A 380 (Merged)
Join Date: Aug 2005
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Couple of points..
1. Unfortunately the A380 uses Capton insulation aswell, albeit with a secondary cable sheathing underneath. Still makes me shudder to think when I recall the fire damage that arcing Capton can create.
2. The A380 seems to taxi ok to me..got through this lot alright..seriously the taxi issues are completely bogus.
3. Yes it is primarily the cabling thats causing the delays....
1. Unfortunately the A380 uses Capton insulation aswell, albeit with a secondary cable sheathing underneath. Still makes me shudder to think when I recall the fire damage that arcing Capton can create.
2. The A380 seems to taxi ok to me..got through this lot alright..seriously the taxi issues are completely bogus.
3. Yes it is primarily the cabling thats causing the delays....
The (former) West German taxpayers are all paying a hefty extra chunk of money for the restructuring in eastern Germany.
How many more Euros, on average, will come out of their Taschen/pockets to help finance unforecast losses on the A-380 production and sales?
How much more from the French taxpayers?
How many more Euros, on average, will come out of their Taschen/pockets to help finance unforecast losses on the A-380 production and sales?
How much more from the French taxpayers?
Paxing All Over The World
The loans to EADS will have to be repaid and the citizens of Europe may well consider that the loan is worth it. The company provides work for many and holds technical knowledge in the continent, rather than people going to work for the Americans 
. Manufacturing of major capital items is vital to any nation, as the USA plainly recognises when it tries to ensure that major military contracts are placed with US companies.
Please remember,firstly, that every nation on the planet has always been 100% biased in it's own favour!!! And, secondly, that whilst many large countries clamour for 'open markets' the end results are not always balanced.
. Manufacturing of major capital items is vital to any nation, as the USA plainly recognises when it tries to ensure that major military contracts are placed with US companies.Please remember,firstly, that every nation on the planet has always been 100% biased in it's own favour!!! And, secondly, that whilst many large countries clamour for 'open markets' the end results are not always balanced.
the lunatic fringe
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Had the A380 been a Boeing product, BA would have been up at the head of the queue.
I was in the room when Rod Eddington was asked. "Are we going to buy the A380". His answer was that BA were not going to be test pilots for a brand new product. He went on to comment that during his time at Cathay the introduction of another brand new product had been fraught with immense problems. And that he had no desire to revisit that experience. He finished by saying that if the Customer liked the A380, then BA would buy them.
L337
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Originally Posted by L337
More anti BA prejudice. BA has a vast fleet of Airbuses.
I was in the room when Rod Eddington was asked. "Are we going to buy the A380". He finished by saying that if the Customer liked the A380, then BA would buy them.
L337
I was in the room when Rod Eddington was asked. "Are we going to buy the A380". He finished by saying that if the Customer liked the A380, then BA would buy them.
L337
Aviate 1138
PS As for BA's vast fleet of Airbus machines, when Caledonian was incorporated and BA took on their Airbus fleet they didn't exactly give the flight crews much hope. A pal who flew A 320's said he didn't expect to last on them for long as BA Engineering mainly liked Boeing machines as did the top brass.
Not anti BA [mangement mainly] at all but they chop and change like the wind these days.
Paxing All Over The World
barryt Would you rather BA was a bit behind in getting a fancy new a/c - or a long way behind by introducing a machine that takes time, care, attention and money to get right? However smooth the introduction is, the time, effort and £££ for a carrier to be the launch customer is truly massive. There will be delays and cancellations that affect the whole of the fleet and many, many pax. In the long run - that can be highly damaging.
Small and new companies need the publicity of being launch customer and will take the 'hit' of the downside to be the test bed for the manufacturer. OTOH big companies do not want that and will avoid the risk. As I recall, VS stated after being launch for the A340-600, Never Again.
Small and new companies need the publicity of being launch customer and will take the 'hit' of the downside to be the test bed for the manufacturer. OTOH big companies do not want that and will avoid the risk. As I recall, VS stated after being launch for the A340-600, Never Again.
PAXBoy I can understand and appreciate BA's risk management strategy with regard to acquiring the A380, and it makes sense, but there is also a fine balancing act that will be required, because (as I believe), there will come a time when they will need to act, and when (not if, I believe) they do, it will yet still be a trade-off between "problems" and maintaining the economics of their own business - and they will go to the back of the queue when they put in an order, like anyone else (unless they perform special "tricks" ... . If they leave it too long, it will begin costing them dearly, since I believe the uptake on orders for the A380 will only increase, and begin to snowball over the next 2 or 3 years. One argument has always been that there isn't really a market to accomodate enough of them in the air. And it's a valid one. Except it assumes the kinds of pax will remain the same. And the fares will remain roughly the same. I believe a new "thing" is starting, and it's rather subtle. I believe more and more people are going to begin flying (people who perhaps previously couldn't afford to), and the era of "low cost international carriers" is upon us. I really believe there is a subtle change taking place in "pax profile", for want of a better word. And it's going to support the A380. And I believe it will ultimately make the continuing operations of the 747 uneconomical by comparison. Singapore Airlines etc have been quick on the uptake, and in my opinion, very shrewd indeed. They are going to make a "killing" in the future I think....Although all this will take a good few years I though probably, who knows HOW many years, but the whole scenario could be on us a lot quicker than we think, and BA could easily be caught with their "pants down" as it were, so whether they like it or not, it makes good business sense to maintain some kind of tangible hold on putting orders in for the A380....Richard Branson knows what he's doing... But then again, he's always been light-years ahead of BA....
