Batavia Air
Join Date: Aug 2008
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Batavia Info
Thank you for the info Hogger 60, I´m thinking to join Batavia air, the only information that I have is the salary 2000$ per month (F/O). Do you know something else about screenings, contracts, and how many expats are you there? I´m Spanish and the situation here is absolutelu horrebly! all the Spanish companys are closing....so we have to move where the work is.
Tnank you very much, hopefully will meet in Batavia next month, Alfonso.
Tnank you very much, hopefully will meet in Batavia next month, Alfonso.
Join Date: Nov 2008
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Batavia
The few days I have been around the operation itself, have been relatively problem free. I will continue to post if I seen anything that is extraordinary, either good or bad. Most companies I have worked for have aircraft that carry MEL items. Some are better than others, but since I spent time at Eastern in the days leading up to the strike, I saw more than my fair share of bad mx problems. Routinely we went without apu's, had inop packs, or wx radar, and a slew of other problems. I know what bad mx looks like, having had to deal with it day in and day out during the days of Frank Lorenzo (it still kills me to mention his name, after what he did to a once proud airline).
The biggest problem here (as in many other places), appears to be with the APU's. We had one MEL'ed the other day on one of my observation flights, but the other AC was in good shape for being 15+ years old. Looking through the logbooks, it appears that MEL's are fixed in good time, so while Cruiseclimb's contact may have seen problems in the past (and I do not doubt that, especially if he is on the 737-200 fleet), safety and mx appear to be priorities now.
As I have said before, I will not take an airplane that I consider to be unsafe to fly. I haven't done it in the past under threat of discipline, and I will not do it now. I would rather be without a job than to end up a smoking hole in the ground. And if there is an incident, even if not caused by the MEL item, then it will be my license on the line. Unsafe, I don't take it: no ifs, ands, or buts.
Other than the DGCA license validation process which is extremely slow, everything else has been as promised here. I will try and answer all the pms and any other questions posted here, and give updates as I go.
I have gotten a few PMs about the type of 300/400 we have here. The fleet is split pretty evenly between anolog (with an FMC) and EFIS, with the 400's all being EFIS and at least two of the 300's. The simulator used for the PC's and evals though is anolog, so that will give you an idea of what you will need to know for the eval.
Keep the blue side up,
Hooger
The biggest problem here (as in many other places), appears to be with the APU's. We had one MEL'ed the other day on one of my observation flights, but the other AC was in good shape for being 15+ years old. Looking through the logbooks, it appears that MEL's are fixed in good time, so while Cruiseclimb's contact may have seen problems in the past (and I do not doubt that, especially if he is on the 737-200 fleet), safety and mx appear to be priorities now.
As I have said before, I will not take an airplane that I consider to be unsafe to fly. I haven't done it in the past under threat of discipline, and I will not do it now. I would rather be without a job than to end up a smoking hole in the ground. And if there is an incident, even if not caused by the MEL item, then it will be my license on the line. Unsafe, I don't take it: no ifs, ands, or buts.
Other than the DGCA license validation process which is extremely slow, everything else has been as promised here. I will try and answer all the pms and any other questions posted here, and give updates as I go.
I have gotten a few PMs about the type of 300/400 we have here. The fleet is split pretty evenly between anolog (with an FMC) and EFIS, with the 400's all being EFIS and at least two of the 300's. The simulator used for the PC's and evals though is anolog, so that will give you an idea of what you will need to know for the eval.
Keep the blue side up,
Hooger
Last edited by Hogger60; 17th Oct 2009 at 04:24. Reason: Added information
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There are several foreign pilots there, mainly for the A332s...
Nice duty days... duty and flight hour limits are juuuuust within the rostered sched... bye bye annual limits though.
A332 routes are currently only CGK-MES (regular) and CGK-SUB (irregular)... News from inside have it that they plan it for JED flights, and several domestic trunk routes.
Lion CAE contracts appear to be extremely convoluted after the DGCA found out several "unqualified" persons applying and was accepted by Lion.
