TUI job losses, Britannia rebranded Thomsonfly
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No hats at all in Britannia these days. Its a real pain, nowhere to keep your ID/ car keys etc etc and a feeling of something missing from under your left arm.
Excuse my cynisism but when something has been tried and abandonned by other organisations, why do Thomsons/TUI then have to try it as well just to make sure it was a bad idea?
Excuse my cynisism but when something has been tried and abandonned by other organisations, why do Thomsons/TUI then have to try it as well just to make sure it was a bad idea?
Torquil Proot
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Heard whisper today that Britannia have ordered 40,000lts of light blue emulsion paint for the aircraft and equipment.
Will only last about a month till it washes off ready for the next re-brand, re-launch, re-discovery, re-whatever next!!!
Will only last about a month till it washes off ready for the next re-brand, re-launch, re-discovery, re-whatever next!!!
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I shall be sorry to see the Britannia name disappear. It has been a highly professional company with an excellent reputation. I have known and worked with many people there over the years and it has always been a pleasure to deal with them. I hope the change of image does not change the team spirit and morale there.
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One thing I'm wondering, is will this not leave an even worse identity crisis? Calling Britannia ThomsonFly will essentially create 2 airlines with the same name. Ie, Britannia Thomsonfly flights will be largely different to the Thomsonfly flights out of CVT. Inflight entertainment, meals and service vary a lot between the 2. Also, the way the fligths are sold is also very different. Britannia flights are sold as part of Thomson Holidays (even if flight only, your contract is still with Thomson and not Britannia). These can be booked through virtually any travel agent, travel website, teletext phone number etc etc. However Thomsonfly are sold direct from one dedicated website with no ATOL bond etc etc.
Hope you get my drift... does this not seem a little strange? or have they got something revolutionary up their sleeve?
Hope you get my drift... does this not seem a little strange? or have they got something revolutionary up their sleeve?
History of recent naff rebrandings in the airline market:
Shall we start with the BA "tailfins of the world" scheme, abandoned half-completed.
Airtours to MyTravel. The less said about this one the better. And did they mean every aircraft to be in a different livery ?
British Midland to BMI. Well all the fare-paying punters still call it British Midland.
Jersey European to British European to Flybe, so indecisively they had all three liveries in the fleet at once for a while !
Caledonian to JMC. A well known and respected name changed for one no one recognised (and the most hideous livery ever). Had to be changed again to Thomas Cook, which got some recognition.
However, Condor (respected) to Thomas Cook in Germany, a fiasco. Had to be changed back.
Britannia, after changing to the second most hideous livery ever, now to Thomsonfly. Oh please !
Shall we start with the BA "tailfins of the world" scheme, abandoned half-completed.
Airtours to MyTravel. The less said about this one the better. And did they mean every aircraft to be in a different livery ?
British Midland to BMI. Well all the fare-paying punters still call it British Midland.
Jersey European to British European to Flybe, so indecisively they had all three liveries in the fleet at once for a while !
Caledonian to JMC. A well known and respected name changed for one no one recognised (and the most hideous livery ever). Had to be changed again to Thomas Cook, which got some recognition.
However, Condor (respected) to Thomas Cook in Germany, a fiasco. Had to be changed back.
Britannia, after changing to the second most hideous livery ever, now to Thomsonfly. Oh please !
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Hmmm!! What a pitty??
I have said for some time now that (TUI) have made a grave mistake in putting most of its resources into Manchester and Gatwick. Airports such as HUY, LBA, LPL, MME etc have all been neglected. Wholes in the market have opened up letting companies such as Easyjet, Ryanair, BMIbaby and now Jet2.com move in.
People want to fly from their local airport and this has been proven time and time again. To the flying public, they don't care about costly resources and line maintainance, or that the UK airport does not meet the Thomson criterior or image. The flying public just want to fly from their local airport.
The LBA charter market has slowly dwindled, flights to LCA, MLA RHO, HER, KGS, GRO, YYZ among others have all been lost, yet multiple flights will be available to the same destinations from Manchester.
The Yorkshire public have voted with their feet and have joined the loco bandwagon. Without a doubt this has paid for the Jet2.com Manchester expansion. If the IT companies will not give the flying public the choice they are left with no alternative but to go loco, even if an IT brand would have been more appropriate.
Get your act togeather TUI or you'll go the same way as MYT.
By the way TUI, you had an advert on my local radio station in LEEDS It was telling us of your wonderful new destinations on offer from our LOCAL airport (an hours drive away) in Doncaster. Hmm!! Think i'll be going loco then?
People want to fly from their local airport and this has been proven time and time again. To the flying public, they don't care about costly resources and line maintainance, or that the UK airport does not meet the Thomson criterior or image. The flying public just want to fly from their local airport.
