Shenzhen Airlines
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Michigan
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
WASINc Is A joke
dont believe a word that that tell you, it will all change when you get there.. they say you will get pay for your air-fare it might happen 2-3 weeks later. I promise you wont get it when you go for you interview.
If you would like to know more about WASINC, email me at [email protected]
If you would like to know more about WASINC, email me at [email protected]
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Chicago
Posts: 11
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Don't believe the flamethrowers
I'm brand new to this board, but glad to see it has its requisite share of anonymous flame throwers. I am specifically referring to those who have bashed WASINC in this thread.
I recently went through screeing with Shenzhen (WASINC) and I, and the other candidates, all felt WASINC did a fine job putting everything together. Anyone who had a problem with the screening actually became a victim of some portion of the screening (ATPL written, medical), none of which can be blamed on the recruiter.
As to the specific complaint of one about expense reimbursement, all of us received our reimbursement at the end of the week. No problems.
If you're looking into flying in Shenzhen, look at all options...including WASINC.
I recently went through screeing with Shenzhen (WASINC) and I, and the other candidates, all felt WASINC did a fine job putting everything together. Anyone who had a problem with the screening actually became a victim of some portion of the screening (ATPL written, medical), none of which can be blamed on the recruiter.
As to the specific complaint of one about expense reimbursement, all of us received our reimbursement at the end of the week. No problems.
If you're looking into flying in Shenzhen, look at all options...including WASINC.
Join Date: May 2009
Location: BFE
Age: 41
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have to agree with Juniorslm!
While Wasinc does a good job of saying the right things that need to be said in recruiting pilots, it lacks the power to do anything with these Chinese company's.
Find a Kunpeng pilot, and ask him or her, what they think of Wasinc!
You will hear a very sad story about horrible schedules, pilots paying for travel for the company saying they will be reimbursed, flying on tourist visa's, and multiple pay problems... and last but not least the contract you sign will not be worth the paper its written on. This may not be Wasinc fault, but the contract you sign is with them not Shenzhen Airlines...
Call me bitter!...
While Wasinc does a good job of saying the right things that need to be said in recruiting pilots, it lacks the power to do anything with these Chinese company's.
Find a Kunpeng pilot, and ask him or her, what they think of Wasinc!
You will hear a very sad story about horrible schedules, pilots paying for travel for the company saying they will be reimbursed, flying on tourist visa's, and multiple pay problems... and last but not least the contract you sign will not be worth the paper its written on. This may not be Wasinc fault, but the contract you sign is with them not Shenzhen Airlines...
Call me bitter!...
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi all...
Looking for some recruitment contact details for Shenzhen Air, I am non type-rated, 1400 hr frozen ATPL looking for an FO gig. I know its slow at the moment, but also know that this airline has some big plans which will hopefully be requiring a ramp up in hiring over the next 12 months. (Or maybe i'm completely wrong). Am in Singapore at the moment and can hop up to China, should it make my ground work a little easier. PMs welcomed!
Thanks for your help
Looking for some recruitment contact details for Shenzhen Air, I am non type-rated, 1400 hr frozen ATPL looking for an FO gig. I know its slow at the moment, but also know that this airline has some big plans which will hopefully be requiring a ramp up in hiring over the next 12 months. (Or maybe i'm completely wrong). Am in Singapore at the moment and can hop up to China, should it make my ground work a little easier. PMs welcomed!
Thanks for your help
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: USA-China
Age: 57
Posts: 207
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi Gay... No pun intended 
As far as I know the only FO jobs in CN might be on RJ's if any. And being non-typed you might want to look somewhere else.
And please if someone has diff info, share with us as I have a few buddies on the same status. Meanwhile my company keeps on hiring Captains like there's no tomorrow! We are paid exactly a per the contract and treated 100 times better that any Major US Airline I worked in the past...
Use Direct Personnel or Rishworth!!! Good luck...
As far as I know the only FO jobs in CN might be on RJ's if any. And being non-typed you might want to look somewhere else.
And please if someone has diff info, share with us as I have a few buddies on the same status. Meanwhile my company keeps on hiring Captains like there's no tomorrow! We are paid exactly a per the contract and treated 100 times better that any Major US Airline I worked in the past...
Use Direct Personnel or Rishworth!!! Good luck...
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I currently am flying for them. Here is my take:
Screening takes about 2 weeks (or so, maybe less).