I'm not there, but expect a double log book *grin*
Well, ironically, it's the LCC that has done this (Indo Air Asia)... now highest paid pilots in the private airliens... they have no pilot problems (I wonder whyyyy)
That should be phrased as:
"Indonesian gov accepts foreign pilots who does have instructor qualifications, for aircraft and instructor bridging purposes"... Anything beyond that, it's anyone's guess...
Oh, 6 months contracts are no problems with the govt... *grin*
Basic or take home? If take home, that's the lowest in the country, if basic, well, that all depends on the ++...
Is that take home?
Believe me, there are LOTS who'd want to talk about it! *grin*
4k and that's it? Sucks!
Try and say that to Cor Blokzjil in Mandala...
The official answer is I guess, "the only pilots who can work in Indonesia are the ones whose employers are willing to fork money out on them to the **********"
Shucks! $7 an hour? That's what the girls earn at the red squad in terminal 3 in jakarta (after a lower basic pay)...
And >140hrs a month...
I think to use LCC and low pay in the case of this carrier, it's inaccurate... The other 2 "true LCC"s in Indonesia pays more than Batavia!
A friend who recently jumped ships and moved there a couple of months ago... sorry, he's flying >110hrs... reason? Not short of pilots... Don't buy that argument, it's been going on for years at that carrier... they're known for their low pay... shortage? Well, how much are they paying? So the real reason is, "stingy pay". He's busted his max hours ever since he joined... a lot left because they got tired of the maximum hours busting year after year...
Oh, and that DMI???? There's a "envelope price" for certain items on that list for you to fly... *hint hint*...
This is why, expat pilots are also a double edge sword for the carriers... The locals are worked their butts off, the expats are flown to the limit... why? If the expats bust their max hours, someone will talk to a LOT of places...
That's an all tooo familiar story...
Despite ALL the bad stuff I wrote, there is however, hope. Yes, the company is turning around.. or at least try... but, it'll take some time because you really can't cure cancer overnight... The stories from the locals inside differ (as in worse) from what Hogger60 has said... BUT, I'm sure neither are telling outright lies and that the truth are somewhere in the middle...
PK-KAR
Nice duty days... duty and flight hour limits are juuuuust within the rostered sched... bye bye annual limits though.
A332 routes are currently only CGK-MES (regular) and CGK-SUB (irregular)... News from inside have it that they plan it for JED flights, and several domestic trunk routes.
Lion CAE contracts appear to be extremely convoluted after the DGCA found out several "unqualified" persons applying and was accepted by Lion.
Any current pilot flying for Batavia who could give us an insight on the company?
so either they raise all pilots salaries (the preferable option, but for a low cost carrier, this is not going to happen),
"Indonesian Gov not accept pilots who doesn't have Instructor qualification . That's only for bridging type of aircraft."
"Indonesian gov accepts foreign pilots who does have instructor qualifications, for aircraft and instructor bridging purposes"... Anything beyond that, it's anyone's guess...
Oh, 6 months contracts are no problems with the govt... *grin*
$4,000mo for a Captain?
I set my Captain minimum pay at $8500.
I've many friends there who talk about how bad their maintenance are...
4k and that's it? Sucks!
I've a friend from Indonesian DGCA, and he told me, that for protect the local pilots , only pilots who has "instructor qualification" can works in Indonesia.
The official answer is I guess, "the only pilots who can work in Indonesia are the ones whose employers are willing to fork money out on them to the **********"
The basic actually for the local even around 3000 and the flying hours around 7 dollars/hour!!!
6 landing acceptable by the company.
Second - This is an LCC. Think Ryan air, Value Jet (er, Air Tran), Air Asia or Spirit Air. You get what you pay for (and one of the big reasons that the pay for pilots is so low).
Fourth - The pilots are flying close to the max of 110 hrs each month, mostly due to the fact they are short of pilots, which is the reason the company got permission from the Indonesian government to bring in expat pilots in the first place
Oh, and that DMI???? There's a "envelope price" for certain items on that list for you to fly... *hint hint*...
If I find any concerted effort to try and put an unsafe aircraft under my seat, I just will not take it. And if I see a regular problem I will not continue working there, and will let everyone know this.