The LBA charter market has slowly dwindled, flights to LCA, MLA RHO, HER, KGS, GRO, YYZ among others have all been lost, yet multiple flights will be available to the same destinations from Manchester.
The Yorkshire public have voted with their feet and have joined the loco bandwagon. Without a doubt this has paid for the Jet2.com Manchester expansion. If the IT companies will not give the flying public the choice they are left with no alternative but to go loco, even if an IT brand would have been more appropriate.
Get your act togeather TUI or you'll go the same way as MYT.
By the way TUI, you had an advert on my local radio station in LEEDS It was telling us of your wonderful new destinations on offer from our LOCAL airport (an hours drive away) in Doncaster. Hmm!! Think i'll be going loco then?
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Well done silverhawk, back from the pub are we, yes it does smack of sour grapes. Interview practice indeed.
I hope someone feels as enthused to write such a supportive diatribe when your company has issues such as TUI.
Britannia pilots are crew are amongst some of the best in the world, just because they don't say hello in the lift at Concorde House (LGW Admin) doesn't mean they are bad.
Well done for helping this off the rumours and news page where it should really be.
Rant over
I hope someone feels as enthused to write such a supportive diatribe when your company has issues such as TUI.
Britannia pilots are crew are amongst some of the best in the world, just because they don't say hello in the lift at Concorde House (LGW Admin) doesn't mean they are bad.
Well done for helping this off the rumours and news page where it should really be.
Rant over
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Thomson (airline) Thomson flights (booking website) and Thomsonfly (airline), selling Thomsonfly flights, which are now coming under the same roof as Thomson flights booked through Thomsonflights.
All gets very confusing, doesn't it?
But as Leodis says, people want to fly from the local airports, whatever the rebranding consultants come up with, and Thomson fly are very welcome Coventry, at least with the vast (if generally silent) majority of people. Baby will be competition , but only four out of their nine new routes are head-to-head, and still far too many people from the Midlands heading down the M1 to catch their flights, so I'm all for local competition.
All gets very confusing, doesn't it?
But as Leodis says, people want to fly from the local airports, whatever the rebranding consultants come up with, and Thomson fly are very welcome Coventry, at least with the vast (if generally silent) majority of people. Baby will be competition , but only four out of their nine new routes are head-to-head, and still far too many people from the Midlands heading down the M1 to catch their flights, so I'm all for local competition.
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Sorry for this, but Britannia are now owned and run by a German company who obviously do not want to be associated with the original brand name... however successful and professional the Britannia name is. My husband is an engineer for Britannia and is being threatened with a takeover bid by another company (if youre in the business, you know the name of them). With the news of TUI sacking 800 people across the board, the name change is just another kick in the &*^%&( for a very proud and skilled engineer.
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I work for Britannia as cabin crew at a provincial backwater called NCL and I have to say that in terms of service we may as well be a LCC anyway as it stands. The re-brand of the company as TFly rather than "Thomson Flights" may as well have already happened ONBOARD as the pax are already told they're on a Thomson Flight operated by Britannia. It's very sad BY brand has gone forever now though BUT this company is NOT the respected Britannia as such and hasn't been for a long time...I used to work for the world's leading holiday airline - not anymore.
Britannia's 'Rejoiners' this week also heard that nobody was to be given permanent contracts at the end of October...fair enough (even if some of us have done FOUR summers or more!!) BUT the TFly rebrand means that we don't have a cat in hells chance of being asked back to the salary and terms and conditions we currently enjoy - the company will be TFly so we will be asked back...if at all, as TFly crew- underpaid, overworked etc
THERFORE - this rebrand is NOT just a case a respraying the a/c and having a mix of package an scheduled fare pax onboard (e.g. as MYT use MYTLite).
Britannia's 'Rejoiners' this week also heard that nobody was to be given permanent contracts at the end of October...fair enough (even if some of us have done FOUR summers or more!!) BUT the TFly rebrand means that we don't have a cat in hells chance of being asked back to the salary and terms and conditions we currently enjoy - the company will be TFly so we will be asked back...if at all, as TFly crew- underpaid, overworked etc
THERFORE - this rebrand is NOT just a case a respraying the a/c and having a mix of package an scheduled fare pax onboard (e.g. as MYT use MYTLite).
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Is it not the case also that the general public has had enough of "package hell-idays" and they want to be in charge of choosing the accomodation and the LCC they prefer to fly with?
It is therefore my prediction that this whole branch of the industry is at risk of being de-constructed, as the LCCs are slowly winning away all of the 'traditional holiday traffic' as we know it today.
It is therefore my prediction that this whole branch of the industry is at risk of being de-constructed, as the LCCs are slowly winning away all of the 'traditional holiday traffic' as we know it today.