Medical exam:
The Chinese, smoke, drink and dont eat healthy; you on the other hand are going to be put through a screening that is like nothing you've ever seen before....why give them any reasons to fail your medical. They will flagg anything and most of the time, it's for no good reason.
CAAC ATP EXAM
This will be like a PC but can be with multiple failures. The chinese like them and will be looking at your CRM skills as well as your ability to fly and diagnose. This is not easy ! be prepared ! if you have no glass cockpit time, you can purchase some when you get here. The cost is what you'd pay in the USA.
Here is an example: you dont like something (with good reason), and you voice your opinion (without them asking you for it). On your next PC you fail ! You ask yourself (and the instructor) what the Fuc* did I fail for? The next day you are looking for a new job. (for this to happen you have to be a serious jerk or have a huge mouth. It's not the norm but it does happen).
The Chinese think that they are the best pilots in the world. No advice you have will be good enough for them....so, just fly, go home, fly, go home...collect a paycheck. Get my point?
FYI, this airline also fines you $$$ for when you do something wrong. Anything that is not SOP and you get caught ie. QAR tells on you or you screw something up, you will get into trouble. The cost depends on the infraction. They have a menu of infractions and cost that your recruiter can show you...if they have them. (this kind of punishment is not good but so far, there is nothing that we can do about it).
Having a job is the objective (at least for me). The culture is different and so is the way the Airline does business. If your a proud pilot and think your too good to be a "contract pilot" then stay home. All of us here have had, to some degree, learn that this is not the West. This place is humbling and you'll soon realize that your not at home anymore. ie. If your one of those pilots that has a big stick up your..you know what...pull it out and leave it at home. This is Asia and they do things differently !
This country is 30 years behind the USA in aviation theory and practice. That goes from the ATC system right down to CRM and the way you are treated!
Lastly I like to add something about WASINC and other head hunters. There are many posts that say good thing and bad things. I even have some of my own opinions but, remember what they (headhunters) are here for. They connect you with a job and get $$ each month that you stay.
The contract that you agree to is black and white..read it! After that, you'll still run into issues when you get over here; that is a fact. SO, realize who pays the bills for WASINC (and others). They can not manipulate your contract after you realize that something is screwed up. ...and there will be things that are screwed up.
Shenzhen Airlines runs the show and tells them what they will agree to on your contract.
Thats all I can think of right now..and my hand hurts. I hope this helps, good luck.
PS..this is based on my opinions and observations. I am not interested in any debates. Take this info or leave it... I dont care. Anyway, I do hope that it helps and that everyone can find jobs.
Screening takes about 2 weeks (or so, maybe less).
Medical exam:
- EKG while running (actually its not running, it's walking fast.) on a treadmill. You will be sweating at the end of this test even if you are in decent shape. They are stressing your heart. You'll run in pants (what ever you have on) and socks...no shoes. As time goes by the treadmill inclines.
- Blood work (check kidney functions and for cholesterol..please no comments on my poor spelling)
- Brain scann...I'm not kidding!
- Check reflexes and bone structure (squats and look at you in your underwear, check hands).
- Eyes (if you wear contacts or glasses...no problem just make sure you bring them..bringing a prescription will only confuse the doctors)
- Hearing test
- Ultrasound your kidneys and look for gallstones (this is the one that seems to be tricky....if you have them, you fail and need to get them removed...if you have small ones or just a slight chance of having them later....you'll need to remove them).
The Chinese, smoke, drink and dont eat healthy; you on the other hand are going to be put through a screening that is like nothing you've ever seen before....why give them any reasons to fail your medical. They will flagg anything and most of the time, it's for no good reason.
CAAC ATP EXAM
- Study. There will be 10-20 questions that dont make ANY sense and will be in half Chineese and half in the worst english you've ever seen. I had to quess at them.
- Study the USA ATP Written...It has 100 questions from that.
- You'll take your Test in Guangzhou. There will be a company van that picks you up and returns you to the beautiful Sunway hotel (hope you like a hard..hard bed; did I mention that the beds were hard?).
- If you fail...you can retake the test but you will pay for it yourself..I forget how much it costs but it's not expensive; something like $8.00 US (dont hold me to that). Small price to pay for a job!
This will be like a PC but can be with multiple failures. The chinese like them and will be looking at your CRM skills as well as your ability to fly and diagnose. This is not easy ! be prepared ! if you have no glass cockpit time, you can purchase some when you get here. The cost is what you'd pay in the USA.