. If they leave it too long, it will begin costing them dearly, since I believe the uptake on orders for the A380 will only increase, and begin to snowball over the next 2 or 3 years. One argument has always been that there isn't really a market to accomodate enough of them in the air. And it's a valid one. Except it assumes the kinds of pax will remain the same. And the fares will remain roughly the same. I believe a new "thing" is starting, and it's rather subtle. I believe more and more people are going to begin flying (people who perhaps previously couldn't afford to), and the era of "low cost international carriers" is upon us. I really believe there is a subtle change taking place in "pax profile", for want of a better word. And it's going to support the A380. And I believe it will ultimately make the continuing operations of the 747 uneconomical by comparison. Singapore Airlines etc have been quick on the uptake, and in my opinion, very shrewd indeed. They are going to make a "killing" in the future I think....Although all this will take a good few years I though probably, who knows HOW many years, but the whole scenario could be on us a lot quicker than we think, and BA could easily be caught with their "pants down" as it were, so whether they like it or not, it makes good business sense to maintain some kind of tangible hold on putting orders in for the A380....Richard Branson knows what he's doing... But then again, he's always been light-years ahead of BA....
Too mean to buy a long personal title
Originally Posted by barryt
One argument has always been that there isn't really a market to accomodate enough of them in the air. And it's a valid one. Except it assumes the kinds of pax will remain the same. And the fares will remain roughly the same. I believe a new "thing" is starting, and it's rather subtle. I believe more and more people are going to begin flying (people who perhaps previously couldn't afford to), and the era of "low cost international carriers" is upon us. I really believe there is a subtle change taking place in "pax profile", for want of a better word.
A380
Globaliser has it right. The A380 only save money when it is full. Chasing empty seats with below cost fares is all of the airlines biggest single problem. Personally I think the premium traffic will avoid the A380. You cannot buy time and people with first class money don't want to waste it while they load the plane.
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I spend most of my life flying longhaul and normally in buisness class, along with a large number of my collegues. To be fair I don't care what a/c I'm on.
My order of requiurements are:
1. Flight times / routing (I want the last leg home to be the long one)
2. Service
3. Anything else
If you take me and my collegues as the type of passenger airlines want (fairly high yield).
1. The last leg home will not be supported by the A380 as I live at an airport which does not have any airlines who have bought the A380 and even if they did it wouldn't support these routes. The last think I want is to sit at FRA for 4 hours after a longhaul flight for only a 2hr flight home.
2. BA service rocks! By far the best buisness class. So even if I can choose which aircraft type I'll be flying on BA no matter what it is.
My order of requiurements are:
1. Flight times / routing (I want the last leg home to be the long one)
2. Service
3. Anything else
If you take me and my collegues as the type of passenger airlines want (fairly high yield).
1. The last leg home will not be supported by the A380 as I live at an airport which does not have any airlines who have bought the A380 and even if they did it wouldn't support these routes. The last think I want is to sit at FRA for 4 hours after a longhaul flight for only a 2hr flight home.
2. BA service rocks! By far the best buisness class. So even if I can choose which aircraft type I'll be flying on BA no matter what it is.
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Originally Posted by theresalwaysone
I heard a little rumour that one airline has pulled out of firm orders because of high fuel consumption concerns on this a/c
Cheers, y'all.
Join Date: Jan 2002
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Hi Mudfoot,
Patience will certainly NEED to be a virtue flying anywhere near any A380.
The time needed to check in, assemble at the gate(s), load all the pax, and then fly to the hub nearest your destination in the slowest airplanes in the skies, not even counting the fact that it might be behind another one, and thereby causing a doubling of the traffic departure, enroute and approach interval, and thats assuming the prior A380 doesn't have to taxi back via the parallel taxiway, which will cause another delay to your landing.
Forget it, "IF it ain't......"
Cheers, FD
Patience will certainly NEED to be a virtue flying anywhere near any A380.
The time needed to check in, assemble at the gate(s), load all the pax, and then fly to the hub nearest your destination in the slowest airplanes in the skies, not even counting the fact that it might be behind another one, and thereby causing a doubling of the traffic departure, enroute and approach interval, and thats assuming the prior A380 doesn't have to taxi back via the parallel taxiway, which will cause another delay to your landing.
Forget it, "IF it ain't......"
Cheers, FD