My friend who left also said he was threatened with his job if he didn't fly an aircraft that had an MEL item that was not fixed. The aircraft was cleared for VFR flight.. so he was told take it or leave. He is still waiting to get paid for a month of work.. Also, he said he was promised his own apartment, but never received it.. I am curious about Batavia as well, but don't want to quit a good job to go to Jakarta and be with a unsafe and bad run company...
Despite ALL the bad stuff I wrote, there is however, hope. Yes, the company is turning around.. or at least try... but, it'll take some time because you really can't cure cancer overnight... The stories from the locals inside differ (as in worse) from what Hogger60 has said... BUT, I'm sure neither are telling outright lies and that the truth are somewhere in the middle...
PK-KAR
Join Date: May 2009
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Metro Batavia
All I could find on Batavia was this gentleman at the training center. Anyone have more info on how to contact please let me know.
HRD Department
PT. Metro Batavia
Jl. Ir. H. Juanda Raya No. 15
Postcode 10120
Central Jakarta
[email protected]
Hope this helps!
Peter
HRD Department
PT. Metro Batavia
Jl. Ir. H. Juanda Raya No. 15
Postcode 10120
Central Jakarta
[email protected]
Hope this helps!
Peter
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copy of contract
for those who're joining the company, i suggest that it would be a good .."safe" practice .. to carry an extra copy of your contract to show it to the management pilot who asked you to fly a defective airplane. Just like you carry your licence.
don't mind those story guys .. it's all up to us to decide !
don't mind those story guys .. it's all up to us to decide !
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affirm..
PK-KAR,....
Thanks for complete answer..
Just wanna make smaaalllllllllllll correction here...
Cor Blokzijl as a DFO in mandala, he doesn't has permission to fly and teach in mandala.
Just act as a DFO
Thanks,
Manflex 69
Thanks for complete answer..
Just wanna make smaaalllllllllllll correction here...
Cor Blokzijl as a DFO in mandala, he doesn't has permission to fly and teach in mandala.
Just act as a DFO
Thanks,
Manflex 69
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Just heard back from Billi in HR. I guess they've had an overwelming response to their hiring, and plan to stop taking applications soon. They are touring the states this weekend, starting in Miami at a hiring conference. They supposedly have more than enough resumes to choose from, with most of the applicants typed in the 737 and lots of time in them. If you haven't gotten your CV and application in, get it there soon.
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The Scoop
Just a little inside scoop on whats going on at Batavia. I have a feeling there will be others posting more detailed horror stories here soon.
First of all communicating with Batavia is like pulling teeth, huge language barrier and almost zero information comes out of Jakarta.
Currently there is a group of Captains and F/O's sitting in Jakarta waiting for license conversion. Most have been waiting for up to 6 weeks. There seems to be allot of politics coming out of the Indonesian DGCA towards expat license conversion. All logbooks and previous flying history will be scrutinized to the max. You better have no errors in your log books, all log books have to be stamped and certified by your previous employers. You will also need letter from previous employers certifying your time.
Many have been asked a whole array of ludicrous requirements to verify previous employments., such as provide ID cards from previous jobs....
As of Yet NO expat have been granted a license conversion
You are expected to pay the full airfare to Jakarta by yourself and you will NOT be reimbursed if you don't pass the PC check upon arrival.
.
Housing is in semi furnished small apartments with DOUBLE occupancy, yes you have to share a small apartment. Very professional
And now to the pay, 2000$ USD for F/O's and 4000$ USD for Captains.
They expect you to fly up to 110 hours a month.
Do your homework on safety history of the airline, and what you are getting in to.
Is it worth getting violated, or be a smoking hole in the ground, for this third world working conditions?.
First of all communicating with Batavia is like pulling teeth, huge language barrier and almost zero information comes out of Jakarta.
Currently there is a group of Captains and F/O's sitting in Jakarta waiting for license conversion. Most have been waiting for up to 6 weeks. There seems to be allot of politics coming out of the Indonesian DGCA towards expat license conversion. All logbooks and previous flying history will be scrutinized to the max. You better have no errors in your log books, all log books have to be stamped and certified by your previous employers. You will also need letter from previous employers certifying your time.