- Your F/O will be another Captain canidate in your group. If your company does anthing other than Boeing or Airbus procedures then you'll have fun...just use good CRM with eachother. Thats the one thing that foreign pilots do well on here. They dont expect you to know Shenzhen Airlines procedures.
- 2 hours or so per person.
- They dont like hard landings in the sim (landing hard on line can mean a fine...read below on fines).
- When you have an engine fire or failure, dont go strait out for miles. Ask for a turn ASAP and start heading in the right direction.
- I had an engine fire. I was relaxed and handled the problem but the instuctor didnt understand why I didnt make a 180 and land. The fire went out so I didnt bother....still, the next time, I'll do a 180 and land even if it is out.
- Get ready for crappy vectors: you be on a 90deg headingto the LOC and they will say "call established on the LOC". In the USA that translates to "you are cleared for the approach, turn to what ever heading you like and fly it". Flying the line is like that too.
- They expect you to be lightning fast with everything..dont let them rush you. To them the faster you are the better a pilot you are; we know better than that. But, dont be too slow.
- If you do something contrary to the QRH, have a good reason.
- I can almost guarantee that you will have a fuel leak.
- Hyd and slat and flap failures.
- You will always be landing in a crosswind!
- Dont fly fast...you'll learn that on line as well.
Here is an example: you dont like something (with good reason), and you voice your opinion (without them asking you for it). On your next PC you fail ! You ask yourself (and the instructor) what the Fuc* did I fail for? The next day you are looking for a new job. (for this to happen you have to be a serious jerk or have a huge mouth. It's not the norm but it does happen).
The Chinese think that they are the best pilots in the world. No advice you have will be good enough for them....so, just fly, go home, fly, go home...collect a paycheck. Get my point?
FYI, this airline also fines you $$$ for when you do something wrong. Anything that is not SOP and you get caught ie. QAR tells on you or you screw something up, you will get into trouble. The cost depends on the infraction. They have a menu of infractions and cost that your recruiter can show you...if they have them. (this kind of punishment is not good but so far, there is nothing that we can do about it).
Having a job is the objective (at least for me). The culture is different and so is the way the Airline does business. If your a proud pilot and think your too good to be a "contract pilot" then stay home. All of us here have had, to some degree, learn that this is not the West. This place is humbling and you'll soon realize that your not at home anymore. ie. If your one of those pilots that has a big stick up your..you know what...pull it out and leave it at home. This is Asia and they do things differently !
This country is 30 years behind the USA in aviation theory and practice. That goes from the ATC system right down to CRM and the way you are treated!
Lastly I like to add something about WASINC and other head hunters. There are many posts that say good thing and bad things. I even have some of my own opinions but, remember what they (headhunters) are here for. They connect you with a job and get $$ each month that you stay.
The contract that you agree to is black and white..read it! After that, you'll still run into issues when you get over here; that is a fact. SO, realize who pays the bills for WASINC (and others). They can not manipulate your contract after you realize that something is screwed up. ...and there will be things that are screwed up.
Shenzhen Airlines runs the show and tells them what they will agree to on your contract.
Thats all I can think of right now..and my hand hurts. I hope this helps, good luck.
PS..this is based on my opinions and observations. I am not interested in any debates. Take this info or leave it... I dont care. Anyway, I do hope that it helps and that everyone can find jobs.
Last edited by clrblu22; 16th May 2009 at 08:30.
Chinese = Arab
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Doha
Posts: 227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
clrblu22,
Hi, I have a few quick questions for you since you seem to be the man in the know.
Are the 8000RMB you mention included in the $11,750 USD per month quoted in WASInc web page?
Are the 11,750 assuming you fly 90 hours each month? If so what is the basic pay, say when you are on leave abroad?
It also mentions discounts at Intl school for pilot...how much? %-wise?
Potential savings per month for a DEC on the A320 fleet, with a wife and a soon to be 2 year old with no debts in home country?
Many thanks,
OW
Hi, I have a few quick questions for you since you seem to be the man in the know.
Are the 8000RMB you mention included in the $11,750 USD per month quoted in WASInc web page?
Are the 11,750 assuming you fly 90 hours each month? If so what is the basic pay, say when you are on leave abroad?
It also mentions discounts at Intl school for pilot...how much? %-wise?
Potential savings per month for a DEC on the A320 fleet, with a wife and a soon to be 2 year old with no debts in home country?
Many thanks,
OW
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's not that I am in the Know.....This is a serious move for anyone comming here; especially with a family. I just know how important information is...I had the time, so I put some out there. Believe me, I'm not special 
Anyway, here is the response to your questions.
