oz too.
Immigration isn't impossible into Australia. You would be surprised how quickly it can happen if you have the right skills.
Most of the Aussies, Kiwis, Canadians working in the UK are in fact British citizens. If they are not, then they have the right of abode. Other wise, I would hate to think what the immigration is to enter the UK.
If a Brit had the same thing, then they can wander into Oz too.
Immigration isn't impossible into Australia. You would be surprised how quickly it can happen if you have the right skills.
Join Date: Nov 2001
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foreign pilots
Having done a british frozen ATPL as a german (must have been
drunk the day I decided to do that
),
and speaking three languages fluently,did not help me in any way to get a job.Might be cauz i am newly qualified but if u dont have the flying hours,u dont get any advantage of speaking another language.
I know ,this is about flying and not about langauges!
PS: dont get me wrong boys,I am glad I did the british ATPL .Even it was a pain in the....,but it gives u the best chances!!!
To Studi:
good luck with Lufthansa,hope u get ur chance!
but dont hope too much,I know what I am talking about!
Greetings andi
drunk the day I decided to do that
),and speaking three languages fluently,did not help me in any way to get a job.Might be cauz i am newly qualified but if u dont have the flying hours,u dont get any advantage of speaking another language.
I know ,this is about flying and not about langauges!
PS: dont get me wrong boys,I am glad I did the british ATPL .Even it was a pain in the....,but it gives u the best chances!!!
To Studi:
good luck with Lufthansa,hope u get ur chance!
but dont hope too much,I know what I am talking about!
Greetings andi
Join Date: Nov 2001
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DLR
Hello Studi,
u r absolutely right 2 say that there is nothing to lose if u get
sponsored.I did not go 4 the DLR test cauz got 2 friends flying 4 LH and they r not so happy there at all.
LH was way 2 expensive @ the time I got the invitation 4 DLR test.Have 2 say that this was 3 years ago and now with JAA they had to lower the price 4 the training ,even that they do NOT recognize JAA here.
Was thinking of going through the selection 4 sponsorship 4 weeks ago but an EX flight instructor did not recomend it @ this time.
I mean I got my british frozen ATPL now so I dont care too much,
but I really wish u all the luck to get through.I mean it honestly!
I had a hard time with german LBA to convert my license.Took them the blink of an eye of 8.5 month to tell me what I have to do.lucky me that I did not have a job.
Guess some pilots in UK complaining about CAA there, do not know how lucky they are to get some information on the phone .hard to believe but it is true.
If u need some more info ,let me know.
take care my friend,andi
u r absolutely right 2 say that there is nothing to lose if u get
sponsored.I did not go 4 the DLR test cauz got 2 friends flying 4 LH and they r not so happy there at all.
LH was way 2 expensive @ the time I got the invitation 4 DLR test.Have 2 say that this was 3 years ago and now with JAA they had to lower the price 4 the training ,even that they do NOT recognize JAA here.
Was thinking of going through the selection 4 sponsorship 4 weeks ago but an EX flight instructor did not recomend it @ this time.
I mean I got my british frozen ATPL now so I dont care too much,
but I really wish u all the luck to get through.I mean it honestly!
I had a hard time with german LBA to convert my license.Took them the blink of an eye of 8.5 month to tell me what I have to do.lucky me that I did not have a job.
Guess some pilots in UK complaining about CAA there, do not know how lucky they are to get some information on the phone .hard to believe but it is true.
If u need some more info ,let me know.
take care my friend,andi
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By employing residents of countries other than E.U., even though it is legal,( by virtue of historic family ties from 70- 100 years ago), newly qualified UK pilots are being denied the chance to enter airlines on the bottom rung, to obtain the experience which they need to progress in the industry.
Eventually, things will turn full circle again, with senior pilots retiring, and the middle ranks being promoted, leaving a huge hole to be filled to replace those pilots obtaining promotion. With few exceptions, notably, BA (until post Sept 11), it appears to be a scenario that displays a lack of investment, which has dogged the airline industry for many, many years.
Eventually, things will turn full circle again, with senior pilots retiring, and the middle ranks being promoted, leaving a huge hole to be filled to replace those pilots obtaining promotion. With few exceptions, notably, BA (until post Sept 11), it appears to be a scenario that displays a lack of investment, which has dogged the airline industry for many, many years.
Join Date: May 2002
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For all of those in favour of not hiring non Brits talk to immigration. I have flown here in Canadawith fella's from OZ/NZ/SA/UK/US to name a few, and I work for an outfit with less than 200 pilots.The fact is that they have the right to work here and that is that.
I am a dual Canadian/UK citizen and damn proud of it. My grandfather who is Canadian got his ass shot at for 5 years in WW2 ended up in hospital in Britain where he met my grandmother. They had my dad and moved to Canada. I was given citizenship because my father was born a Brit. Thems the facts.
There are tons of Brits flying here in Canada. Young and old. I have no problem with it. Contracting pilots from over seas is another issue. Head hunting outfits don't care where you are from as long as you have a A3something type rating stamped on your licence.
I am looking forward to finishing my conversion and moving to the UK. It will be nice to meet some new people and share stories over beers. That is what it is all about is it not???
I am a dual Canadian/UK citizen and damn proud of it. My grandfather who is Canadian got his ass shot at for 5 years in WW2 ended up in hospital in Britain where he met my grandmother. They had my dad and moved to Canada. I was given citizenship because my father was born a Brit. Thems the facts.
There are tons of Brits flying here in Canada. Young and old. I have no problem with it. Contracting pilots from over seas is another issue. Head hunting outfits don't care where you are from as long as you have a A3something type rating stamped on your licence.
I am looking forward to finishing my conversion and moving to the UK. It will be nice to meet some new people and share stories over beers. That is what it is all about is it not???
Join Date: Feb 2001
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Tosh
I'm not aussie but trust me when I say I know the place very well.
I did my conversion to aussie ATPL some 5 years ago flying F/O on the 747/400 at the time. As an experienced North of the equator ATPL I only had to take air law, juggling between CAO's and CAR's enough to have you locked into a padded room, a writen IFR test and a flight test. Nothing insurmountable really.
I now proudly flash my Australian ATPL anywhere I go..........and that's about the only satisfaction it ever gave me.
Getting a job there is............well, impossible, more so now with the collapse of Ansett. VB ?? Have a look at the Godzone forum and you'll hear the stampede of the very eager applicants. Better not stand in the way.
I am sorry to say that Europe has much broader views when it comes to foreigners, right of abode excluded and that's a fact. Not all non british pilot's are married to EEC passport holders. They sneaked into the system and that's all there is to it. The reverse once again is close to impossible and frankly I understand why. If given the choice between the 2, Godzone gets my vote.
I'm not aussie but trust me when I say I know the place very well.
I did my conversion to aussie ATPL some 5 years ago flying F/O on the 747/400 at the time. As an experienced North of the equator ATPL I only had to take air law, juggling between CAO's and CAR's enough to have you locked into a padded room, a writen IFR test and a flight test. Nothing insurmountable really.
I now proudly flash my Australian ATPL anywhere I go..........and that's about the only satisfaction it ever gave me.
Getting a job there is............well, impossible, more so now with the collapse of Ansett. VB ?? Have a look at the Godzone forum and you'll hear the stampede of the very eager applicants. Better not stand in the way.
I am sorry to say that Europe has much broader views when it comes to foreigners, right of abode excluded and that's a fact. Not all non british pilot's are married to EEC passport holders. They sneaked into the system and that's all there is to it. The reverse once again is close to impossible and frankly I understand why. If given the choice between the 2, Godzone gets my vote.