Many have been asked a whole array of ludicrous requirements to verify previous employments., such as provide ID cards from previous jobs....
As of Yet NO expat have been granted a license conversion
You are expected to pay the full airfare to Jakarta by yourself and you will NOT be reimbursed if you don't pass the PC check upon arrival.
.Housing is in semi furnished small apartments with DOUBLE occupancy, yes you have to share a small apartment. Very professional
And now to the pay, 2000$ USD for F/O's and 4000$ USD for Captains.
They expect you to fly up to 110 hours a month.
Do your homework on safety history of the airline, and what you are getting in to.
Is it worth getting violated, or be a smoking hole in the ground, for this third world working conditions?.
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batavia
Guys....
Please don't expect too much about batavia.
For those who wants to have a job desperately , it's okay to join Batavia, but you've to prepared for the risk.
But please read the contract carefully guys.....
Good luck....
Manf 69
Please don't expect too much about batavia.
For those who wants to have a job desperately , it's okay to join Batavia, but you've to prepared for the risk.
But please read the contract carefully guys.....
Good luck....
Manf 69
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Batavia Air
Bisnis Indonesia
Jakarta – Transportation Department cancels its plan to propose four carriers to be lifted from EU blacklist next November 2009 due to the consideration that these carriers may have small chance to pass the audit.
These carriers include PT Lion Mentari Airlines (Lion Air), PT Indonesia AirAsia, PT Metro Batavia (Batavia Air), and charter airlines Travira Air. “We have not decided to propose the audit for these four airlines in November or January. Most probably not this November” said Director General of Civil Aviation Herry Bakti S. Gumay.
He added that this cancellation caused by the lack of confidence from the airlines to undergone audit by EU.
Jakarta – Transportation Department cancels its plan to propose four carriers to be lifted from EU blacklist next November 2009 due to the consideration that these carriers may have small chance to pass the audit.
These carriers include PT Lion Mentari Airlines (Lion Air), PT Indonesia AirAsia, PT Metro Batavia (Batavia Air), and charter airlines Travira Air. “We have not decided to propose the audit for these four airlines in November or January. Most probably not this November” said Director General of Civil Aviation Herry Bakti S. Gumay.
He added that this cancellation caused by the lack of confidence from the airlines to undergone audit by EU.
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For first officer position (foreigner) on 737 do they require a minimum hours on type or will they accept a 737 type rating on a simulator. What is the minimum total hours they want before considering F/O position for foreign pilots and is there age limits through hiring firms like Eagle Jet. Friend of mine with 340 hours and 737 type rating was hoping to be placed by Eagle Jet in an Asian airline to undergo 500 hours RH seat but was told that max age was 40 for such pilots. He is 42.
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Anyone knows how long time the assessment will take? Do you have to wait there until the licence conversation has been done or can you just do the assessment and go back to your homecountry and wait?
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Latest
Latest on the constant changing terms at this outfit.
Travel for interview will only be reimbursed at 50% if you pass the DGCA test.
Salary will only be half pay while you wait for DGCA license conversion, some are still waiting now for over 8 weeks. That means 2000$ for Capt and 1000$ for F/O`s pr month.
You have to also share a small apartment with another pilot.
Wonder whats next, work for free. Clean the lavs?....
Travel for interview will only be reimbursed at 50% if you pass the DGCA test.
Salary will only be half pay while you wait for DGCA license conversion, some are still waiting now for over 8 weeks. That means 2000$ for Capt and 1000$ for F/O`s pr month.
You have to also share a small apartment with another pilot.
Wonder whats next, work for free. Clean the lavs?....
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Skycruiser1. Do you work for Batavia? I do and there is nobody here waiting 8 weeks for license convertion. The first Expat here waited 5 weeks and is doing line training at this time.
The age limit Batavia wants for its crews is max 50 years old. For FO they want B-737 Type with minimum 300 hours in B-737 with no determination as far as Total Time.
Cheers
The age limit Batavia wants for its crews is max 50 years old. For FO they want B-737 Type with minimum 300 hours in B-737 with no determination as far as Total Time.
Cheers