Are the 8000RMB you mention included in the $11,750 USD per month quoted in WASInc web page? Yes
Are the 11,750 assuming you fly 90 hours each month? If so what is the basic pay, say when you are on leave abroad? No, you will recieve the same paycheck every month regardless of how many hours you fly....unless you get fined of course (rare but does happen to some).
It also mentions discounts at Intl school for pilot...how much? %-wise? The discounts at the international school (not schools) is at QSI...it in an "UNOFFICIAL" 20% off which will still run you about $12,000/year/Child. This is a serious amount of money especially if you have more than one child.
Potential savings per month for a DEC on the A320 fleet, with a wife and a soon to be 2 year old with no debts in home country? I dont understand your question. Your paycheck is minus all taxes....so your take is NET.
Hope this helps...I'll be off line for then next couple of weeks....talk to everyone then.
Anyway, here is the response to your questions.
Are the 8000RMB you mention included in the $11,750 USD per month quoted in WASInc web page? Yes
Are the 11,750 assuming you fly 90 hours each month? If so what is the basic pay, say when you are on leave abroad? No, you will recieve the same paycheck every month regardless of how many hours you fly....unless you get fined of course (rare but does happen to some).
It also mentions discounts at Intl school for pilot...how much? %-wise? The discounts at the international school (not schools) is at QSI...it in an "UNOFFICIAL" 20% off which will still run you about $12,000/year/Child. This is a serious amount of money especially if you have more than one child.
Potential savings per month for a DEC on the A320 fleet, with a wife and a soon to be 2 year old with no debts in home country? I dont understand your question. Your paycheck is minus all taxes....so your take is NET.
Hope this helps...I'll be off line for then next couple of weeks....talk to everyone then.
Last edited by clrblu22; 18th May 2009 at 02:54.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Doha
Posts: 227
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That was quick! Thanks for the information, very useful indeed.
What I meant was:
What can a Direct Entry Captain (married with a 2 year old), expect to save after rent, utilities, food, entertainment, transport, education, etc, etc.?
Basically trying to figure out Cost of living in Shenzhen and therefore potential savings....Thanks again!
Best regards,
OW
What I meant was:
What can a Direct Entry Captain (married with a 2 year old), expect to save after rent, utilities, food, entertainment, transport, education, etc, etc.?
Basically trying to figure out Cost of living in Shenzhen and therefore potential savings....Thanks again!
Best regards,
OW
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That was quick! Thanks for the information, very useful indeed.
What I meant was:
What can a Direct Entry Captain (married with a 2 year old), expect to save after rent, utilities, food, entertainment, transport, education, etc, etc.?
Rent- Expect to pay US Prices..I pay $1500 for a 4 Bedroom in the best part of town.
Food- Is twice the cost of USA food if it is shipped over...vegies and local products are chap.
Entertainment- your quess is as good as mine.....
Transportation- buying a car here is double what it costs in the USA. So, we take taxies.....about $4/5 miles.
Education- covered that....look at some of my other posts.
Utilities- I pay about $300-350/ month for water, gas and electric.
We live in Shekou on the water....the best place in Shenzhen so if your able to eat Chinese food and live in a chinese home...you'll save more money. My family does not eat Chinese food and I will not EVER live in a chinese home; my place is a mix of Chinese and European. It's the best here.
What I meant was:
What can a Direct Entry Captain (married with a 2 year old), expect to save after rent, utilities, food, entertainment, transport, education, etc, etc.?
Rent- Expect to pay US Prices..I pay $1500 for a 4 Bedroom in the best part of town.
Food- Is twice the cost of USA food if it is shipped over...vegies and local products are chap.
Entertainment- your quess is as good as mine.....
Transportation- buying a car here is double what it costs in the USA. So, we take taxies.....about $4/5 miles.
Education- covered that....look at some of my other posts.
Utilities- I pay about $300-350/ month for water, gas and electric.
We live in Shekou on the water....the best place in Shenzhen so if your able to eat Chinese food and live in a chinese home...you'll save more money. My family does not eat Chinese food and I will not EVER live in a chinese home; my place is a mix of Chinese and European. It's the best here.
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: USA-China
Age: 57
Posts: 207
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
clrblu22,
Excellent synopsis (sp?), crap mixing my eng w/ cn! Great points and VERY similar to my experience as I do work for a different airline here in China for the past 6 months and LOVE it. I can NOT compare to how it was at my major US airline because I would not know on were to start. Here you are treated like a REAL professional!
