CRM Start and finish
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CRM Start and finish
I apologise in advance If this sounds a little stupid.....
When does CRM start and finish? or does it?
I would imagine all the time your with your crew, from entering the airport, on stop over until you finish your duty?
Many thanks in advance
Carbon
When does CRM start and finish? or does it?
I would imagine all the time your with your crew, from entering the airport, on stop over until you finish your duty?
Many thanks in advance
Carbon
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CRM works in every aspect of life, with wives/husbands (have you ever noticed that in a relatinship sometime one is the PF and the other PNF and sometimes is the opposite? it is a matter of the subject you are involved in!)
anyway it works for a lot of other jobs, expecially where a teamwork is required and also -this is my opinion- discussing with yourself about something you cannot say to anyone else....sit down and think, thinking about most important CRM principles and you will see you will find an answer...maybe only an unbalance between your reptile brain (your primordial emotions) and your cortex and main brain (that mitigate emotion and adapt them to true life)
that's why CRM can never stop, it is always evolving as, except from the basic principles, I think that it is a continuos evolution to find perfect (crew) communication and be able to cope also with people you really don't like at the very first beginnig. A sort of compromise, someone could think, a sort of safety and survival is my definition
Skunkie
anyway it works for a lot of other jobs, expecially where a teamwork is required and also -this is my opinion- discussing with yourself about something you cannot say to anyone else....sit down and think, thinking about most important CRM principles and you will see you will find an answer...maybe only an unbalance between your reptile brain (your primordial emotions) and your cortex and main brain (that mitigate emotion and adapt them to true life)
that's why CRM can never stop, it is always evolving as, except from the basic principles, I think that it is a continuos evolution to find perfect (crew) communication and be able to cope also with people you really don't like at the very first beginnig. A sort of compromise, someone could think, a sort of safety and survival is my definition
Skunkie
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The trick with wife CRM is that you try to remain being the PF, while you let her think she's the PF. Works a treat. She's happy, you're happy. 
Just watch out she doesn't do the same thing back to you though
Just watch out she doesn't do the same thing back to you though
Originally Posted by Non Normal
The trick with wife CRM is that you try to remain being the PF, while you let her think she's the PF. Works a treat. She's happy, you're happy.
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Originally Posted by AerocatS2A
The real trick is to let her be PF all the time while you remain the PiC.
Be the PiC AND PF
Originally Posted by Non Normal
But she might drop you in it! So many accidents happen...
Be the PiC AND PF
Be the PiC AND PF
Christ, I hope she doesn't read this.
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I've been flying for 7 years with my boyfriend, that now is my husband (me as a cabin crew, him as a captain... )
as long as i'm crm instructor flights went on very good (at least what passengers and other crew could se....we have a subliminal language to understand each other without involving others)
the nightmares were the night stops spent discussing abuot what I did wrong and what he did well (good example of crm...
)
now i'm not flying anymore and we still discuss often about these themes at home expecially after some troubled flight or training...at home he's PF (didn't realized yet is not exactly like this buth we both satisfied
) but I'm very glad to see that many inputs I give him on our domestic flights are applied by him on flight and explained to copilots who find the matter interesting......feel quite proud...maybe I hit the goal!
cheers
)as long as i'm crm instructor flights went on very good (at least what passengers and other crew could se....we have a subliminal language to understand each other without involving others)
the nightmares were the night stops spent discussing abuot what I did wrong and what he did well (good example of crm...
)now i'm not flying anymore and we still discuss often about these themes at home expecially after some troubled flight or training...at home he's PF (didn't realized yet is not exactly like this buth we both satisfied
) but I'm very glad to see that many inputs I give him on our domestic flights are applied by him on flight and explained to copilots who find the matter interesting......feel quite proud...maybe I hit the goal!cheers
Funniest thing I ever saw was husband and wife team undergoing a 737 type rating together in the sim. Taxiing out toward the runway, wife left seat, husband right seat. Husband does full control check including full aileron reversal at same time as full back stick. The control wheel horn clobbers the wife's right boob on the way through provoking a sharp retort of "Getting a bit initimate again, are we". Later the husband is attempting an NDB approach as PF and making a hash of it. Wife turns to the instructor (me) and says "His flying sucks, doesn't it?"
On another occasion, colleague instructing a really very attractive young lady in the 737 simulator. Like some well known tennis players she was a "squealer grunter" and when coping with engine failures on take off she vocalised if you know what I mean. My colleague was quite turned on by this and as he admitted later "just had to give her a few more engine failures."
On another occasion, colleague instructing a really very attractive young lady in the 737 simulator. Like some well known tennis players she was a "squealer grunter" and when coping with engine failures on take off she vocalised if you know what I mean. My colleague was quite turned on by this and as he admitted later "just had to give her a few more engine failures."
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CRM started in the 80s and won't finish until someone bucks up and realises it has done nothing for the accident rate and that it's a huge waste of time and money.
It's a stark thought, but not without foundation in statistical fact. The accident rate (or rather, rates, as we should take account of the appalling figures for the few first generation jet transports still flying - which are now significantly more risky than they were when new) shows no improvement over the time that CRM training has been introduced.
The things that worry me about 'CRM' are that a great deal of what passes for CRM 'training' is the worst kind of nonsense delivered by people with no knowledge of the subject, and that the genuine ingredients which make up a competent pilot have been forgotten about, and with that, we've forgotten to teach new pilots some of the important stuff that they need to know and be able to do....
Another stark thought: What is CRM? If you can't answer that in one simple sentence, then how can you possibly build a syllabus from it?
It's a stark thought, but not without foundation in statistical fact. The accident rate (or rather, rates, as we should take account of the appalling figures for the few first generation jet transports still flying - which are now significantly more risky than they were when new) shows no improvement over the time that CRM training has been introduced.
The things that worry me about 'CRM' are that a great deal of what passes for CRM 'training' is the worst kind of nonsense delivered by people with no knowledge of the subject, and that the genuine ingredients which make up a competent pilot have been forgotten about, and with that, we've forgotten to teach new pilots some of the important stuff that they need to know and be able to do....
Another stark thought: What is CRM? If you can't answer that in one simple sentence, then how can you possibly build a syllabus from it?
Last edited by Kit d'Rection KG; 6th Apr 2006 at 13:01.
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Originally Posted by Kit d'Rection KG
CRM started in the 80s and won't finish until someone bucks up and realises it has done nothing for the accident rate and that it's a huge waste of time and money.
It's a stark thought, but not without foundation in statistical fact. The accident rate (or rather, rates, as we should take account of the appalling figures for the few first generation jet transports still flying - which are now significantly more risky than they were when new) shows no improvement over the time that CRM training has been introduced.
It's a stark thought, but not without foundation in statistical fact. The accident rate (or rather, rates, as we should take account of the appalling figures for the few first generation jet transports still flying - which are now significantly more risky than they were when new) shows no improvement over the time that CRM training has been introduced.