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FH
You are right in that the LCC have impacted the traditional package deals quite significantly. I must admit that I do not think that the package deal is dead however. The 'package hell-idays' you refer to are a small minority of the total number experienced by all tour operators customers. How would a company like Thomson/ Britannia survive and be so successful for 40+ years of operation if they were that bad?
On that note, this is where package deals can fight back (if they choose to, which at the moment they don't appear to want to). Take Joe Public who is booking his holiday with the wife and kids and decides to go lo-co and book his own accommodation, transfers etc etc. What happens if he experiences a hotel that is not quite like the brochure description, his flight is delayed or cancelled or any other host of problems. there is no-one to complain to (who will listen in any way, shape or form!) no company to get a refund from and he will probably have to try to take his hotelier to some sort of small claims court to get a refund. Not easy if they are abroad, probably even harder if it is non-EU. This is just my speculation though and not based on any experience or fact, but it is another way of looking at the market and where it may end up in several years from now. I know not everyone books a 'hotel' but the principle is what I am getting at. Plus the fact that a large number of punters simply want the deal to be handed on a plate to them. So the package deal is far from dead me-thinks.
Certainly, very short haul trips will see customers going lo-co. Further afield and they will tend to want to have something to eat/ drink on the aircraft etc etc. Eventually the extras add up to quite a lot and if the package prices are restructured enough they could remain competetive with the added 'security' a tour operator can provide. This is an area that I think the tour operators don't push enough or advertise aggressively enough.
Perhaps the future of package deals lies further afield out of reach of the low-cost model? I guess a package holiday to Palma in the 1960's was extremely expensive and now it is relatively cheap? Perhaps the package holiday client could go further afield for the cost he used to pay for shorthaul, but there again, perhaps he'll just go back to Palma even more cheaply!
Who knows, but that's just a bit of an idea to balance things up a bit.
I think the positives to take from this move by Thomson/ Brits are
1. That they are responding to market shift.
2. With the flexibility and innovative thinking of the CC a good solution can be found that provides a win, win for the company (as with previous innovations) and the pilots.
3. That I think compulsory redundancies in the airline can be avoided.
The downside is with other parts of the business where jobs will go, such as the Lunn Poly travel agencies, they have my sympathies having been through a restructuring myself and faced the axe.
PP
You are right in that the LCC have impacted the traditional package deals quite significantly. I must admit that I do not think that the package deal is dead however. The 'package hell-idays' you refer to are a small minority of the total number experienced by all tour operators customers. How would a company like Thomson/ Britannia survive and be so successful for 40+ years of operation if they were that bad?
On that note, this is where package deals can fight back (if they choose to, which at the moment they don't appear to want to). Take Joe Public who is booking his holiday with the wife and kids and decides to go lo-co and book his own accommodation, transfers etc etc. What happens if he experiences a hotel that is not quite like the brochure description, his flight is delayed or cancelled or any other host of problems. there is no-one to complain to (who will listen in any way, shape or form!) no company to get a refund from and he will probably have to try to take his hotelier to some sort of small claims court to get a refund. Not easy if they are abroad, probably even harder if it is non-EU. This is just my speculation though and not based on any experience or fact, but it is another way of looking at the market and where it may end up in several years from now. I know not everyone books a 'hotel' but the principle is what I am getting at. Plus the fact that a large number of punters simply want the deal to be handed on a plate to them. So the package deal is far from dead me-thinks.
Certainly, very short haul trips will see customers going lo-co. Further afield and they will tend to want to have something to eat/ drink on the aircraft etc etc. Eventually the extras add up to quite a lot and if the package prices are restructured enough they could remain competetive with the added 'security' a tour operator can provide. This is an area that I think the tour operators don't push enough or advertise aggressively enough.
Perhaps the future of package deals lies further afield out of reach of the low-cost model? I guess a package holiday to Palma in the 1960's was extremely expensive and now it is relatively cheap? Perhaps the package holiday client could go further afield for the cost he used to pay for shorthaul, but there again, perhaps he'll just go back to Palma even more cheaply!
Who knows, but that's just a bit of an idea to balance things up a bit.
I think the positives to take from this move by Thomson/ Brits are
1. That they are responding to market shift.
2. With the flexibility and innovative thinking of the CC a good solution can be found that provides a win, win for the company (as with previous innovations) and the pilots.
3. That I think compulsory redundancies in the airline can be avoided.
The downside is with other parts of the business where jobs will go, such as the Lunn Poly travel agencies, they have my sympathies having been through a restructuring myself and faced the axe.
PP
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If it isn’t broke don’t fix it someone has said…well it is broken.
Forty years ago travelling abroad was not the common or garden practice that it is today. With the popularity of the WWW and the majority of travellers now comfortable with arranging their holidays using the kiddie’s computer, it has transformed the holiday market; Lo-co is now a major growth area. There will always be a need for IT holidays but that is not expanding anywhere near the Lo-co model.