Yes, China is VERY different but if you can adjust, you'll love it. Here we do not get fined and we do get OT pay for over 80hrs, but no more hiring of expat pilots... Sry. And BTW, Deer Air it is...
Good luck to all!
Excellent synopsis (sp?), crap mixing my eng w/ cn! Great points and VERY similar to my experience as I do work for a different airline here in China for the past 6 months and LOVE it. I can NOT compare to how it was at my major US airline because I would not know on were to start. Here you are treated like a REAL professional!
Yes, China is VERY different but if you can adjust, you'll love it. Here we do not get fined and we do get OT pay for over 80hrs, but no more hiring of expat pilots... Sry. And BTW, Deer Air it is...
Good luck to all!
Join Date: May 2003
Location: KGRB, but on the road about 1/2 the time.
Age: 61
Posts: 622
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi!
The Chinese can NOT be the best pilots, because I am THE Best Pilot, and I am AMERICAN. WE ARE THE BEST!!! Well...maybe not in Health Care-I think we are #34, or #43, or something like that, which is ALMOST #1!
My buddy flies for Shenzhen, and loves it, loves living in Shenzhen, and loves China. He is a CRJ capt and -190 FO.
He said that you CAN get hired in China without a type rating, but you have to be there and walk into the right situation.
It is the same here (I am working in NBO). If you are overseas you have to have a type rating and time in type. If you are here, it is sometimes a different story, depending...
Good luck!
cliff
NBO
PS-If I had the type rating(s), I would applying in China RIGHT NOW!!!
The Chinese can NOT be the best pilots, because I am THE Best Pilot, and I am AMERICAN. WE ARE THE BEST!!! Well...maybe not in Health Care-I think we are #34, or #43, or something like that, which is ALMOST #1!
My buddy flies for Shenzhen, and loves it, loves living in Shenzhen, and loves China. He is a CRJ capt and -190 FO.
He said that you CAN get hired in China without a type rating, but you have to be there and walk into the right situation.
It is the same here (I am working in NBO). If you are overseas you have to have a type rating and time in type. If you are here, it is sometimes a different story, depending...
Good luck!
cliff
NBO
PS-If I had the type rating(s), I would applying in China RIGHT NOW!!!
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You can not get into the 737 or the A320 without a Type and 300-500 hours PIC. The CRJ/ERJ's are a differnt story.
It's true you can like it here with the proper attitude adjustments
I'd also like to add something about Shenzhen Airlines touting promises of overtime. Dont be fooled; you may see one month of some then never see it for the rest of the year. They will work you to the limit then shut you down....
Look at the regulations here and you'll see. If they fly you to the limit (and they do) overtime is a rare thing and shouldnt be counted. Always sounds better than it really is.
It's true you can like it here with the proper attitude adjustments
I'd also like to add something about Shenzhen Airlines touting promises of overtime. Dont be fooled; you may see one month of some then never see it for the rest of the year. They will work you to the limit then shut you down....
Look at the regulations here and you'll see. If they fly you to the limit (and they do) overtime is a rare thing and shouldnt be counted. Always sounds better than it really is.
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: USA-China
Age: 57
Posts: 207
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
As clrblu22 said, for the 320 and the 37's ALL must be typed and current, and PIC of 500+
That sucks about OT. Here we are all getting 5-10 hrs of OT every month and being paid for it... Even when we take our 2 weeks off we get some OT as they put them at the end of one month and at the beginning of the next one... Also we are being told that they might hire some more expat captains, as they have hired some from the bankrupted East Star.
How do you like Shenzhen? I have use UR tng center and stayed at the Sunway hotel... nice...
Good luck...
That sucks about OT. Here we are all getting 5-10 hrs of OT every month and being paid for it... Even when we take our 2 weeks off we get some OT as they put them at the end of one month and at the beginning of the next one... Also we are being told that they might hire some more expat captains, as they have hired some from the bankrupted East Star.
How do you like Shenzhen? I have use UR tng center and stayed at the Sunway hotel... nice...
Good luck...
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: WA
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
First kick at the can. Thanks for the info guys! JotaJota where are you based with Deer. Any info about your job conditions would be greatly appreciated. i.e. days on/off, duty times, layovers, housing costs, health care, child care,schools and expat community,okay for wife and kid? I am currently employed but thinking of taking a LOA for a 2 year contract for the experience.