As an airline we are very profitable. We offer one of the best seat cost/mile in the industry if not the best. We have T’s & C’s that IMHO put most other airlines to shame. We have over 90 % of the workforce represented by BALPA. Contrary to some beliefs on this site, this has been good for the company and the workforce. This has been achieved by the partnership approach that the BALPA CC and BY management have adopted. (Something MOL should consider)
Times have changed…we need to change or go the way of the dinosaurs. There are challenging times ahead and change is coming. That doesn’t mean that it’s a bad thing, potentially the complete opposite. There is a lot of hard work ahead, but some very creative minds are at work.
Personally I’m sad that we lost our distinctive livery. I’ll probably find it hard to ditch the old call sign as well…but that’s a lot easier than finding a new job.
EDIT by Boac: Vox, although your response was both understandable and did not contain 'naughty' words
, I have edited it out since it will only provoke the sort of retaliation I do not want on this thread - sorry!
Fair enough Boac. It is after all your BB.
Thanks for understanding Vox - PS Don't tell Danny about the BB - or Senior Meister Pop either, come to that! Me just 'junior Trash'
Forty years ago travelling abroad was not the common or garden practice that it is today. With the popularity of the WWW and the majority of travellers now comfortable with arranging their holidays using the kiddie’s computer, it has transformed the holiday market; Lo-co is now a major growth area. There will always be a need for IT holidays but that is not expanding anywhere near the Lo-co model.
As an airline we are very profitable. We offer one of the best seat cost/mile in the industry if not the best. We have T’s & C’s that IMHO put most other airlines to shame. We have over 90 % of the workforce represented by BALPA. Contrary to some beliefs on this site, this has been good for the company and the workforce. This has been achieved by the partnership approach that the BALPA CC and BY management have adopted. (Something MOL should consider)
Times have changed…we need to change or go the way of the dinosaurs. There are challenging times ahead and change is coming. That doesn’t mean that it’s a bad thing, potentially the complete opposite. There is a lot of hard work ahead, but some very creative minds are at work.
Personally I’m sad that we lost our distinctive livery. I’ll probably find it hard to ditch the old call sign as well…but that’s a lot easier than finding a new job.
EDIT by Boac: Vox, although your response was both understandable and did not contain 'naughty' words
, I have edited it out since it will only provoke the sort of retaliation I do not want on this thread - sorry!Fair enough Boac. It is after all your BB.
Thanks for understanding Vox - PS Don't tell Danny about the BB
- or Senior Meister Pop either, come to that! Me just 'junior Trash'
Last edited by BOAC; 2nd Oct 2004 at 16:23.
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Come on someone, post a picture of an elegantly painted aircraft wearing the truly magnificent Britannia name and tail logo, complete with shield et al, so we can really see what we are missing.
It is sacrilege (?sp) that such a name and brand is being thrown out.
TUI will rue the day.
(Look at Thomas Cook Germany, for example, who had to bring back the visible and reknowned Condor name for the very same reason - i.e. that the public hated the new one and Condor was infinitely more recognisable and gets bums on seats).
TUI will get all they deserve here. Totally way off beam.
It is sacrilege (?sp) that such a name and brand is being thrown out.
TUI will rue the day.
(Look at Thomas Cook Germany, for example, who had to bring back the visible and reknowned Condor name for the very same reason - i.e. that the public hated the new one and Condor was infinitely more recognisable and gets bums on seats).
TUI will get all they deserve here. Totally way off beam.
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Having worked for Thomas Cook airlines UK previously, the reason why it was changed back to Condor was because German public do not know the name Thomas Cook as a highly respectable name/company as us brits know - Condor was more superior to them and more recongised.
However Britannia being changed to Thomsonfly really is a good change although we all know the name Britannia, Thomson is still a very popular and well established name/company in the U.K.
Ian J.
However Britannia being changed to Thomsonfly really is a good change although we all know the name Britannia, Thomson is still a very popular and well established name/company in the U.K.
Ian J.
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If it's a repaint . . .
Rumour has it that British Airways have got the odd tin or two of multi-coloured fin paint that's going cheap.
contact [email protected]
I've never heard the cans actually DO that but hey it does what it says on the can!
Could give a senior exec's wife some business too.
Rumour has it that British Airways have got the odd tin or two of multi-coloured fin paint that's going cheap.
contact [email protected]
I've never heard the cans actually DO that but hey it does what it says on the can!
Could give a senior exec's wife some business too.
Come on someone, post a picture of an elegantly painted aircraft wearing the truly magnificent Britannia name and tail logo, complete with shield et al, so we can really see what we are missing.
http://www.airliners.net/open.file/214996/L/
